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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 11:58 am 
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Can someone help me? I have been off suboxone for 6 days now and a few of my w/d's are fading except these two.........When I wake up in the morning my anxiety is sky high. Kind of like a panic attack..........not that I am sleeping that great but I can hardly get breakfast for my kids. Now, when I was on Suboxone around 5 or 6pm I would have major depression. If I would relap that would be the time because I can just lay in bed and cry. So my doc did start me on
well butrin and that helped a little bit but the pit in my stomach at that time of day is unbearable. It is like grief or something?? Or guilt??? Does anyone have this at all? If so, what do you do??? I do have 3 children so I am a bit restrictive.........I have tried multiply times to get outside with the kids and play hard or walk hard but it doesn't help.

Thank you so much! I would love to hear someone else might be having the same feelings!!!!


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 1:20 pm 
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Hi Lakegirl, and Welcome!

It sounds like a part of the withdrawal effects. Depression is a large subject here when tapering and stopping Sub. I get it too but it sounds like you are having a bit too much to handle.

When is your next Dr.'s appt? Discuss this and maybe an adjustment in your Wellbutrin is necessary. I am no doctor but you shouldn't be feeling that anxious and having that much depression. It can be controlled until you stabilize and can taper down from the AD if you need to.

Do you have a Care Coach or someone to call? Take some steps to get treatment, it just doesn't sound right.


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 3:56 pm 
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Hi lakegirl,

About what dose of Suboxone did you come off of?? Were you on a pretty high dose of Suboxone when you quit?

I know I had severe bouts of anxiety when I quit Suboxone, the episodes were pretty short lived, but they were wicked strong. Depression after coming off of Suboxone is fairly common, it's common after quitting any opiate. It's gonna take your brain a while to correct these things. In my case, the anxiety faded on its own, but the depression hung around to the point where I got on Wellbutrin too.

Rule62 brings up a good point, you may want to ask your doctor for a dose increase of the Wellbutrin??

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 6:39 pm 
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Thank you so much for replying to me! A quick background: I started the suboxone program May of 2010 and just took my last one (.5 mg) last Wednesday. My doctor, who I really liked, started me at 16 mgs for 2 months then he would cut the dosage in half about every two months hence: 16, 8, 4, 2, 1, .5 Every single day (and he knew it) I would get a horrible sad feeling around 5 or 6pm and what was coincedental was it was always time a doseage and within one hour that would take it away and I was fine for the rest of the evening. EXCEPT the lower the dosage the more dramatic my sadness got until it was all day long crying! I had been on 20mg of Citalapram for 6 years right before the birth of my second child. I was in the best shape possible when I got pregnant but a year before that I had heart palps and diagnosed anxiety. I started exercising and everything healthy and had our second child. During that pregnancy my dad died in a car accident and I really toughed it out until the day I had my son. I had a planned C-section and was given oxy for the pain. WOW:)
I even talked them into another script even though I hadnt finished them. Get this I slowly spaced 60 of this pills out in 6 months! Then I thought why can't I feel like this all the time. So I found them..........friends, friends of friends, and finally the internet. BUT I still was very cautious and would only buy 90 every 3 months. Then I got pregnant with our third baby and hardly took any................but yep as soon as he was born I was back to one or two a day. After 2 years of this I had legitamit pain: my left hip was impinged and I needed a full replacement at 42 years old!!! it took a year though to find out what kind of sugery to have so that was a year of endless vicodin........then surgery.........a ton of oxys and I thought
ok now I will get off this completely and forever be done. Yeah, right............I started crying so hard, and I was so depressed, and I could not take care of my kids that I finally confessed to my husband and he got me to ER and they got my to a Detox center and I started the Suboxone program.

So I am on 300 mgs of Well Butrin and 40 mgs of Citalapram.................and I have ADD so I am on 60mgs of Vyvance.
Then I started with Restless Leg Syndrome the last month of Suboxone and am on Requip (sp). So that is my history.
I can take all the withdrawals the headache bodyaches neausea diareah sweat beads on my forhead and sweaty neck.....sneezing and even the fatigue. But this sadness at 5pm is horrible...........I have had it before the Suboxone when I was weaning off opiates on my own. So, I am praying this is a withdrawal that will get better because I don't want
my family to hurt because of this!!!!! I will never touch another puke pill in my life. All the 12 step programs where are live are far and few between because I live in the country and none of them are a time I can go. We run our own business 24/7 (a resort) and I can't just get up and leave my kids when I want. Anyhow it is starting again and I feel like crying.........I know there is something called sundowning but I am still hoping this is W/D's.??? Any thoughts.........

Oh, the other problem is now that I finished my Suboxone program I do not see that Dr. and more I have to go to my regular pyschiatrist that I went to for citalapram and vyvance........I would just love to hear if someone had this at this time of day and it went away after a couple months???? Thank you so much!!!!!!


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 8:01 pm 
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It starting to get very bad again. there is no reason I should feel like this and why is so deep and hurts at this time of night? It is even a little later today but I could just crawl in bed and cry! I can't I just can't my daughter is 14 and we are really close and I know the few times that I let it really go it breaks my heart to see her think Im crazy!!!!!!!? And my boys need baths and need to practice reading. What is wrong with me??????????HELP!!!!!

The only good sign I have is that my days have improved so much like 80% better. This night stuff is unreal.......it will get better usually around 9 but now that I am off suboxone I am in bed. I use to stay up late and get housework done while watching a movie but now I am right in bed soooooooooooo tired.

Anyone get this sad at one point in the day after Suboxone........again I am on day 6th completely free and clean. I had 4 1/2 major days of all the other really crappy w/d's and I still get a sweaty hot flash or burning face feeling.

Please help???


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 8:36 am 
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YES, Lakegirl..I too was affected like this. My depression wasn't as bad as yours though. Mine was more like a "What did I do to myself?" type of thing. My anxiety was OFF THE CHAIN! I wanted to die. I promise you Lakegirl...it will STOP. Do not go back to the drugs. The things that helped me the most were....1. A good doctor. My doctor is an addictionoloist who has a multidisciplinary team who works with him. You gotta find someone who has a PERSONAL interest in addiction, not someone who just wants to make money. He put me on Buspar, and it helped a lot. He also had me consult with his social worker and she and my doctor made it very clear to me that if I felt like I wanted to use, then call the office..No matter what time it was. 2. A therapy group. Somewhere to go talk, and get out of the house. 3. Staying active doing positive things (ie walking, running, swimming, zoomba, yoga).

I was on 6 vics a day for neck pain. When I tried to stop I was STUCK. Couldn't come off due to the WD. I checked myself into rehab when I realized my body had become dependent on the drug. Stayed there for 10 days, was discharged with anxiety out of this world. The pills/suboxone is NOT the answer though. Work through it. Support is the BEST thing you can have right now. I promise you the anxiety WILL GO AWAY. Good luck to you and your family. Take it one day at a time.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:22 am 
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Thanks for filling us in on everything Lakegirl.

When I quit Suboxone, I didn't experience any crushing depression, but when I quit Lorcet (Vicoden) years and years ago, I would get the most awful, crushing depression ever. It was absolutely the worst around supper time every night. I remember sitting at the table, waiting for my wife to come and sit down to eat and I just completely broke down and started sobbing one night. I thought I was losing my frickin' mind, but I knew it was the detox off the Lorcet.

The next day I made one of the worst decisions of my life, I told the doctor my ankle pain was too great without Lorcet and that I needed back on it, the only reason I wanted back on it was to kill the depression. From that moment on I abused the hell out of every opiate I could get my hands on. I did everything I could to destroy my life through my addiction. I wish I would have rode the depression out instead of getting back on Lorcet.

I do believe your depression will get better, you are very early in your wd from Suboxone, but if I were you, I would be contacting my psychiatrist ASAP and discussing all of this with him.

foundhelp also gave you some great advice and it sounds like he/she suffered from similar symptoms. Sometimes just knowing that were not the only ones in the world who are going through something like you're going through helps.

I hope you get to feeling better soon.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 11:57 am 
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Wow, what a great support group! Thank you all for such good advice and sharing how you felt. If I could feel like I feel right now from 5 to 8pm I would be so satisfied. I know everyone probably says this but I can't ever see starting this crap and again. The clear head I have this morning is the clearest I have ever had in 5 Years!!!!!! I can see things again.......that is so unreal that I thought I was before???? I mean just random things. My son keeps all his video games in this case/type canvas thing and I was putting it away yesterday and I didn't even recognize it!? The this morning, we were waiting for the school bus to come and when the bus driver opened the door I thought it was a different guy and then I realized it was the same guy they have had forever. I was like wow that is not how I perceived him before......unreal.


I do have another question......I would imagine all these years that I would have random but perfuse sweating it was from the opiates, right? I just remember having a wet neck all the time if I had to do something fast or if something bothered me things like that. I am still having random sweating will that go away? Or is that just me? God, you start to think how
crazy you are when you detox and to think it is all because of one type of ingredient (basically)......SAD.

That is why I worry about this evening depression.........I feel like I am bipolar!!! I feel great during the day and then BANG......SAD. But then I was really thinking last night and in my early years before my hip pain I never took something until around 4pm........the time the kids come home, making dinner, helping with homework. And when I read back to my posts I sound like I was a light addict. That is how it started but before I could get vicodin from a doctor I wouldn't start taking anything till 4pm. HMMMMM?????

Thank you all!!!!!Love this place:)


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 12:00 pm 
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I didn't finish that last thought.........I meant to say I was probably taking about 200 mgs a night "before" I could get it legally............wow. My body must have a clock and remember that??? who knows..........THank you!


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 2:29 pm 
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Hey lakegirl,

A couple more things. I remember my drug counselor telling me how we actually mourn the loss of our drug, sounds crazy, but think about it.....our drug was our best friend, we used it to "pick us up." All of a sudden, our best friend ain't there no more and we miss it.

In addition, you mentioned how your depression hits at a very specific time of day and you were wondering if it had anything to do with taking your other meds at 4pm every day. I believe that to be true also. My biggest party time of the day was right after work, for 26 years I had conditioned my body to getting stoned out of its ever loving mind at about the same time everyday. When I first quit Suboxone, I didn't notice it too much, but as time wore on I noticed I would get pretty fidgety when I got off work. If I got off work and I was home alone, it was almost unbearable. Truthfully, I didn't really experience that fidgety feeling after work until I had those two short relapses. I ended up keeping myself busy by going to the batting cages everyday after work. It's a great work out and I got to smack the shit out of some baseballs too! Then I started attending NA on a nightly basis, the ride up there, the meeting itself and the ride back kept me busy during that "witching hour" of mine.

The sweating thing seems to be a pretty common side effect of opiate use. I couldn't wait to stop all opiates so I wouldn't sweat like a frickin' mad man anymore, I've been off of Suboxone for over a year now and I'll still get worked up into a sweat if I do something fast AND if I'm in a situation that makes me nervous. Most all of my other symptoms have gone away completely, but that stupid sweating thing refuses to go peacefully into the night....Oh Well, it's just something I have to learn to manage. BTW, the sweating seems to be 99% confined to my forehead, like a great big flippin' neon sign yelling at everyone, "Hey, look how nervous Romeo is!!" :?

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 4:27 pm 
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I agree with those above who said you need to get to your doctor and have this treated. The depth of your depression is not normal and it should be addressed. Just because it's worse one part of the day doesn't mean it shouldn't be treated.

I haven't stopped suboxone so I haven't experienced its w/d's, but I'm very familiar with major depression...That deep, heavy darkness that envelopes you from the inside out, leaving you struggling to breath, a victim of your own emotions - emotions you don't even recognize as yours much less understand. It can be downright frightening. Please call that psychiatrist. Maybe this is a good time to start some individual counseling? I highly recommend it for lots of people, especially people with depression (it usually comes from somewhere.).

Also, you can always check out SMART recovery. They have online "meetings" as well as in-person meetings across the nation. I've never been to any, but I have heard good things about it. It's different than NA, but perhaps it will help you. It's an option anyway.

Good luck, feel better, and I hope your doc can help with a solution.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 8:35 am 
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Thank you so much for helping me........just talking to other people help. i live in such a rural area that the NA meetings are just not accessible for me. I am in individual counceling so that does help. I really had a horrible day out of no where yesterday as I wrote. I feel better this morning but ALL my kids are in school today so the am stress is down. I am wondering if I am experiencing major anxiety too???? Because I get so nervous and agitated and then I get so upset that I feel this way and then I get more upset because I don't want my kids to see me that it is a vicious circle.

Anyhow, I called my doctor and he prescribed me hydroxocine. I had it in detox.......he said it is alot like benedryl and not addictive. i had that years ago too when I had a horrible cough and I remember getting major med head and sleeping days away. So the funny thing is in detox I could take 2 whole pills and it would just settle me. So I was scared to take the whole thing. So I took a quarter of it and BOOM I was calm but I was tired/ But that was the first time I wasn't
upset, I could make dinner, play with kids and not freak out.

I also am going to try to not drink coffee right when I get up. I usually down alot while the kids are getting ready for school and I think if I pace myself that will help. I guess the best thing about this all is that I will never ever touch another opiate in my life. I can't imagine with all this work to go backwards. Luckily, I think i can do it. I did it with cigarettes and never looked back. And when I get these huge panicky sad crying attacts I am NOT thinking drugs I am thinking when will this end?? I try to think I must be one step closer.

Hatmaker: how much suboxone are you on now? None of my withdrawals started until I went to one mg a day, but I didn't even realize I was withdrawing because I didn't read up on this. I thought I would just walk away.........perfectly fine except for a craving or two. Nope as soon as I hit one mg that was it and I wish I woulc have red how tough it was going to be. I love reading all your stories so keep them coming if you like!!!


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 8:52 am 
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I am soooo happy you went to your doctor. Thank God you feel better. You just have to do what you have to do without the sub and pills till you can get through this. I wasn't able to drink coffee either. I stopped drinking it altogether. I drank chamomille tea, and there's a tea to soothe anxiety too. They're at the health food stores, or Meijers in the vitamin section...If you have a meijer's where you are. Put a lil honey and WHOOMP...THERE IT IS!!! Take time to close your eyes, clear your mind, and relax several times a day. Do deep breathing when you feel one of those horrible waves of anxiety coming on. You are gonna be alright Lakegirl and remember....One day at a time. Go Girl!!


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 9:00 am 
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I'm not tapering off suboxone and won't anytime soon. I'm also on sub for pain, so I take on average, about 16 mg per day (more on a bad pain day).

The other thing I wanted to mention to you is that since you have gotten to where you are expecting this depression wave to hit you around the same time every day, I think you are probably anticipating it and maybe perseverating on it and making it worse. When we're expecting an assault on us, we tense up for the hit coming, sort of like what you're doing. You expect it to come so you're "bracing" yourself for it and I think that's probably causing you to hyper-focus on what's happening.

I'd suggest you do everything humanly possible to occupy and distract yourself in those hours when it's the worst. Whatever that will take for you, TRY to make that happen. I know that's so much easier said than done.

I know very little about Hydroxyzine so I thought I'd look it up. This is what I found on Wiki:

Quote:
Hydroxyzine is used primarily as an antihistamine for the treatment of itching, allergies, hyperalgesia, motion sickness-induced nausea, and insomnia, as well as notably for the treatment of mild anxiety.[2] Even though it is an effective sedative, hypnotic, analgesic, and tranquilizer, it shares almost none of the abuse, dependence, addiction, and toxicity potential of other drugs used for the same range of therapeutic reasons. (Emphasis mine)


I'm glad it helped you. And after reading that I can see why it helped.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 9:25 am 
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I forgot to say this, but if you decide to go the tea route. Make sure you ask your doctor if it's ok to use supplements such as chamomille with the whatever medication you are taking. Better to be safe than sorry. Much love to you and your family my fellow recovering addict.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 8:00 pm 
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I hate to be redundant about this anxiety but it hit me completely different today........all morning till around 2pm..........and I was fine and then that evening anxiety started creeping in. I honestly don't feel that I am waiting for it. It really just starts on its own and then I look at the clock and think "Figures". But the intensity of this is surreal........I wish I could find more people to talk to about this horrible feeling. I start getting kind of sick to my stomach and then I have electric shocks all through my body.......today my tounge went numb! My forehead and neck start sweating like crazy and I just want to lay down and cry. One Dr. said just go ahead and cry that is good for you . So I do if I am all alone and I do feel better:)
Today I had no choice but to tough it out because I had a girlfriend of mine come over and she helped clean my house. Not that I couldn't go to my bedroom and cry but I kept pushing so we could get it done. But when it happens I can't talk, I can't do anything that someone wants me too and if I have to do it all the symptoms just skyrocket..........

I totally believe part of it is I miss the drugs and that I could cope so much better with them (up to that magical point of no return). For 2 years I thought I had the answer to life because I could completely focus, stay on task, and get everything done AND MOST IMPORTANTLY play with my kids. It is like I am so over sensitive that I panic. I guess I will give this another couple weeks and see if there is something else going on. But, yes, thinking it over when I would take a vicodin at 4pm as time went on I think my craving/withdrawal's as anyone elses would got stronger so I was then up to 2 vic and then within a couple months I went to 3 and so on.

Ok, so why I am worried about this is Im also have been on Vyvanse for ADD...........everytime I went in for a check up he would ask an array of questions as usual. Are you seeing things? no. Are you hearing things? no. Are you having bouts of depression so bad you can't get out of bed for days? no. Why do you ask that question? And he said because all your testing is clearly ADD but you possible be mildly bipolar. He continued to say that if someone is BPolar ADD medicine can induce depression. But then he did say that many other things on my test would controdict if I was bipolar. He could tell I was really upset because the only person I had ever known that was BP was really nutty. So he said, listen, bipolar is very common and some of the smartest people in the world are bipolar and it would just be a medicine change. So I am just making sure. SO THEN ALL this crazy nutty anxiety is hitting me like the fastest train ever known to mankind and I don't know what to do??? Can anyone relate to this? Or someone with extreme anxiety during recovery??? Thank you so much to everyone helping me. I appreciate it more that you know..........


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 8:14 pm 
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foundhelp: I really think it is anxiety not depression. I think I am confusing it becasue the anxiety is so intense that I could cry? Idk if that makes sense. But you said your anxiety was off the chain. What did you feel like? And how long did it last? Or was it gone when you started taking Buspar?

Romeo: How long was it for you when your depression/anxiety went away or started to fade? Did other symptoms fade first and the depression linger?

Thank you all!!!!!!!


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Iam mildly bipolar and once I got under 2 mg the depression got so bad that when I finished a big job and got paid I didnt even care about the money... I always felt bad, every waking minute I felt like shit, tried several meds and they just seemed to make things worse, all this went on for about 6 months until ...... I do know how bad this can be, you just feel down down and more down... and I tapered so slow, nothing helped, NOTHING, Good Luck, Mike


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 8:35 pm 
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Painter???? What happened? Until............what? and how long did you go before "until"?????


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Painter........ok nevermind about the time I saw the 6 months. Are you under Drs. care now or just doing your own thing?
Please tell me what is going on??? How long were on Sub? What did you do before Sub???


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