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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 9:16 am 
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Like the title says i'm 9 days into sub withdrawals. The only remaining symptoms are a little bit of sweating. Not so much cold sweats anymore. I'm fatigued. I forced myself to workout on day 6 and 7 and it was a bear. I went to a funeral yesterday and the church session made me very emotional. My stomach is still churning. Which i suppose is ok since I was extremely bound up before hand. I'm taking a 1/4 of a .1mg Clonidine about twice a day and it seems to help but does infact make me tired. I watched SuboxDoc's videos on youtube about Suboxone withdrawal being the worst. But i'd have to say I never would have made it this far coming off of a real pain killer. It's lingering longer than I had wished and every day is a very minute improvement. But I'm trying to stay optimistic that this won't last much longer. It is wearing on my mind badly. I figured i'd share my withdrawal experience coming off such a high dose. Any input or encouragement would be appreciated. Thank you.

Edit. I also tried GABA to help with anxiety/sweats. But the brand I got has such a high dose of Niacin that taking even 4 pills makes me feel crappier than if I had not taken it. Which is only 800mg of GABA. Does anyone have any good experiences with GABA?


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 Post subject: Welcome.......
PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 9:36 am 
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As I started tapering we ( my shrink and I ) found that I had another couple of psych issues that needed tending to, PLEASE dont let yourself feel like sh-t .. Some of the sh-tty feeling is because your off sub , some of the sh-tty feeling could be the need for other meds, our brains re-wire themselves on opiates... Welcome again and Happy Thanksgiving


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 9:42 am 
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Thank you. Happy Thanksgiving to you as well. I was taking Wellbutrin for about a month before I quit subs. I was having manic episodes of happiness and depression so I stopped the Wellbutrin as I believed that was the cause. Since then I have been stable but I want to get back on the Wellbutrin because now i'm smoking cigs like a fiend! I hate smelling like a bon fire.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 9:53 am 
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Hi kinetix and welcome to our little community. I'm sorry you're not feeling well, but from what you describe and after coming off such a high dose, I would say you're actually doing pretty well. And at 9 days since your last dose you have likely passed the worst of it by now. I wanted to ask you for some clarification - what did you mean when you said Dr. J said suboxone withdrawals are "the worst"? Worse compared to what? Sub withdrawal isn't nearly as bad as full agonist (regular pain pill) withdrawals and methadone is even worse than that. It's a shame you can't take a bit more of the clonidine, but I can understand not doing so since it makes you sleepy. You're smart to exercise, as so many people report that will go far in making one feel better.

Please do keep us posted on how you are feeling. Such "taper journals" are so helpful to the people here. Especially since you're one of the few you jumped off at such a high dose. Keep up the good work and again, welcome to the forum. :)

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 10:33 am 
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hatmaker510 wrote:
Hi kinetix and welcome to our little community. I'm sorry you're not feeling well, but from what you describe and after coming off such a high dose, I would say you're actually doing pretty well. And at 9 days since your last dose you have likely passed the worst of it by now. I wanted to ask you for some clarification - what did you mean when you said Dr. J said suboxone withdrawals are "the worst"? Worse compared to what? Sub withdrawal isn't nearly as bad as full agonist (regular pain pill) withdrawals and methadone is even worse than that. It's a shame you can't take a bit more of the clonidine, but I can understand not doing so since it makes you sleepy. You're smart to exercise, as so many people report that will go far in making one feel better.

Please do keep us posted on how you are feeling. Such "taper journals" are so helpful to the people here. Especially since you're one of the few you jumped off at such a high dose. Keep up the good work and again, welcome to the forum. :)


The videos on youtube were disproving that Suboxone withdrawals were the worst. Sorry for the confusion. Thank you for the support. I'm going to buy some nice new winter clothes today and then hit the gym. You're right about the exercise. Being very fit before withdrawals and trying to get protein shakes down as well as trying to do some weight training has probably helped me more than I know.


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 Post subject: Wow!
PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 12:35 pm 
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That's impressive, to put it mildly. Rarely do people do as well as you when jumping at such a high dose. I can't believe you are actually able to go to a funeral and have already worked out, etc. You are TOUGH!!!!!

I love hearing stories about situations where people are doing okay after stopping. Even if you do feel sick still, you are painting a pretty nice picture of what it could be like only 9 days after stopping Sub. It makes me feel a whole lot less afraid.

I'm curious how long you were taking the Sub and at what dose? Did you always take 8 mg? Why did you feel you wanted to jump at that high of a dose instead of weaning? Of course, the fact that I'm weaning makes me very curious about this. I foresee my weaning process will take me quite some time, so to hear someone say they just quit and 9 days later they are actually functioning, it makes me wonder if the way I'm doing it is possibly not the smartest way and if I'm kind of torturing myself a long time instead of just jumping and coping with it. I'm at 5 mg. Weaned down from 8 over the past month.

Keep going and keep posting!! This board is the best around, IMO!!

laddertipper

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 Post subject: Sorry...
PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 12:47 pm 
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Duh, I need to read more thoroughly. You were on it for 2.5 years. That's a long enough time. I'm so friggin' amazed at how well you're doing. It kinda defies the norm. I'm still curious about whether you were on 8 that whole time and why you chose to jump so high. I know you're on Clonidine. Is that actually preventing any restless leg stuff or do you still have it? Can you sleep okay? How much of the day are you up and doing stuff like normal?

I hope the mental part gets better soon. In my opinion, that is harder than the physical part. I'm about the start Zoloft, even though I've been so anti-anti-depressant, or anti-more drugs, I should say. I want to try to protect my brain a little. Sub withdrawal has turned me into quite a maniac in the past. :oops: Would you consider something like Zoloft? It will take a while for your mind to fully rebound from the absence of the Sub. It's reasonable that you may need a bit more help, chemically speaking.

You are doing amazingly well!! Congratulations!!!

laddertipper

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 Post subject: Re: Sorry...
PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 1:30 pm 
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laddertipper wrote:
Duh, I need to read more thoroughly. You were on it for 2.5 years. That's a long enough time. I'm so friggin' amazed at how well you're doing. It kinda defies the norm. I'm still curious about whether you were on 8 that whole time and why you chose to jump so high. I know you're on Clonidine. Is that actually preventing any restless leg stuff or do you still have it? Can you sleep okay? How much of the day are you up and doing stuff like normal?

I hope the mental part gets better soon. In my opinion, that is harder than the physical part. I'm about the start Zoloft, even though I've been so anti-anti-depressant, or anti-more drugs, I should say. I want to try to protect my brain a little. Sub withdrawal has turned me into quite a maniac in the past. :oops: Would you consider something like Zoloft? It will take a while for your mind to fully rebound from the absence of the Sub. It's reasonable that you may need a bit more help, chemically speaking.

You are doing amazingly well!! Congratulations!!!

laddertipper


Thanks laddertipper. I was on 24mg to start. I tried to taper from 8mg but i was always stuck at 8-10mg. I was so fed up with being constipated that I actually skipped my sub for the day so I could go. Benefiber + Milk of Magnesia + stool softener wouldn't touch it. I didnt even go til day 3 off subs it was that serious. I was at my buddies house and he said to me "you're getting off it now". So I gave him my sub. He gave me 4 lorazepam, which I took once for the first 4 days. Day 5 i felt pretty good, but from day 5 til now have only been subtle improvements. I don't know much about Zoloft, but I do plan on trying Prozac. It gets a bad name but I like how it works.

The Clonidine works great for the sweats, but it shuts me down pretty good. I try taking low doses if I can. I usually need to nap once a day. I take 2 showers a day. I take a Clonidine and Ambien at night and usually get 5 hours of sleep on top of my 1-2 hour nap. I hate going to bed at 10pm and waking up at 3am, but what can ya do. Day 1-4 I worked 8 hour days. Day 5 I called out sick and days 6-9 I've been on vacation. I go back on day 12, and I'm pretty confident that I'll be kicking ass. If you have the will to taper, I'd say continue doing it. There is a reason you don't see many posts like this. My friend had a lot of good friends turn dope addict. He still has some and I see how they function and it scares me that I used to be that way. He has pushed me pretty hard through this and for that I thank him. I got restless leg days 6-8, but nothing last night thank the lord. Overall I wish i had tapered lower. I was bad at it, my friend caught me at a good time. I can't wait til its over.


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 Post subject: Wow....
PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 2:30 pm 
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Thanks for answering. You have some major guts to have jumped at 8 when you struggled with TAPERING from 8. Weren't you scared?! I guess you just faced down the boogie-man...and you survived. :shock: I've never had the plugged-bung-hole problem you suffered, lol. TMI?!

At least you are sleeping, even though it's not a whole lot. The best thing to remember, IMO, is that this is the WORST it will be. You are far enough out that you can safely say that.

I feel ridiculous saying that going from 6 to 5 has been tough, lol. Well, I guess, you did say that tapering was hard for you, as well. This drug can be so crazy confusing. For example, because of the ceiling effect, supposedly jumping at 16 would be about the same as jumping at 4. So, that makes me question all this time I'm spending weaning down. But I just am not as tough as you, frankly. :wink: That's the bottom line.

I think it's a good idea to go onto an anti-depressant. You're going through enough, and it's a valid chemical unbalance that will take a while to correct itself. Zoloft is good because it's not tough to go off. I'm really hesitant to take anything that gives you hell when you want to quit it. (e.g. Paxil, Effexor, etc.) Plus, my seizure threshold rules lots of stuff out. Prozac is safe. If it works for you, take it!! I really want you to keep being successful and to keep posting. Nobody will ever judge you here. Even when you feel fed up and cannot be Superman.

I think you're doing great. Don't ever even think about taking those opiates again. That's what you have to promise yourself. If you get a little urge, go onto youtube and type 'opiate withdrawal' into the search thing and watch some vids :wink: When I used to get alcohol cravings, I had a stack of pics of me with this gigantic bloated head and double chin to refer to. And I'd written 'Letters from Beside the Toilet Bowl' to remind myself what it felt like to be a drunk.

laddertipper

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 Post subject: Re: Wow....
PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 2:56 pm 
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laddertipper wrote:
Thanks for answering. You have some major guts to have jumped at 8 when you struggled with TAPERING from 8. Weren't you scared?! I guess you just faced down the boogie-man...and you survived. :shock: I've never had the plugged-bung-hole problem you suffered, lol. TMI?!

At least you are sleeping, even though it's not a whole lot. The best thing to remember, IMO, is that this is the WORST it will be. You are far enough out that you can safely say that.

I feel ridiculous saying that going from 6 to 5 has been tough, lol. Well, I guess, you did say that tapering was hard for you, as well. This drug can be so crazy confusing. For example, because of the ceiling effect, supposedly jumping at 16 would be about the same as jumping at 4. So, that makes me question all this time I'm spending weaning down. But I just am not as tough as you, frankly. :wink: That's the bottom line.

I think it's a good idea to go onto an anti-depressant. You're going through enough, and it's a valid chemical unbalance that will take a while to correct itself. Zoloft is good because it's not tough to go off. I'm really hesitant to take anything that gives you hell when you want to quit it. (e.g. Paxil, Effexor, etc.) Plus, my seizure threshold rules lots of stuff out. Prozac is safe. If it works for you, take it!! I really want you to keep being successful and to keep posting. Nobody will ever judge you here. Even when you feel fed up and cannot be Superman.

I think you're doing great. Don't ever even think about taking those opiates again. That's what you have to promise yourself. If you get a little urge, go onto youtube and type 'opiate withdrawal' into the search thing and watch some vids :wink: When I used to get alcohol cravings, I had a stack of pics of me with this gigantic bloated head and double chin to refer to. And I'd written 'Letters from Beside the Toilet Bowl' to remind myself what it felt like to be a drunk.

laddertipper


Yea tapering made me crazy. I'd think about Subs all friggin day. I actually wasn't scared to go off. Which is funny because if I left my suboxone at home on accident i'd freak out and have panic attacks even if i was without it for a half a day. I have no desire to ever go back to opiates. It ruined my last relationship. Well I ruined it because I hid that I was on Subs when I told her I was off it. I'll definitely keep posting. Thanks for the support man, really helps. If you have an arsenal of Imodium, a benzo, a sleeping pill, Clonidine, and some support from a friend or family member. You can do it.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 4:39 pm 
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I was going to wait til tomorrow to post this, but I just got back from the gym and feel too good to not post. Figured i'd sweat doing something rather than nothing. I took a sliver of Clonidine before hand to avoid being in a pool of sweat. Surprisingly I was not sweating balls. I actually had a nice intense workout. Pull ups, bent over rows, barbell and dumbell curls, and upright rows at weight I did before withdrawals. I did a little tanning afterwards. Now that feels wonderful. At this very moment I feel like i'm not even in withdrawal. I have a surge of energy, body temp is up, sweating at a minimum, and bowels in check. I thought i'd pass this along.

PS i've been jamming out to these 2 songs all day. Figured i'd share the joy. The Black Keys - Tighten Up / The Temper Trap - Fader


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 Post subject: Nuts...
PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 5:16 pm 
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I can't believe you already feel this good! I wonder if you have a very fast metabolism and it helped clear it out faster? I 100% believe that the exercise is making a huge difference. Exercise always helps things. And then the tanning....man, I know about the cancer thing, but I love tanning beds....

You sound like you feel really...ALIVE! Enjoying music and being physically active. I don't know how your brain is recovering so fast but the fact that it is amazes me. You are either really tough or damn lucky or both.

I'm going to print this and keep it for something to read when I finally do jump. It may really help on Days 3, 5, etc.

WoooHoooo!!

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 5:56 pm 
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Yeah tanning can be bad for ya but screw it. It feels good to be sexified after feeling like crap all week. If I didn't have sweats i'd say the withdrawals are over. I can medicate for the sleep issue. I'm going out with some buddies tonight. and yes, I do feel good : )

I'm glad I could be an inspiration. Tapering is obviously the least painful way. But I can say for sure that after experiencing this I will not want to go through it again.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 6:23 pm 
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It's great that you're doing so well. I know someone who jumped off at 12 mg and only missed a half-day of work - and that was just to go and get some clonidine. So it's not that uncommon to be doing this well at day 9-10. Not that I'm belittling your challenge, not at all. It's tough but I guess my point is it's totally do-able. Remember, the most miserable people scream the loudest. In other words the people who are bitching the most about "hellish suboxone w/d" on the online forums aren't really the majority. Keep up the good work.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 8:09 pm 
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Why, Why, Why don't they play good music like Tighten Up and Fader on any radio stations I listen to? WHY?

I liked tighten up, it was good, but fader was great!!

For a minute there, I thought I was going to stand up and start dancing around...I can imagine how those songs get you going during your exercise program.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 24, 2010 11:22 pm 
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OK, now look what you've done...I've been listening to Fader for hours now. The music and lyrics really got me...especially Bless this Mess, We tried our Best, That's all that we can do, While the Angels walk, With the Lonely Ones, In the Cold Rain to Rescue YOU.

I've got Angels walking with me when I'm lonely and they came to rescue ME...anyone going through any kind of detox should get goosebumps when they hear that.

I know even after all this time, I still get that old lonely feeling at times partially because so few understand how difficult detox is for most of us, then I hear I've got Angels walking with me and I feel all better.

Thank you so much for sharing these songs.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 25, 2010 9:11 am 
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Romeo wrote:
OK, now look what you've done...I've been listening to Fader for hours now. The music and lyrics really got me...especially Bless this Mess, We tried our Best, That's all that we can do, While the Angels walk, With the Lonely Ones, In the Cold Rain to Rescue YOU.

I've got Angels walking with me when I'm lonely and they came to rescue ME...anyone going through any kind of detox should get goosebumps when they hear that.

I know even after all this time, I still get that old lonely feeling at times partially because so few understand how difficult detox is for most of us, then I hear I've got Angels walking with me and I feel all better.

Thank you so much for sharing these songs.


Glad you liked the songs Romeo, I'll have to check out the ones you listed. Music can be very powerful IMO.

Day 10

I woke up today and I felt pretty good. Forced myself to stay up til 12:30 so I could get back to a normal sleep cycle. I slept til 6 so that makes me happy. I'm trying to avoid coffee for today so I got some gatorade and made a protein shake. So far no sweats, but hopefully I dont jinx myself. I haven't had a Clonidine since 6:00pm last night. I'm glad I don't feel the need to nuke myself in the shower for 30 mins to feel good today. If it wasn't turkey day i'd probably go to the gym. I'm relieved at how well I currently feel. Barely any fatigue. It comes in small waves. Ya'll have a happy thanksgiving.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 6:37 pm 
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Day 11

I fell asleep at 9 with the help of ambien. I woke up at 2 am as expected. Getting a consistent 5 hours of sleep. I took a half an ambien and clonidine at 2:30 as I knew I wouldn't be able to sleep again, and I wanted more rest. I had to get up for work at 5:30 am. I worked a solid 10 hours today. It was an extremely long day. I had waves of fatigue and some cold spells, but no sweats. I only sat down once. I smoked a ton of cigs, but alas I made it out alive. Gonna eat, rest, then hit the gym. Its funny that I don't feel withdrawals when I lift. It feels good just like a hot shower. All in all i'm very happy and greatful for my progress.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 6:56 pm 
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Congratulations!! on day 11, especially from coming off such a high dose...I'm flabbergasted[sup]2[/sup] with your progress.

You smoke and go to the gym to exercise...you sound like me...I just walked around my subdivision and smoked a cig. I rarely hear of someone like you who exercises seriously and smokes. I'm not trashing you, not at all. Just find it interesting.

Your doing so well with your wd's, I hope you know how fortunate you are. I jumped at 2mg and was way worse off than you are. It simply amazes me how different we all are. No doubt your exercise routine helps a great deal.

Keep hanging in there, man...you are simply doing amazing!!

Oh yeah, I watched the video for tighten up for the first time today (courtesy of Diary of a Quitter) and it was great fun. I've got Fader blaring in my ears as I type...Love that feel good song. Thanks again!


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 7:42 pm 
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Thanks Romeo. Yea it is very contradictory to smoke and go to the gym. I've lost almost 10lbs in the last 2 weeks so i'm very determined to get back up. I do feel as if I cut a little bit of fat, and hardly any muscle. I'm surprised i'm doing as well as I am. Everyday is still a challenge to get through. I think forcing myself to eat, drink protein shakes, and exercise are the biggest contributors. Anyway, got a new song for ya.

Crookers ft Mike Snow - Remedy


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