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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Wed Apr 08, 2015 3:11 pm 
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Hi Fish

I was reading your story and I wanted to first tell you what you are doing is what we all think about. I am happy for you. What I would like to say is that reading through other stories I have noticed that people put time frames on things. I know it is hard not to. I read stuff like I am two weeks in when will this go away? i am not implying what you said is wrong. Wrong is subjective in my mind.

What I am trying to say here is that the journey is not ending. This journey is just beginning, It will continue on for the rest of your life. The parameters of addiction are ingrained or burnt into our brains.
Like a negative of a photograph. So when people say it is 9 days and feel great YAY I am done, ummm no. Sorry this chapter is just beginning. I am not trying to sound negative, I am trying to be real about things. I commend what you are doing and good for you! When you talked about coffee and wanting a cigarette that is addiction doing what it does. Remember these type of things, write them down as they come to you.

keep your guard up in other words. A person can beat the physical part but the cravings will come and go for life. I truly believe that.

Keep sharing your progress. I wish you the best!

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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Wed Apr 08, 2015 10:26 pm 
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Snake god,
Thank you for your thoughtful reply. I wholeheartedly agree with you that addiction is a lifetime battle, and that detoxing is simply the first step in the beginning of a new chapter in life. You make a super important and solid point.

Recovery doesn't end at being inducted on suboxone. Just as recovery doesn't end the day one jumps off and finishes suboxone treatment. Recovery takes work to stay in it every single day of an addicts life.

My goal, however, in documenting my experience with tapering and then jumping off suboxone, as well as sharing info from different frames of reference (aka time passed since the jump) ....my goal is NOT to set a specific time for which I'm "healed" from my addiction.

I am trying to put good positive realistic information out there to others who are going through a similar experience. I'm hoping this will simply give them something to loosely reference to... to see what someone else was feeling at point A or day X or week B and then get a rough reference for what they MIGHT expect. So hopefully I am succeeding in this.

I will add something kinda interesting though on the topic of having a permanently addicted brain. I have been feeling this strange, slightly uncomfortable yet intriguing feeling the past few nights...its unexplainable. And i like feeling it. Especially new and strange to me in that it doesn't relate directly to drugs or craving drugs. It's this feeling that is pretty sexual in nature...(in fact I thought maybe it could just be my libido finally returning, except I have no desire to have actual sex with my husband)...so I think some sort of pathway is trying to light up in my brain for some reason although I can't decide if it's good or bad. Probably bad, since I like this strange feeling and I'm craving to feel it again.... Any thoughts on what is going on? Just feelings/emotions/desires coming back in full force?


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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Wed Apr 08, 2015 11:18 pm 
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can someone tell me how to post a question on here


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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Wed Apr 08, 2015 11:25 pm 
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Tulsa,
Go to the board index, choose whichever section your question is pertinent to. Then select post new topic. If its in a innapropriate section the mods will come along and suggest the best place to move it to get the most relevant replies :)


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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Wed Apr 08, 2015 11:42 pm 
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[quote="tfisher"]Snake god,

My goal, however, in documenting my experience with tapering and then jumping off suboxone, as well as sharing info from different frames of reference (aka time passed since the jump) ....my goal is NOT to set a specific time for which I'm "healed" from my addiction.

I am trying to put good positive realistic information out there to others who are going through a similar experience. I'm hoping this will simply give them something to loosely reference to... to see what someone else was feeling at point A or day X or week B and then get a rough reference for what they MIGHT expect. So hopefully I am succeeding in this.

Hi again Fish,

You are succeeding! Laying out your expierence, referencing your side effects on point A time with day X on week B is the valuable information people are looking for. As far as how you are feeling now? I believe that the mind heals with valley and troughs. When we feel bad that is healing then a person might feel relief for a few hours or days. When a person feels relief I think it is the mind trying to think of what part to repair next. Does that make sense?

When a person feels bad the next day that is the mind working on that repair. Maybe this feeling that is of a sexual nature is realeasing these feel good chemicals, which may increase your libido. I have read people get a decrease in libido. For me it is the opposite. Libido is just one of the many reasons I kept taking opiates. I had a whole list of positive side effects while I was taking them.

These feelings could be a sign that your sexual drive is increasing. I am looking forward, following your progress!

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Opportunity may only knock once but temptation leans on the doorbell...


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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2015 3:01 pm 
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hang in there yo......im on about 2 and a half months off the subs but I didn't taper at all, I just went from 4mg a day for 8 years to nothing....and you are right about the sleep, that is the last one to go...it sounds like you are doing a lot better than I was as I was up 24/7 from day 3 or 4 until day 22 of coming off them and then I started getting a little sleep so you are kicking my ass there....I really started to feel better with more energy and normal 8 hours of sleep at about week 7 but even though I wasn't sleeping good at all at least my body felt okay besides that .....just don't get discouraged...I honestly felt way better week 7 like all of a sudden and I know someone else who really got a lot better that week too but like I said I think a lot of this has to do with your prior usage as your brain is recovering not only from your sub use and mine was for along time but whatever you did before you got on that as well (at least this is what I was told ) so just be patient, sleep will come....and be careful with the ambien as there were people in the treatment facility that I went too who were addicted to that big time as well and had a hard time coming off it........keep up the good work


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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2015 7:50 pm 
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Fishy,

Yay for you feeling better! Yay for you having these new "feelings," whatever they may be, sexual or not.

I never got the impression that, once you feel better, you will be "healed" from addiction. I strongly appreciate you documenting your progress. We all know that we will be battling addiction for the rest of our lives, whether we feel good or not. I guess this subject is something I learned in "Addiction 101," = duh, we all know that, once we are feeling better, no matter the circumstance, we have to constantly be aware of our addiction.

I just didn't want you to think that your posts project the "I will be fine and have no worries once I'm feeling better" mantra. I never thought that for a second while reading your progress. We know that this will always be a struggle, but jeez, it's sure nice to read positive information about how people can live life without medication and still feel great.

Of course, I think sub treatment is positive and I whole heartedly agree with anyone who takes sub long term. There is nothing wrong with sub treatment if it helps anyone live an active addiction free life.

But getting off of sub is different for everyone. Your progress gives hope to those of us who are ready to try a life without sub. I just really appreciate all of the information you've provided and in no way have I ever thought "well, once I finish sub, life will be all peaches and I'll never think about opiates or my addiction again."

Anyway, I'm so glad you are feeling better and getting through this. You have tackled a major feat and it is awesome to celebrate it! We are all works in progress, but it's encouraging to hear about yours.

Best to you!

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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2015 11:32 pm 
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Thanks for the support everyone!!! Cjmilladoo you pour thing had to go without sleep for waaaaay to long. I don't know how you did it, I would not be a happy camper. I guess that just goes to show that the body will finally sleep when it needs it for actual survival. I can't wait to see what 7 weeks is like. I too have heard that's a huge one where everything changes again. I'm closing in on 3 weeks here pretty soon...

Bad kitty you have such an awesome attitude, even though you have had some unexpected symptom timing. I guess that's all just part of this recovery thing that we all go through... You never know what you're going to get! Which is why I believe that you may not even have bad WD from here on out. And your at 1.5 now, correct? BE SO PROUD. you're at a place not many people can get to, so your hard work and toughing it out is not in vain. If you have the patience and the time, (I got really in a hurry at this point) I recommend chilling at that dose for a few weeks to see how you feel. It may give you a new perspective on everything jump/taper related. You'll know what to do though.


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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 11:38 am 
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Day 18
Update: still feeling pretty normal. Getting used to the way I'm feeling more instead of thinking and questioning it constantly. Been SO BUSY with work that I haven't had time to think about much else aka exercise. Everything will get back to usual in time though. I keep forgetting it has not even been 3 weeks.

Yesterday I had some weird cravings for opiates but not enough to actually act on. I have been prepared for this day to come so I kinda just rolled my eyes and laughed at myself when that thought popped into my head.

Other than that, pretty much the same but my energy gets better and better each day now so that's making me happy.

If I would feel this way always I could handle it. :)


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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Fri Apr 10, 2015 6:31 pm 
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We are so lucky to have this positive place to vent and chart our progress or lack of,lol. Thanks to all who share their stories. :)


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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Sat Apr 11, 2015 3:55 pm 
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Hi Fishy,

Yay again; you're just continuing to improve and it sounds like you are feeling better every day! So awesome.

I love your attitude about cravings too. We can recognize them and then move on, not dwelling on them and instead focusing on the positive things in life. Way to go!

Yes, I'm at 1.5mg. Staying at 1.5 for at least a week. As you said, it doesn't hurt to chill at a certain dose and let your body adjust. I'll reduce to 1.4mg after a week or more, still only about a 6% drop, but hell, if I can take it slow and reduce symptoms, I won't complain. Lol.

Anyway, congrats again on all of your progress. Just think; when you go on your vacation at the end of May, you will be feeling great and you won't have to worry about taking anything. Fabulous!

I'm continuing to enjoy reading about your progress. You rock sistah! Meeeoooow. :)

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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Sat Apr 11, 2015 7:05 pm 
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Bad kitty meow! You are continuing to kick ass at your taper! Very impressed, I knew you would feel better with the liquid method, I know I sure did. My conclusion was that those tiny pieces of sub crumb we were dosing just weren't really getting absorbed. I think its said that we only absorb part of our dose as it is (the wise Dr j wrote about it somewhere) so it's really no surprise that you felt so crummy!

So keep on doing what you're doing, and stay as long as you need to at each drop. I know towards the end I was flying through drops (and feeling it too) because I anticipated some horrible scary thing that I would face at the end, followed by some other great big thing that I built up in my head to be like a other worldly level of happiness and satisfaction! So I was in a real big hurry.

The truth of the matter is (in my case at least) the jump was a week or so of misery followed by lots of being tired.... And then slowly but surely just getting back to how I felt when I was stable on suboxone. Only without the suboxone in the equation:)

it wasn't like this heavenly amazing freedom walking around on cloud 9 the way I had anticipated. I've come to realize I'm just not wired that way. The only time I was ever on cloud 9 was from artificially being high. And maybe someday I'll feel really good again naturally. But for now I'll just try and work on today, each and every day! That's all us addicts can do.

Wishing everyone an awesome Saturday evening!!


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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 10:37 am 
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3 weeks....DAY 21

today I am finally feeling well enough that i think I'm ready to move past survival mode and start trying to make my life better.

Going to work on creating my days and having some semblance of control over my life instead of just trying to get through each day, faking my way through it.

The acute symptoms that were lingering, mainly fatigue and shitty mood feel as though they have lifted. I haven't had real bad anxiety since the first few days, if at all. Yesterday was horrible. I was a horrible person yesterday, a big ball of pissed off rage.

Today I'm going to focus on being more open and present and sincere. Im tired of fighting, and quite frankly I don't feel like I need to anymore. I think I had to fight so damn hard for the past few weeks, just to make it through my obligations to the world... That I had a lot of leftover fight and anger in me. But there's no need for the mean anymore.

I need to redirect my energies into being a healthier, happier person, a better wife... I am glad Im aware now that i have that much fight in me...because I now believe I could survive anything life wants to throw my way.

Yesterday I thought life just chewed me up and spit me out the other end as damaged goods. I thought there was no fucking way my brain and my receptors and my mood would ever recover from all I've put it through over the years. I highly considered just going back to suboxone yesterday.

Today is somehow different though. Im at least going to try today.


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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 2:53 pm 
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Sending encouragement...
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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 9:28 pm 
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Sherah thank you for the inspiring quote! That's one of my favorite quotes ever. Sooo true.

It got me to thinking...people who have no idea about opiate addiction or suboxone treatment or tapering or jumping or any of it... Those people have NO IDEA how tough it is and what kind of a person it takes to be an opiate addict in recovery
..to admit that opiates took control and that they needed help. They have no idea how scary going to induction and getting on suboxone is. They have no idea the struggles we face physically and mentally as addicts trying to stay clean, even on suboxone... They have no idea of the mental and emotional things that mess with us. Should we stay on maintenance..should we taper..is this the right thing to be doing..am I going to lose my doctor and then my medicine...its scary to be dependent on something despite the fact we are not addicted to it.

You know, I think people don't know just how tough ANY opiate addict is, even those of us still in active addiction. It takes a lot of strength to deal with being sick all the time, faking it through work or family commitment while in WD..finding that dose to keep us well each and every morning and still going on with the day functioning normally....not to mention how wonderfully resourceful us addicts are ;) thats a trait that I've always been proud of actually, my ability to think of a hundred ways around something or to something when the first, second, or tenth try doesn't work out. I find that most of us addicts are really passionate and compassionate people. Just look how many there are here, supporting each other, total strangers in one of the most difficult parts of our lives.

Anyway, my point being that people should appreciate addicts more instead of looking at them as being weak. I guarantee all those judgy preachy sober people would not survive three days in the life of a person in active addiction. We are all tougher and stronger than we think we are.


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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 9:59 pm 
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Absolutely and well said. Amen!!!

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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2015 10:15 pm 
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I echo Jenjen's post; well said Fishy! You are sooo right on; people who've never dealt with addiction just don't understand what it's like. They just can't relate, so they label us as weak because it's an easy way to categorize us. We are so much more than "weak," it's not even funny!

People who've never battled addiction just seem to think, "well why can't you just stop?" As if it's that easy. If it
were, we sure as hell wouldn't be struggling.

We are strong. We are good people. We just have to work at a sober life a helluva lot harder than others.

Thanks again for a great post. Your posts always make me think about life and our struggle to function in it, plus the need to focus on the positive aspects of life, whatever they may be at the time. :)

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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 2:10 am 
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Day 22...
Things I've noticed since being off suboxone (some things I noticed right away, some are things that continue to pop up with each day)

CHANGE IN EYESIGHT At first my eyesight got eagle eye sharp and then two days later was worse than its ever been! (Getting my eyes checked tomorrow) I don't know if this is due to the actual medication or the fact that I didn't take the time to think about my sight while working on recovery the past year and a half.

COLD. ALWAYS. Even in the first 80 degree weather of the year a chill runs through me in all environments, indoor and outdoor. Constantly. No amount of clothing can warm me up.

HUNGRY! my appetite came back as a ravaging hunger that can not be subdued! Rawwwr!

GRUMPY. this one sucks but I know time and exercise will fix this. Oh and for some reason ever little thing about my mother has become intolerable to me...poor little thing, it's not her fault but gawwww she's annoying and ridiculous.

EYE CONTACT. I feel like I make better eye contact with people when I am taking with them and am more focused on what people are actually saying. Maybe that's why I'm grumpy lol.

MUSIC...it just sounds soooooooo good. I'm especially interested in listening to the mars volta. Like seriously at full blast in my car, the same songs over and over and over for weeks.

MOISTURE RETURNING TO HAIR AND SKIN. I never used to get greasy scalp. Could literally go a week without washing my hair (not that I actually would unless camping) and it would never ever get oily. Now the following day my scalp is oily. This has to be from the medication because when I was on suboxone the texture of my hair dried out even more than usual and I was soooo dry everywhere.

SNEEZING. Loud and often, and multiple times in a row. And the nose remains ready for an embarrassing and unexpected sneeze fit at any moment in time. Wake up from a dead sleep in a fit of sneezes.

PEOPLE AREN'T AS SUPPORTIVE AS YOU ONCE THOUGHT. now that you're off "that drug" they're so happy with you. Saying things like "you were ready it was turning on you" "that's bad stuff if it's that hard to get off of" etc etc ignoramus bullshit....

SLEEP PATTERNS SUCK! Of course you can sit down on the couch at 6pm to unwind from work and accidentally fall asleep for the majority of the evening. But then when it is actual bedtime you wake up and are wide awake all night long. Super frustrating.

These are just a few of the things I've had in my personal experience off suboxone over the past three weeks.


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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 4:02 am 
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FISH!

Listen to me. You are absolutely amazing and I am SO thankful you have been posting your detailed experience with your recovery, getting off Suboxone, etc. I won't write a novel (although I could), but please know you are so appreciated and well respected here, as I'm sure you are aware. You give me hope and life when I am feeling down...like I will be on Suboxone forever and will never be or feel 'normal'. Your words have allowed me to look toward the future in a positive light, and realize that I can and will beat this and continue on to live a happy, fulfilling life in recovery. I hope that you continue to post about your life after Suboxone, even long after you are through this.

Thanks again.

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"He will cover you with his feathers, and under His wings you will find refuge" - Psalm 91:4
–Robert Green Ingersoll


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 Post subject: Re: life after suboxone
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 4:34 am 
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Crystal,
Thank you sooo much for writing such a nice post to me. I started posting to this forum with the intention of keeping a documentation for myself during the taper/jump. Then if I ever forgot how far I've come, or started thinking that I'm not tough or strong enough to stay clean, then I could look back and read exactly how I was feeling. And also see how far I had come.

In the meantime though, I ended up learning a lot about others and find that we all struggle the same, we all think about the same things, and we all can register to each other in ways that only addicts could understand.

I ended up finding one of the most supportive times of my life through the love and compassion of the amazing people here.

I'm learning that addicts really are some of the most empathetic and intelligent people I've ever "met". That in itself has allowed me to forgive myself for my flaws and to move on from my past. It makes me realize that I am NOT a special or unique case, and that we are all truly cut from the same cloth as we face this same struggle we have somewhere deep inside of each and every one of us.

I felt that even if posting here helped one person (even if that person was only me) then it would all be worth it. So to read your post and all of the touching things you said, to know you have read some of what I write... That someone who was there reading some of the strangest hours of my life... where my brain was being backwards mindfucked hard while my body was being hijacked just right on the brink of pain, just enough to cause loooong drawn out melancholy pain and sadness.

And after all that to hear you tell me I am "well respected".... Brings a tear to my eye in the best way possible.


Crystal you have no clue how much you and the rest of the group here....bad kitty, sherah, jennjenn, morphing, rule, Amy, Q, evolved revolver, tiki, snake god... I know I'm probably leaving someone out but not intentional. I can't even name that many people in real life who have given so much in a time where they really don't have much to give off themselves, as everyone is fighting their own battle.

I have so much hope for the future, hope for ALL of us here...and so much respect and support for you all who have helped me get through the first part of all of this. The fact that we are all here and sharing and supporting one another makes me believe that we will all continue to succeed in recovery. And ALL types of recovery are fantastic. No matter which road we go down.

Thanks again and lots of love.


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