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 Post subject: No miracles here....
PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 8:10 pm 
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After five years on oxy, and now three months on sub, I find
That increasing sub from normal 8 mg leads to total delerium,
And mood is just flat to negative. Combine that with memory loss
Malaise (I can do things but do not get enthused to do them nor feel
Gratified by engaging) tired all the time and such (low testosterone confirmed)
I am hoping that the misery I feel now is the key to stopping the bupe.
My fear is being angry by stopping, but I'd gladly cry or be mad for awhile
To get my blood chemistry back to par, then be able to laugh once in awhile.
I won't throw stones, but just feel this has all the negative opiate affects with
No good, ie euphoria. Why bother?

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'If you can't trade a cry for a good laugh, then opiates will rule your life forever'. -me
This is the reason I am ready to walk uphill for a finite infinity, in search of myself at the end of the marathon.


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 Post subject: Not a Happy Camper
PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:09 pm 
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Hey DC,

There are so many things in your post than concerns me. I understand the malaise and lack of enthusiasm, it is a side effect we hear about every so often here. But it was this one at the end that got me:

" I won't throw stones, but just feel this has all the negative opiate affects with
No good, ie euphoria. Why bother?"


Wow! What exactly do you expect Suboxone to do for you? Not getting you high is a good thing and is meant to act that way. Why bother? If you feel that way, why do you stay on it? You could be out there scoring some good oxy's and ruining your life and possibly dying. But at least you'll get a buzz on them. Do you not understand the main reason for Suboxone? I'm sure you do but your post sounded so negative it concerned me. And maybe I'm a little tired and read into wrong. So please excuse me if I got it all backwards.

Maybe a taper plan would be best for you. Are you ready to be rid of all opiates? You sound like you're ready to do this! Go for it!

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 Post subject: Not a happy camper
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:06 pm 
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Reply to moderator.....

Yes. I think I Am tired and ready, and praying to find my old self
(not permanently damaged) I absolutely took a wrong turn when I started
Giving my life to such a demonic substance.

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'If you can't trade a cry for a good laugh, then opiates will rule your life forever'. -me
This is the reason I am ready to walk uphill for a finite infinity, in search of myself at the end of the marathon.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 2:33 pm 
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Which substance is "Demonic", the Suboxone or the Oxycodone?

Either way I am glad you are ready to make a change. Only good can come from it. But if you are so angry at being prescribed Suboxone to stop taking Oxy's, what other method of change would you have preferred?

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 Post subject: Re: No miracles here....
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 3:31 pm 
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Donechasing wrote:
Why bother?


Survival.


Donechasing-

I hear you on the side effects, I had some of the ones you mentioned as well. But for a lot of us, the side effects are nothing compared to the state of our lives pre-suboxone. It's easy to forget the contrast as time passes, I've done it too. Just know that oxy use only escalates and who knows where you would have been without the last 3 years of steady maintenance. Try and look at the positive in this situation and I wish you the best going forward. Staying clean off maintenance is hard work and no less depressing than the side effects of suboxone, at times.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 6:50 pm 
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And by three years of maintenance, I really meant three months. =)


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 Post subject: demonic substances
PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 2:56 am 
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All opiates are demonic..........or at least, can be, like an assault rifle, really........

Yes they have their place in terminal patients, to make them comfortable while still here, what is the harm in that?

But, when used the wrong way, like most of us on this forum can attest we have done, they replace the bodies natural reward system and hotwire/jump out the reward center in general. Hmmm..... I was involved in a criminal charge while suffering dope sickness from shortage of oxy. Now I had hijacked my reward center to (pleasure first, then perhaps work, or maybe not, then figure out what I had done or not done and get moody about it, confusion, and hunger for something) instead of (find something rewarding to do, complete the challenge, feel good about what I've done, and repeat).

So take that initial "get good" phase out, and suddenly without longterm repair of the whole process, the brain enters (WTF, I hurt and nothing is going to make it better except more drug, do "whatever it takes" to shut this pain down, then think about what I did and whether or not it was good/bad/indifferent) I say this is why some fall to robbery-at-gunpoint pharmacies, theft to get money and pay on the street for the black market equivalents, and so on. Criminals become criminals from normal law-abiding citizens, mostly from conditioning, not from some genetic code or birth right.

I am glad I didn't do anything worse, and that my addiction hadn't progressed so far that by heightened tolerance, I had somehow lost the bar reflex that has always kept me grounded to safe dosing. My arrest and conviction has forced me to deal with my problem, embarassing and humiliating as it may always be, that is the truth. If it is what was necessary to keep my health and life and therefore my wife a husband, my son a father, and right the ship before my son sees my examples as o.k., then I'm o.k. with it. Sure I'll always wish I hadn't done it, but I learned from it.

Some don't get afforded that chance, and either die from overdose, or degrading health, or by suicidal ideation and execution because they became so miserable by their vice that they lost it all, and saw no other solution to their issues.

So, that all being said, I don't think if God created the poppy, which I'm certain he did, that he wanted us to use it as a method of self-destruction. And, I bet that he has pondered his creation a few times seeing the pain and suffering it has dealt both directly, and indirectly to those afflicted.

This addiction thing is hard for me to see as disease, although I wholeheartedly accept that mental disorder does stem from it.

If it is a disease, looking at sheer statistical numbers and trends of use/misuse and associated accidental deaths, then we have a pure plague on our hands.

Nope, addiction is adapted/adaptive behavior, nothing more, like Pavlov's dog. We get that taste, over and over, and adapt to a new behavior pattern. The only difference in a chronic pain patient that takes his dose by the book, or gets it via pain pump (great new invention by the way) that has become either by choice or circumstance "dependent", and the "addict" who resorts to crime to feed his "dependency", is that drug use cessation in both causes dope sickness. In the case of the pain patient, who, like me, can become an "addict", he gets the dopesickness, wonders what the Hell caused it, being unsure and virgin to process just thinks "I got the flu and it will pass" and gets better over time. The "addict" has been down the road of detox before, knows another dose will fix it, and throws morals out the window to obtain if the normal channels won't provide it. It's got little to do with syringes, snorting, crushing, defeating time-release mechanisms, etc... A normal person who loses air flow into their lungs would likely break the governing laws if the situation presented itself, to maintain his life. And knowing the power of a high level dependency, the feelings of harsh withdrawal from an opiate, a person will resort to similar "reaction" to avoid perceived death as well. So a dependent is just a detox cycle and mitigation away from becoming an addict, in my view.

The terms addict and dependent are jargon conceived and engineered by doctors and big pharm to legalize distribution through "controls" and allow themselves to feel good about their judgment on who gets what. Useless rhetorical b.s. in my book.
Mental disorder has arguably transpired in both the dependent, and the addict, it just hasn't had the conditions necessary to rear its ugly head in the naive "dependent".



And now you know..........the REST OF THE STORY! GOODDAY!

_________________
'If you can't trade a cry for a good laugh, then opiates will rule your life forever'. -me
This is the reason I am ready to walk uphill for a finite infinity, in search of myself at the end of the marathon.


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 Post subject: oops........
PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 3:07 am 
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meant to say the commonality betwen the dependent and addict is cessation of drug will cause sickness, getting tired and "foggy"

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'If you can't trade a cry for a good laugh, then opiates will rule your life forever'. -me
This is the reason I am ready to walk uphill for a finite infinity, in search of myself at the end of the marathon.


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