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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 4:44 pm 
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Hello,

I started suboxone yesterday again after a 2 month relapse that nearly killed me. I waited about 16 hours from my last oxy and felt pretty crappy then took my 8 mg tablet with no ill effects. Today I took my 8 mg tablet a few hours ago and felt ok for awhile but now for some reason have a bit of rls going on and craving. (Although dealing with mental cravings is normal for me on sub. At least that's what my experience has been on it). Is it just because I need to take it a few more days and stabilize? I was doing anywhere from 100-200 mgs of oxy a day with the average being 160+ mgs a day. Is it normal to still experience a bit of withdrawl when you first start out on sub? I was on sub a couple months before I relapsed but don't remember if I had these symptoms when I first started. Any advice would be appreciated!


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 5:54 pm 
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Anyone?

I just took another 2 mgs just to see if it helps. Not sure if I should have waited it out but I can't see the doctor til Monday and I hate the RLS, craving and anxiety I'm having...is this normal when you first start??


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 7:25 pm 
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i dont know a ton about PW except for what i have read on here but i would think that PW woud happen (if it was going to happen at all) immedietly after the initial dose. I dont think it would happen on the second dose but not the first dose. i would discuss this with your doctor. I do know know how much oxy you were taking before you started subs but you might need a little more then the dose you are on?? i was taking oxy as well before i got on subs..i was clean for 2 weeks then relapsed for less then 1.5 months. I got on subs and stayed steady on 8-12mgs for 8 months with no problems at all. I recently started a taper. Anyways, Im telling you about my experience for comparison...if that helps. I would def discuss it with your doctor though.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 8:34 pm 
You might be getting poor absorbtion, how long do you hold it under your tongue? When you put it under your tongue immediately start pushing it around with your tongue and keep doing so until it is completely dissolved, it dissolves in like a minute pills or film if you use your tonuge to help it along. It doesnt start absorbing until its in a solution so thats why its best to break it down with your tongue instead of waiting, if you just leave it there you build up a bunch of saliva before its even broken down and turned to a solution and then a bunch gets washed away. I get RLS and other withdrawal symptoms all the time because of the inconsitant absorbtion factor and ive been on subs for a bit over six months, it realy is a pain in the ass medication I wish it could just be swallowed.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 11:51 pm 
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Thanks, yeah suboxowned I really think a big problem with sub is the inconsistent rate of absorption. What a dumb ass formulation. I agree, why not make it simple and have it be swallowed? I'm not sure if the film is any better but am thinking about asking the pharmacist if he's got any I can try next prescription so I can compare for myself. I took another 2 mgs and that seemed to improve things a bit. I am going to just take 8 mgs tommorow though and see if maybe it was a freak thing today with 8 not working as well as it did the day before. Maybe like you said this particular pill didnt dissolve properly and I had a good part of it wash away. I hate everything about the pill itself - the awful taste, the fact you need to let it dissolve and sometimes it takes forever, the fact that dissolving it is a very unreliable way to get all the medication..I could go on. But I cannot complain about the main thing - that it's helped me get out of active addiction virtually overnight and for that I'm VERY grateful. If only they'd change the formulation and make a pill you could swallow and that you knew you were getting all the medicine that would be great. For the insane cost of sub they could at least make a reliable pill! ok done complaining :)

Bitzy glad to hear you've done well for the last 8 months. How is the taper going? Do you feel the dose drops a lot or no?
I'm for sure going to mention it to my doctor Monday and see what he says. I'm hoping this is just a normal part of stabilizing but really wonder how much medicine I'm getting. I usually stick it under my tongue and leave it in one spot and swallow only when I absolutely have to. Not sure if I'm doing it right but thats what the doctor told me to do but I'll try the moving it around method and see if that works better. Thanks both of you for replying.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2011 1:13 am 
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I just wanted to say I'm glad you made it back this time and I hope that was your last time out. Like you said, sub may not be perfect but it sure is better than active addiction. In my opinion, the films are better. I can't stand all the packaging and I hate the taste of the film but it is easier to cut doses down and it does seem to absorb a little better/easier/faster. I wish you luck with that.

I don't think your symptoms are normal. I also think suboxowned's experience with RLS or withdrawal symptoms is VERY odd. I wonder if there isn't some anomaly making that happen for you. There was a poster who once suggested plugging it and had a pretty good recipe for doing that and he said it worked very well. Someone else actually tried it and concurred. You may wish to try that and see if that doesn't change things for you.

I also think it is unfortunate to be having mental cravings while on suboxone. I might suggest meditation and therapy for that because I don't think NA/AA would address it unfortunately. Just my opinion.

Cherie

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2011 10:44 am 
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If you're questioning whether you need more sub because you're still having withdrawals, check out your pupils. If they are dilated, you might need a higher dose. Take what you need, don't compare your dosage to others. Once you're stabilized, you can always get to the lowest dose necessarily later on down the road.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2011 2:06 pm 
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I agree with Hat, you're coming off a relatively high dose of oxy, so you probably just need a higher dose of Sub to start out with. As far as having a tablet you can swallow - bupe breaks down on it's first pass through the liver, making it useless. Taking it Sublingually puts it directly into the bloodstream, bypassing the liver. I think all of us wish this weren't the case.
Anyway, welcome back. There's no blame and no shame. I and others have relapsed since you have been gone. It's the horrible nature of this disease. But I'm here to stay now and I hope you are, too. Hope you feel better.
Lilly


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2011 2:53 pm 
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I'm glad to be back and yes, I want to stay out of active addiction verrrry badly! . I can't chance another relapse, addiction is an ugly thing that gets uglier each day. I'm sick and tired of it and feel very committed to turning my life around. I'm trying to figure out where I start first in regards to cleaning up my life. My to-do list would be a book but I'm going to try and break it down into little goals so I don't get too overwhelmed. That's a big trigger for me, stress in general but when I get overwhelmed the cravings are intense. I think aftercare will help me a lot in changing my reflex reaction to want drugs whenever I feel bad. One thing I've noticed too the last couple days is that the sub is making me pretty sleepy. Is this common in the beginning? I don't remember being drowsy last time but maybe I've just forgotten about it. Thanks for making me feel welcome and I really appreciate the advice and support.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 10:44 am 
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Yes, drowsiness, even dizziness (some people even say a bit high) are normal when getting on (or back on) suboxone. That should pass shortly. When it comes to your to-do list, why not break that list up and give yourself one thing to do each day. When you inundate yourself with goals it can be overwhelming. So keep your goals to ones that you can reach daily. In other words, cut yourself some slack and take it slowly. You are doing great!

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:24 pm 
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hey...the taper is going good but im not that far down yet, im taking 6-8mg a day (dropping from a steady 8mg a day),this coming week i will start taking 4mg and 6 mg rotating every other day with each dose. Anyways, about your predicament; after reading more posts i agree with hatmaker, you probably do need a slightly higher dose or at least the option to take an extra half everyday as needed. in terms of a to do list; i had so much stuff i felt i needed to do once i got sober but what helped was taking it a day at the time. You can write down anything or everything you need to do but dont get overwhelmed trying to get it done. Everything falls into place once you get your life together and get on the right track to getting sober. one of my goals which i had wanted to do for years was to go back to school and finish as i had two classes left. The point is that things like going to school can take a while to complete and its not like you can just cross it off your list in a day. I think getting started is very important so make a list of things you need to by significance and then begin.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 6:01 pm 
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Sounds to me like the 8mg wasn't enough.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2011 6:40 pm 
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I don't get it. I upped to 10 mgs a day yet I'm still getting cravings, the back of my ankles ache (a wd symptom of oxy I get) and breaking out in sweats at random times, especially at night when I'm sleeping. How much sub is needed for a 160 mg (rough estimate) of oxy?? Maybe 10 still isn't enough. Thing is I can't afford to be on more! I hope I can stabilize soon.


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