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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 1:41 pm 
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Here's the deal. I don't really care what anyone else has said on these forums, I know what I went through, and I'm sure it can be different for others, but it cant be all that different. So for starters, a little background.
I'm 32 now. Almost 33. Started doing painkillers at 22-23, and also have a serious back problem.(spinal stenosis, 4 herniated disks, and some other stuff that I can't remember but it's on my MRIs) The back problems are from years of playing very physical sports, boxing, catching on a baseball team, alot of organized football. So a quack MD down in Florida prescribed me loracets and somas. Got hooked on them. Graduated to roxicets, or "little blue guys" as my friends like to call them. It is just amazing how many doctors I know that will give me these pills. UNBELIEVABLE.
So I gradually went from doing them to selling them, making great money at that, and then, straight up heroin. At my peak I could do a bundle a day. Gross right? Eventually I found methadone. That stuff got me whacked more than real dope. Anyone remember the big orange tablets you had to dissolve in water and drink? Those were AWESOME!!!
Then back to roxicets 30mgs. All day every day baby like it was my job, well it was on the side. :lol:
Eventually, I just got real f'in tired of everything, I wasn't really even getting high anymore, and the trips to Newark NJ were about as fun as being sodomized by Ron Jeremy. (Anyone who knows about Newark knows thats its no fun when the Bloods and Crips are fighting for your $80 bundle and you can see their guns poking out of their beltstraps right next to your car) WHAT WAS I THINKING???!??!?!?!?!? I have a genius IQ and Im doing this?!?!?!!?!??!
OK fast forward. I find suboxones and think im cured, not so, there are vicious withdrawals with these things. So after many years of going back and forth from pills to dope to suboxones, I finally decide to go see a doctor and get in the system. The problem was that the doctor wants you to take them forever, I disagree, when you are ready to quit, you are ready to quit. I firmly believe that when you take subs for an extended period of time that it makes it very difficult to get off of them. So here goes...........my suboxone story:
first week---The doctor seemed nice enough, told me to take 2 in the morning and 2 at night(these are 8mgs), i did this for a week, its too much, they almost make you high, i tapered down to 1 a day after that.
2nd week--Since i had the strips, I started cutting them in half and did 1/2 in morning for a few days, and then a 1/4 in morning for about another week. Felt totally fine the whole time.
3rd week--Im cutting the strips into very small pieces, and even skipping a day here and there.
4th week--i took more than i shouldve, prob around 1 per day, not sure why
5th week--back to cutting tiny tiny tiny pieces of 8mg sub strips.......feeling fine
6th week--skipping days all the time, small tiny piece, then skip, and follow pattern
7th week--started skipping 2 days, and you CAN DO THIS PEOPLE!!!!! GET FOCUSED!!!!!
8th week--same thing but even cut the small pieces in half.
9th week--WERE IN IT NOW! IM ON DAY 4 with nothing in my system. sure i have some chills and trips to the toilet which arent all that bad. but no throwing up, im sleeping every night, and honestly when i wake up tomorrow im gonna be fine.

THIS IS TOTALLY POSSIBLE. DO IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
God Bless you all. And good luck!
I HATE OPIATES :x


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 Post subject: and another thing
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 2:17 pm 
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i do firmly believe that a lot of these doctors which prescribe the subs consider it a cash register, at least in Jersey, alot of them dont take insurance for it. so why wouldnt they want you on it forever??????? i just called my sub doctor and told his secretary that i tapered off on my own and she sounded totally dumbfounded. she says "the doctor will have to call you back and talk to you about this" interesting. i FEEL AWESOME. I may even go out tonight and hit on some chicks!

grab yourselves by the throat people, stop giving lowlife dealers your money. get focused. IF I DID IT ANYONE CAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


LOVE YOURSELF
JERSEYADDICT


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 Post subject: ALSO
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 2:30 pm 
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I know its all out of my system by now because my urine isnt bubbly and brown......you fellow junkies know what i mean! :P

I cant wait to fall asleep tonight, I WILL RULE THE WORLD AGAIN TOMORROW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 2:44 pm 
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Good Job JerseyAddict................this is what I want to hear :) and welcome to this forum.

I have learned alot here, I will be skipping days here soon in a couple weeks or so I am down to .25mg I just dropped a few days ago so I want to be more stable on the dose

I am glad to hear your done with it, it makes it feel more do able for me

thanks
L


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 Post subject: no need trust me
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 2:52 pm 
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if you're down that low its in your head. i promise. get it over with. take a vaca from work, fake a family death, whatever you gotta do. get it OVER WITH BROTHER, or SISTER!!!!????!!!!

so sick of it. i remeber when dope uses to get me high. what a f'in wast of money jesus!!!!


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 Post subject: its funny
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 2:55 pm 
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i did this once before but had no lingering effects. the only thing that made me get high again was wanting to get high. so stupid. if everyone here spoke from the heart like i did there would be a much better understanding of what goes on.


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 Post subject: the problem for me
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:08 pm 
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was that where i lived for many years, in select parts of NJ, there are "hoods" everywhere and dope everywhere and money to be made everywhere. its really awful. lot of lower middle class and alot of people doing drugs. i happened to make it out and just couldnt shake the demons of my bad childhood of getting my ass kicked and whatnot. IT IS OVER. I HATE THIS STUFF. I CAN MAKE A BETTER LIVING ON MY OWN. DO NOT DO OPIATES> GET OFF.

i feel like i have had an epiphony (SP) and want to spread the word!!!!!!!!!!!!

JERSEYADDICT


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:19 pm 
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I started tapering about a month ago, I will be done soon enough ;) no doubt....... I am to old for this crap ( 48) ;)..... as far as vacation.. I work from home so its a little harder then just calling in a funeral but because I can work from anywhere I am planning a vacation at the end of the month which is most likely when I will jump. We all have to go at a pace we are comfortable with even if it is in my head :)


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 Post subject: i understand
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:23 pm 
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i respect all you have said. if you want it over and done with you have to be committed. i may relapse, i may not. the GOOD LORD ABOVE knows that i am trying my damndest. I do know that i am sick of it all. and i wanna keep my good looks intact while i still got em :D


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:23 pm 
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I meant to say I am 48 yrs old and I am female


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 Post subject: get focused people
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:30 pm 
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this thread should be a well spoken honest thread that many should be speaking in. open your minds and hearts. let IT ALL OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 6:14 pm 
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I know its all out of my system by now because my urine isnt bubbly and brown......you fellow junkies know what i mean!


Dude...bubbly brown urine? I don't think this is related to subs or opiates....do you have a liver problem? Congrats though!


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:38 am 
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Like what you said about the .25!! That seems so crazy to me, I'm getting down to 2 and jumping! There is no way it can be worse than Herion dt's....


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:57 pm 
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we are all different and our body chemistry is all different. you may think .25 is crazy I think jumping at 2 is crazy but what ever works for you is what matters, like i said I ended up in a hospital for two weeks when I jumped to soon and I am do damn old to deal with wd. My son jumped at like 4mg withdrew for a week and is fine and clean so ... its all about what works for each of us and its all different :)


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 2:46 pm 
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Ditto to what mg113 said. To be honest, I thought the same thing as you do, Breakingthechains, and it makes sense that you would think that way. The problem is that Sub is an unusual drug. Because of the ceiling effect, even low doses of Sub are equivalent to pretty sizable doses of full agonist opiates. 2 mg of Suboxone is equivalent to 25 to 50 mg of Oxy. I'm not certain, but isn't 25-50 mg of Oxy a decent amount? 1 mg of Sub is equivalent to 12.5 to 25 mg of Oxy. For me, getting down to 2 mg of Sub was actually the easier part of this whole thing, in hindsight. Once I got to around 2 mg, it got waaayyy tougher. Going from 1.25 to 1 has been very tough. It's hard to wrap one's mind around, but when you get there and are experiencing it, you see it differently. I used to think, "Sheesh. Those people with their microgram doses need to get over it already and just stop!" My foot is officially in my mouth. However, I have never had to deal with Heroin detox and as far as the severity of the symptoms, I think the Sub w/d symptoms are typically far less intense. They just last a very long time.

Okay, so I'm gonna let it all out. I CANNOT WAIT TO BE DONE WITH THIS SUBOXONE TAPER AND I'M SO EXCITED TO THINK ABOUT LIFE WITHOUT THIS DRUG!!! I'm limping through the days right now waiting for my next dose and I don't like that. Feels too much like stuff I want to forget about. Soon, it will all be behind me and I'm going to do a few back flips when that happens....or at least a few cartwheels. WOOOOOOOHOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!

laddertipper

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 4:19 pm 
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Ladder I will be doing cartwheels with ya girl lol


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 4:49 pm 
I'll do cartwheels for ya too, Ladder! And you are so right about bupe being so different from the other opiates! You're right on about the ceiling effect, too. That's one of the things I like so much about this site. There is so much information here. I have learned tons here about how this drug works. One of the most important things we have to understand is the ceiling effect and how it works, especially when we're trying to taper and discontinue the drug. You're 100% right, too, that the work in tapering does not really even begin until you're under 2mg or so. I know that was true for me as well. I had minimal to zero physical w/d problems until under 2mg/day. People who stop at 2mg or more, in my opinion, are putting themselves through unnecessary suffering. If they don't mind it....that's cool. I've been through a hard-core cold-turkey withdrawal and a long drawn-out PAWS already and once was enough for me! I know I can do that. I can handle it. I'd survive. But I don't care to revisit that. Furthermore, I don't really even think the w/d from bupe could possibly be any worse than what I went through already, so that's not the problem. What I am interested in is doing what will give me the best shot at permanent sobriety over the course of the rest of my life. And from all the info I have gathered that will be accomplished by taking it low and slow with my taper and quit....just like you, Ladder. So hang in there, you and everyone else working at this!
Oh, the dark, bubbly urine....nope, that's not a symptom of opiate use. That's a symptom of pretty bad dehydration or much worse, but not opiate use.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 5:16 pm 
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setmefree, mg and ladder....I sure hope y'all get your cartwheels on video and forward it to me so I can laugh my butt off!! If I didn't think I'd break my neck, I'd do some cartwheels with all of ya........I think it's best for me to keep my feet on the ground for the rest of my life though!! :lol:

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:06 pm 
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I am down to .036 mg and still tappering. Its not all in your head tho because the long 37+ half life means just because your taking .25 mg a day thats all thats in your system. If you dose everyday you are slowly building up more and more sub in your system no matter what the dose. I feel like I am off even tho I take .036 a day but I do still start feeling some minimal w/d like RLS if I dont dose by day 2. I will be off soon tho. Taking it slow. But damn I am ready to really be off. I cant believe how better I feel already!


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:06 pm 
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(quoting set me free "What I am interested in is doing what will give me the best shot at permanent sobriety over the course of the rest of my life.")

I could not have said that better!! I totally agree 100% with all the above posts, for one that it is all individual. Ones tolerance is completely unique, and there symptoms of w/d are that way as well. We could all jump at any # we so see fit, but the fact in the matter is, it's the long term goal that we set for ourselves that matters most.
I am down to 1mg/.5mg every other day dosing. I have experienced some days of major w/d this week, but as of today believe with the help of my dr and clonodine I have those kinks worked out. That being said, at the beginning of this week I wanted off the 2mg, and was thinking at the time I'd do whatever it took to get there as fast as I can. However, in this last week, I found this forum, and have spoken to my dr several times, and realized that for me, it has to be slow and steady. However, I do think it's possible for someone to jump, and get through it, I just chose to do it this way, and to find a way to do it as comfortable as possible.
I quoted setmefree b/c that one sentence sums it all up for me. I want to be permanently sober for the rest of my life, so if a few more months, or several more months for that matter tapring off of subs is what it takes then that is what I'm going to do. The end will be the same, but I will have gotten there as safely and painlessly as possible.
If I have learned anything this week, it's that this is a very strong medication, and our limits and w/d symptoms are very individual. It's a learning process, and it takes a day to day committment!

ladder, mg and setmefree, I'm joinin' you all on them cartwheels!! It will be a day of great celebration when I reach my goal, and I will gladly be here to post about how it goes, and how it ends!
big hugs to everyone!! Though it may be a difficult journey at times, when you reach your destination you will be stronger, wiser and healthier....
Rain

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We must be willing to get rid of the life we've planned,
so as to have the life that is waiting for us.
The old skin has to be shed before the new one can come.
- Joseph Campbell


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