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PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2017 11:22 pm 
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This is a pretty horrifying article from Mother Jones. Death from opiate withdrawal is rare of course, but
prisons often ignore inmates who are in severe withdrawal. Dehydration....because severely ill addicts
can't keep anything down... in combination with runaway diarrhea....can be deadly if not treated appropriately with I.V. fluids.

As I read through this piece...I couldn't finish it so disturbing was it...I thought about how easy it would be
to treat these acutely sick people with buprenorphine. Not only would their intense WD symptoms be almost instantanteously relieved, they might well leave prison with a great start on a genuine lasting recovery.

What a wasted opportunity! We live in the 21st century, but you wouldn't know it from the barbaric way we treat people suffering from a terrible, and all too often deadly disease. We might as well throw diabetics in jail and take away their insulin.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/201 ... ail-deaths


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 2:07 am 
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I don't have time to read it now but I absolutely will tomorrow. I agree with you godfrey!


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 3:34 am 
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Hi Godfrey
What a tragic article, it just makes me so angry that the war on drugs takes such heavy casualties from the day a person starts using right through to the unhappy end game of jail.
If those actions or lack of duty of care were applied to any other member of society it would surely be a case of manslaughter.
I am in Australia and i hope given our more relaxed laws on recreational drugs and the relative ease to get suboxone therapy even in jail that this story is not being replicated here.
So sad that this is happening to good young people who still had so much to give.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 8:36 am 
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What a tragic article, it just makes me so angry that the war on drugs takes such heavy casualties from the day a person starts using right through to the unhappy end game of jail.


Thanks for this mik... Often when the government begins prosecuting a figurative "war" on something, it's time to watch out for a multitude of unintended consequences. The war on drugs....which is precisely analogous to the moronic Prohibition in the U.S. (of alcohol, mostly in the 1920's), has been predictably catastrophic. I can't wrap my mind around the tragic idiocy of what's going on in Mexico. That such horrifying violence and rampant corruption are tolerated is almost literally unbelievable... in a supposedly modern, civilized, compassionate society.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 10:09 am 
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This is something that is happening for sure. The county my clinic is in, in Kentucky, an inmate died of benzo withdrawal from being left and not checked on. I don't know the facts about it, at my doctors office last week I was told about it.

The last time I went to jail, I'd taken a lot more medication than I normally did because we were pulled over in a traffic stop, before we stopped our car I took every oxycodone I had so I wouldn't be charged with it..... dumb idea I know because I was charged with a whole lot regardless. But I remember after getting booked in and in my bed, I passed out laying on the wrong end of the bed. I didn't wake up or move until the next day. Nobody checked on me. I could have been overdosing for all they knew.

I already knew that addicts are seen as less than, it didn't surprise me that nobody checked. U become another number in jail. Ur family has no way of knowing if ur ok, sometimes u can't make a phone call for days and that's if u have family to bring money for ur books or phone card. Nobody in there will let u use their minutes. So besides the phone call in booking, ur isolated with no way to tell anyone that loves u how ur doing. Ur solely at the mercy of the correction officers, and that's scary. Some are good some are awful and ur life is in their hands.

I think there needs to be a better protocol in all jails to treat any type of dangerous withdrawal. Some do have those protocols and follow them, some don't. Heck a few months ago, one of our police officers and one of our correction officers were both fired and charged with drug charges. One was selling drugs to inmates and one was stealing narcotics from the evidence room! It made pretty big headlines around here. So if u have ppl selling to inmates, they're definitely not doing their job on following protocols. It's ridiculous.

As usual Godfrey, u know how to spark a conversation :)
Great topic!

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 10:32 am 
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I won't even jump into that whole "war on drugs" joke that our federal/state/ and local law enforcement enjoys the persecuting of otherwise innocent people...
War on marijuana? Why don't they have a war on ragweed...
Or roses. Or hycenta. Or crepe myrtles?....
Because that would be absurd, right? to have a law that prosecutes people for growing those named plants in their yards?
Maybe a war on tomatoes...
I try to keep away from the thoughts of our backwards-ass society, and since I've been in jail..forced into withdrawal and 23 days later, released...I know the horrors of it.
I wasn't that bad when I got arrested...5-6 norcos/lortabs per day..so I was "young" in my addiction.

Now if I had gotten arrested during my oxycontin binges...I have no doubt I would've likely had some more serious health issues....
Normally, when I would 'come down' from those 3-4 day weekends of doing oxy, I would take 20-30 lortab 10's to "soften" the crash.
That was just the initial day and 2nd day after ...
There is nothing more horrid ...and i can't imagine having to face that in a jail cell.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 10:38 am 
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Good morning Godfrey, Thank you so much for sharing that article with us. This is so upsetting to me and something I have been working to stop for thirty years. I have seen it happen time and again with the mental health or lack of mental health treatment for inmates. A few years back, we had a young man from an affluent family wind up in our county jail. This young man was battling drug addiction and mental illness. He was denied access to his medication. He went into withdrawl and was very depressed. He committed suicide on his fourth night there. He was eighteen years old and had been picked up on a warrant for an unpaid speeding ticket. His parents had no idea where he was. He had been denied access to both his methadone and paxil. Unfortunately, that had to happen before they hired two probation officers with mental health experience to work with and address the needs of any inmate who identifies as having mental health issues. They will also address the needs of anyone who informs them that they take medication for addiction. It took a very long time and the death of this young man to shed light on the need for this treatment! I was hoping that things were starting to get better! As much as I am not a fan of our Governor here in NJ, he has put money into treatment! Have a great day everyone!


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 7:08 pm 
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This was on the news the other day.
http://www.npr.org/sections/health-shot ... -addiction

it's an implant (like the birth control Norplant? they put under the skin in your arm) it releases a small dose on a schedule.

Like someone said in the article, i want this in case i go to jail so they can't take it away!

Also A good friend was in jail AGAIN. They took him off his Suboxone cold turkey when he went to jail!? wtf?

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 7:10 pm 
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godfrey wrote:
This is a pretty horrifying article from Mother Jones. Death from opiate withdrawal is rare of course, but
prisons often ignore inmates who are in severe withdrawal. Dehydration....because severely ill addicts
can't keep anything down... in combination with runaway diarrhea....can be deadly if not treated appropriately with I.V. fluids.

As I read through this piece...I couldn't finish it so disturbing was it...I thought about how easy it would be
to treat these acutely sick people with buprenorphine. Not only would their intense WD symptoms be almost instantanteously relieved, they might well leave prison with a great start on a genuine lasting recovery.

What a wasted opportunity! We live in the 21st century, but you wouldn't know it from the barbaric way we treat people suffering from a terrible, and all too often deadly disease. We might as well throw diabetics in jail and take away their insulin.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/201 ... ail-deaths


isn't it probably the xanax withdrawal that killed him?

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:56 pm 
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No, I don't believe so, since he died of dehydration. If he had died while seizing I would say yes.

Amy

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 10:16 pm 
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Amy-Work In Progress wrote:
No, I don't believe so, since he died of dehydration. If he had died while seizing I would say yes.

Amy

yeah, i agree not the xanax. that was hard for me to finish reading. a relative, who i raised as my own child is locked up from a murder committed for heroin.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 10:26 pm 
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Jesus christ. My friend's kid who was on lots of different drugs but who committed a non-violent drug crime, is gay and has been gang raped twice and attacked on other occasions in the four years he's been in. He certainly tried to hide that he was gay, but another guy who knew him from the drug world spread it around after the guy was locked up with my friend's son. It has made him a target and the guards do not help him. The only way to be safe is to get put in solitary for breaking a rule!!

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 12, 2017 10:35 pm 
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Amy-Work In Progress wrote:
Jesus christ. My friend's kid who was on lots of different drugs but who committed a non-violent drug crime, is gay and has been gang raped twice and attacked on other occasions in the four years he's been in. He certainly tried to hide that he was gay, but another guy who knew him from the drug world spread it around after the guy was locked up with my friend's son. It has made him a target and the guards do not help him. The only way to be safe is to get put in solitary for breaking a rule!!

Amy

wow that sucks. i wish the jail would do something to help him. they are supposed to have zero tolerance for sex and RAPE! maybe they should have gay blocks? that's actually a good idea. not every prison/jail could do that, but the larger ones.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 12:08 am 
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SisterMorphine wrote:
This was on the news the other day.
http://www.npr.org/sections/health-shot ... -addiction

it's an implant (like the birth control Norplant? they put under the skin in your arm) it releases a small dose on a schedule.

Like someone said in the article, i want this in case i go to jail so they can't take it away!

Also A good friend was in jail AGAIN. They took him off his Suboxone cold turkey when he went to jail!? wtf?



Good article for the most part, but they get a lot wrong...which is typical.

This jumped out at me

"This (buprenorphine) molecule binds to opioid receptors in the body, but doesn't hit them as hard as something like heroin or morphine would. So it can reduce cravings without giving a full high. It's often taken in combination with a medication called naloxone, which negates the effect of any additional opiates and acts as an antidote for overdoses. "

Lots of mistakes here. ...without giving a "full high" bothers me most. Whatever that might be. There's no high, except perhaps a very transitory one in a very few people who are taking large maintenance doses. But this gives the impression the bupe taker is still getting high...

And the stuff on naloxone is a mess as well if they're talking about the small amount in suboxone. It's unclear as to whether they are.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 12:18 am 
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godfrey wrote:
SisterMorphine wrote:
This was on the news the other day.
http://www.npr.org/sections/health-shot ... -addiction

it's an implant (like the birth control Norplant? they put under the skin in your arm) it releases a small dose on a schedule.

Like someone said in the article, i want this in case i go to jail so they can't take it away!

Also A good friend was in jail AGAIN. They took him off his Suboxone cold turkey when he went to jail!? wtf?



Good article for the most part, but they get a lot wrong...which is typical.

This jumped out at me

"This (buprenorphine) molecule binds to opioid receptors in the body, but doesn't hit them as hard as something like heroin or morphine would. So it can reduce cravings without giving a full high. It's often taken in combination with a medication called naloxone, which negates the effect of any additional opiates and acts as an antidote for overdoses. "

Lots of mistakes here. ...without giving a "full high" bothers me most. Whatever that might be. There's no high, except perhaps a very transitory one in a very few people who are taking large maintenance doses. But this gives the impression the bupe taker is still getting high...

And the stuff on naloxone is a mess as well if they're talking about the small amount in suboxone. It's unclear as to whether they are.


hey godfrey
i did read the article i linked to and i didn't notice anything glaring out that was wrong, but the points you make seem correct. what i saw was on a local news channel, so i googled what they were talking about. there are other articles on it that may get it "more" right. this was just the one I picked that talked about the implant and related it to inmates.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 2:03 am 
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Quote:
hey godfrey
i did read the article i linked to and i didn't notice anything glaring out that was wrong, but the points you make seem correct. what i saw was on a local news channel, so i googled what they were talking about. there are other articles on it that may get it "more" right. this was just the one I picked that talked about the implant and related it to inmates.
[/quote]

Hi Sister,
You're right, the basis of the article .....that is the stuff regarding implant information seems very helpful. I'm sorry for nitpicking. I didn't mean to imply you were somehow at fault for not noticing. I was reading along happily wondering if at some point I might get one of those, when I saw the "not a full high" stuff. I was on the verge of letting it go, then thought, well perhaps some struggling newcomer reads it and gets the impression he's going to get high ....sort of....and that he'll be protected against overdoses...if he switches to bupe, by reason of the small amount of naloxone...

I respect you a lot sister. Not the slightest reflection on you implied.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 7:35 am 
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godfrey wrote:
Quote:
hey godfrey
i did read the article i linked to and i didn't notice anything glaring out that was wrong, but the points you make seem correct. what i saw was on a local news channel, so i googled what they were talking about. there are other articles on it that may get it "more" right. this was just the one I picked that talked about the implant and related it to inmates.


Hi Sister,
You're right, the basis of the article .....that is the stuff regarding implant information seems very helpful. I'm sorry for nitpicking. I didn't mean to imply you were somehow at fault for not noticing. I was reading along happily wondering if at some point I might get one of those, when I saw the "not a full high" stuff. I was on the verge of letting it go, then thought, well perhaps some struggling newcomer reads it and gets the impression he's going to get high ....sort of....and that he'll be protected against overdoses...if he switches to bupe, by reason of the small amount of naloxone...

I respect you a lot sister. Not the slightest reflection on you implied.[/quote]

no worries, i didn't even think you were nitpicking. i was just trying to clear up why i posted that article, and that it was just for the content relating to the implant and inmates.
thanks for the kind compliment!

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