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 Post subject: im a mess need advice
PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 12:00 pm 
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hello everyone! im having a real hard time getting of the subs and need help bad! alright, ive been on subs since january 2009 following a hydrocodone/percocet/oxycontin habit,but mostly hydrocodones 10/325's. started at 16mg of sub but went right down to 8mg because i was nodding out, it was too much. i decided to taper myself down after a year in treatment because i lost my health insurance and could not afford to stay on it. i did try cold turkey off 8mg but that did not go well at all as you all probably know. so i begged and borrowed to get money to stay in treatment long enough to slow taper, and as of may, this year ,managed to get down to 4mg daily somewhat comfortably, but it was not easy for me! then in june, i went down to 2mg and then my doctor got sick and i could not get anymore scripts!! :shock: so i had 1/2 my script of 2mg tablets left and tapered way down to .25 in july then jumped off on july 29th .im really struggling and dont know what to do? i have taken pain pills again here and there to get through work and i may be withdrawing from them too. i am so worn out from this past year i just dont know what to do anymore. i cannot afford sub treatment or i would get back on them, its not just the office visits and cost of the meds but my doctor also wants toxis(understandably) and they cost $400 each time!! im ready to break and lose everything i have got. i have to work and i have to take care of the kids so its not an option to go to the er and be admitted to the psych ward, but thats where i feel i should be right now! please any hope, advice or experience would be great right now!


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 1:36 pm 
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Hi stardust and welcome to the forum. I'm sorry you're having such a hard time. It stinks that you were put in a position where you didn't have time to taper properly. I'm still taking sub, so I don't have personal experience to offer. I have read that exercise helps tremendously during withdrawals though. Maybe at the least you could squeeze in a fast walk once or twice a day? Could you possibly go to your regular doctor to get some "comfort" meds (clonodine, etc.)? That might be worth the effort for you. So am I correct in thinking that you've been off now for almost 2 weeks? You might be nearing the end (if you're not there already) of the acute phase of w/d.

I'm sure others will weigh in with their taper and/or w/d experience. I just wanted to offer my support. Hang in there and let us know how you're doing.

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2010 6:53 pm 
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Hey Stardust I'm so sorry to hear about the situation that you currently find yourself in. Opiate dependence sucks and sometimes the disease can make life so many more times difficult than it should have to be. I did want to see if you've looked into your options for getting medical care? Depending on which state you live in (all states have different Medicare programs, rules, eligibility, etc) you should think about finding out if you're eligible. Many states help pay for Suboxone treatment. After the healthcare bill passed earlier this month there are also other options you could pursue for example when the bill was signed into law there was a special "high risk" pool that was created for those of us with pre existing conditions who cannot get or afford individual health coverage. The cost of being covered in the "high risk" pool really is fairly reasonable the only requirement is that you have to have been denied healthcare because of a pre existing condition (as opiate dependance is considered) and you have to have been without insurance for at least 6 months. There are also a couple of other options for example if you're still in school many universities offer group insurance policies which are fairly inexpensive and will still cover people with pre existing conditions. There's a newly setup website that was setup after the healthcare bill passed to help people explore healthcare options it's www.healthcare.gov or something like that if all else fails you could at least do a google search.

Try and hang in there and I'm glad that you trust us all enough here that you feel comfortable coming to us with problems. I hope you can let us know if you find any solutions

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 10:49 am 
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ive tried almost everything to get help and i guess at this point i might as well stay off the subs. its the chance of relapse that scares me and im already thinking about opiates again. its harder to quit than cigarettes!!! while the subs numbed me out alittle at least i could take away this constant craving. it sucks that i got myself into this, wish i never picked up a pill, but of course hindsight is always 20/20>ive been in some frustrating sitiuations before but this outweighs any burden ive ever had to bear. sorry for the hopelessness its just how i feel. the only way to go is to wait until i relapse and lose everything again and maybe then i can get medicaid. sure the subs would of worked if i had a treatment plan, a good doctor and counseling and took it properly but it didnt happen that way so ive screwed myself. if someone is in drug treatment and betters their life and starts earning some money, they shouldnt be able to pull the rug out from under a person and cut their health insurance. back to the painful beginning for me, but thanks everyone, i deeply feel for anyone addicted to opiates it is such a difficult addiction.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 1:06 pm 
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Stardust I certainly understand where you're coming from but I'm hoping you can still see that literally any scenario would be better than a potential relapse. At the beginning of this year my parents health insurance dropped me (even though 3 different representatives there all told me that I would not be kicked off until I turned 25) even though I was totally unprepared as I thought I still had another 9 months of coverage. Now just some quick backround info I'm still in school and as such I'm currently around $70,000.00 in the hole just from student loans. I work as much as I'm currently allowed (literally 39.9 hours a week lol) as working more than that would require me being given benefits. This semester I'll be taking 18hours of classes as I have done for the majority of my 5 years here. I've managed to get a bachelor's degree in western history but now I have two semesters left until I graduate from the education program here so I can eventually teach secondary ed (middle school and up). Now I mention all this just to say that I'm broke.....as broke as broke can be. I realized however that it was unlikely I'd stay clean without continuing on Suboxone though so after looking into ALL other options (medicaid in Indiana will not cover young men without children/family) I realized I would just have to find a way. My doctor was willing to prescribe generic Subutex instead of Suboxone and that lone saved me an average of $75.00 a month and because I have no insurance my doctor only charges $50.00 every two months that I see him. So all and all I'm paying about $150.00 per month including medication and the bi-monthly dr's appointments. There have been times I've had to ask for a little help from my family and girlfriend but luckily they understand and support me staying on Suboxone (even if my girlfriend doesn't believe opiate addiction is a disease but that's another story lol).

The main thing that has allowed me to pay for the medication though is that I quit smoking. I didn't want to even quit this time and I really didn't think it would be possible but the fact of the matter is if I was somehow able to come up with the money for a pack of cigarettes a day I thought surely I could afford a pill that costs a little less 1 8mg generic Subutex for about $4.50 a day. I'm able to pay my rent and not starve and every once in a great while my girlfriend and I can even afford to go see a movie or go to a mid range level resturaunt. The point I'm making is that even though I thought it was impossible I sacrificed (to the benefit of my health even) something I didn't want to give up and used the money I was using on cigarettes to pay for my Suboxone/generic Subutex. I'm not saying that things will work exactly the same for you but I am saying that even a poor person like me is able to afford the medication. Now I certainly don't believe our current healthcare system is without the need of major reform but I have still been able to make things work.

Many of you that know me should know by now that I'm a major proponent of socialized healthcare and it does continue to baffle me how individuals try to demonize socialized healthcare or pretend that such programs are too expensive to be afforded when the vast majority (literally every other modern democratic state in the world other than the United States) of modern democratic states can provide universal healthcare that is not only affordable but also supported by the majority of their populace for several decades now. If socialized healthcare was so terrible I seriously doubt that the majority of voters would continue to support and elect candidates and office holders who support universal care in places like the United Kingdom, Japan, Germany, Taiwan, France, Canada, and yes even little third world communist states like Cuba can support such programs. Anywho I'm sorry for getting up on a soap box that was not my point I just wanted to let you know that I really think if I could stay on Suboxone with such a limited income nearly anyone can.

I look forward to hearing back from you please try and keep your head up and I hope that at least knowing that you're not alone is of some comfort.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 3:32 am 
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yes blame the cigarettes, everyone else does!!! actually i live near an indian reservation and i buy their native brand for $13.00 a carton, so i spend $52 a month and i have tried quitting numerous times,but always start back up! i am not ready for that at this point in time. i have made the decision to try and stay off suboxone and try to get into counseling or a support group. i called the suboxone support line for help and it didnt help me at all, it was so fake, its says call a care coach today if you need support, and all he did was want to sign me up for emails-whatever. is everyone in this world reading cue cards cuz it sure seems that way? sorry for the anger, i havent slept in weeks!!! :twisted:


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 Post subject: my sub treatment cost
PostPosted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 3:59 am 
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the suboxone treatment will cost me about $800 a month because my doctor hands me a slip for a toxicology every month also and that is $300-400 depending on the lab. problem is ive used every lab within 50 miles and havent paid them and cant continue to do that. we make $2000 a month for a family of four in new york state, the only thing we qualify for is child health plus for the kids and wic. i have struggled to pay for treatment out of pocket for a year now. there is only one other doctor in my area and i would need about the same amount of money so i guess im going to have to be strong and pray i can stay clean without the subs. now i dont know how much you make but im living pretty shabby myself, still you have to make less than $1400 a month to be considered poverty and qualify for medicaid. im just on that border. when i had my minimum wage job i got medicaid, food stamps ,got to see a dentist. then i got a few more dollars an hour at a better job and now i cant get anything!! i could kick myself for taking the better job and thats not what a person should feel like when they accomplish something. i hope they figure out this healthcare thing soon, but imo,things are going to get real bad before they get better, thats partly why i want to get off all medication so i dont end up screwed at the apocalypse!!! haha!! okay that thought right there is my final push to be done with this!


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 12:01 pm 
Hi Stardust, sorry for what you're going through. I stopped Sub ct from an ave. of 4mg/day on August 6. Suboxone has an extremely long half life (36 hours or more), so it literally takes 9 days or more to totally leave the body. It's very different from ct off of full agonists, which leave the body in 24 hours and have an intense but relatively short withdrawal period. The point I'm trying to make is that the worst may be almost over for you. You said you're a mess, but can you tell me exactly what you're experiencing physically? I started an antidepressant before I quit the Sub which I think is really helping me. Unfortunately, any opiate, including Sub, supresses our natural "feel good" neurotransmitters, so it makes sense that we might need a little help in that area. I'm mentionning AD's because at one point you said you felt hopeless. I know you don't want to be on any meds, but you might want to consider it in the short term.

The other huge issue, of course, is the drug cravings. I'm glad you're enlisting some help in that area. I'm so beaten down by my addiction and have been through so many relapses that I'm not experiencing cravings right now, but I know they're always around the next corner.

I guess I just wanted to offer my support and let you know you're not the only one going through this. Feel free to PM me if you want. In the meantime, take good care of yourself. Treat yourself like you would if you had any other kind of illness, like the flu. In the meantime stick close to the people you've enlisted to help you stay of the drugs. I wish you the best.
Lilly


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