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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:00 pm 
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[font=Courier New]so i have a question... could you use hydros to come off of suboxone?!? the relapse and everything aside...could you do it and not harm the baby??? and how long would you need to take them??? let me start off saying when i got on suboxone i had been taking hydros for migraines.. my body became dependent. i was not takng them to get high or anything. my friend is prescribed suboxone and gave me some and told me if i took it i would not withdraw from the hydro... so thats when i started taking it. i had no idea i could withdraw from it too!!! so now here i am im 23 weeks preg i have been takin sub for a little over 9 months now i am on 1 mg of the strip...i am trying to decide whether to taper or to take the hydros just long enough to get past the withdrawals and to get the sub out of my system. i am not prescribed it and my obgyn does not know i take it and i dont wanna have to tell them. i want to be off of it before i have my son because i do not want him to withdraw. pls write back with your opinions... [/font]

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 8:38 am 
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Hello and welcome. And congrats on your pregnancy. You are going to have to taper off either the suboxone or the hydros. But keep in mind that any withdrawals you go through while tapering off, so will the fetus. And going through w/d while pregnant puts you/the fetus at risk of miscarriage - especially in the first trimester. The best time to taper off is the second trimester. And the best way to do that would be to do it so very slowly that neither you or the fetus will barely feel it. Remember, you can be treated for opiate withdrawals, the fetus can not.

I hope this helps. Good luck to you!

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 1:03 pm 
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[font=Comic Sans MS] [/font] im 23 weeks ill be 24 friday. so im in my 2nd trimester soon to be third. so does that still put me at risk for miscarriage?!? i have been trying to taper off and the lowest i have gotten is 1 mg i start feeling withdrawals if i try to get any lower. i have been on the 1 mg for a while now.. months.. i know someone who can get me enough hydros to last me to get off of the sub and i was thinking about going to my doc afterwards and telling him i have been taking hydros for a few weeks for back pain so they can help me taper off them.. im just scared to tell them about the sub because i have been on the sub my whole pregnancy and i havent told them, everytime they ask if i take any other medications i tell them no..

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 1:36 pm 
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I urge you to tell your doctors the truth so they can better advise you and better monitor the health of you and your baby. I've seen more than a few stories on this forum from women who delivered their babies while on sub without any serious complications. Maybe some of those women might chime in here, if any of them are around to see this thread...?

Believe me I know how hard it can be to tell the truth about something like this, especially since you've been actively avoiding it for a while. But remember, it is the doctor's job to work with you and they prefer to have all the information. It is NOT their job to judge you. But of course they are human and humans do tend to judge. If I were your doctor (I'm not a doctor of course, nor any kind of medical professional) I would thank you for telling me the truth, even if I wished you had told me sooner.

Like I said I'm not a doctor, but I have heard that discontinuing sub while pregnant might be worse for the baby than staying on a stable dose. And if you do discontinue sub, it would be best to taper under doctor's care.

I wish you luck and hope you will post on this forum again, as i believe there are people here with more personal experience who may be able to offer more specific info to you.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:09 pm 
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[font=Comic Sans MS]thank you and i really hope women that have been in my situation will see this thread. i have found a few from going through the posts and i have written them. i have had a few write me back and a few have not. the women i have talked to continued their suboxone and not told their docs and some of the babies came out fine no withdrawal and others who have had withdrawal symptoms and there have been a few who have tapered off comp. i am trying. but as soon as i start feeling any withdrawal i take a little more. it worries me bc i know everything i feel my son feels. i have wanted to tell my doc i have i am just scared of what will happen and how i will be treated seeing as i have kept it from him this whole time. and i have read stories also about bein dropped by their doc and being treated diff and cps getting involved and all kiknds of things![/font]

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:42 pm 
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Actually, the risks are even higher in the third trimester, according to everything I've read. But in that case, the risk is for still birth. So as auto said, I'd also urge you to tell your doctor you've been on opiates and are dependent on them so they can help you taper off them. In my opinion it's just too risky to try to do it yourself.

I'm sorry I can't be of more help. Oh, be sure to check out Dr. Junig's blog, Suboxone TalkZone (there's a link to it at the top of the page). He has a list of topics and pregnancy is one of them. He has quite a few posts you can read.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 4:44 pm 
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ok thank u i am going to look now

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 6:53 pm 
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Hey Hat, I have read you post a few times that going off sub in the 3rd trimester puts the baby at the higher risk than the 1st or 2nd. I was wondering if you are talking about someone properly tapering off sub or someone just going cold turkey and going thru major withdrawl? Also if you can would you mind posting the link to the study that shows this? It's not that I disagree or doubt you I am just curious to see the study and wonder how the patients stopped their sub. Thanks in advance!


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 7:15 pm 
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I didn't mean to say the baby is at higher risk in the third trimester than at any other time - it's only at higher risk than the second trimester while suffering withdrawals. (What I was saying was the risk is higher THAN the second trimester.) Also, the risk of stillbirth happens to be higher in the third trimester, whereas miscarriage is the common risk in the first trimester. I'm sorry that I wasn't more clear.

I'll find a source to give you. It's been posted around here somewhere, some time. I think it was just your basic opiate withdrawal warning site. It wasn't a study or anything. And I don't believe it was specific to cold turkey or tapering. It was just a warning about the risks of opiate withdrawals during pregnancy. But I'll look for it. Again, sorry for the confusion.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 7:46 pm 
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No problem and like I said its not because I am questioning you or anything I am just curious to know more about it. I would think that tapering properly shouldn't carry the same risk as stopping cold turkey. I wonder if they are looking more at active addicts stopping because they would still be on a high dose of their doc. I don't know it just seems like there are a lot of variables. It would be interesting to see data on babies born who's mom's were on sub and properly tapered off.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 11:32 am 
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hi, i just recently had a baby and going through withdrawls from suboxone. I would only suggest taking as little as possible but the baby will be tested for suboxone and its an automatic call to cps or dhs when the baby is born possitive. They do test the baby for subs. Find the closest clinic and call them immediately! Explain you are pregnant and have been taking suboxone the whole pregnancy and your doctor doesnt know. they are very understanding at the clinics apoused to your regular ob doctor. After you are written a script, inform your doctor that you are prescribed suboxone and should have told him sooner. They did an ultra sound for me every week towards the end to make sure there is enough fluid and that the baby was growing properly. If you are getting the subs legally it looks way better! Plus the clinic will talk to dcf for you and put in a good word.

Also are you taking Suboxone or Subutex? Subutex is what they give you while you are pregnant because it doesn't have the same things in it as suboxone that can harm the baby. Suboxone is not completely safe for your baby but Subutex is. They definitely need to know what you are taking so they can properly monitor the baby.

As for getting off them, you are already at 1mg? 1 mg a day or 1mg every couple hours? It should be easy to get off them at that point but i know for a fact it isnt and the more pregnant you are the more your body feels like it needs it. Ive been told there is no safe way to completely get off the medicine and if there was i would have.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 11:41 am 
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It's my understanding that CPS is only called if the mom tests positive for meds that are illicit and NOT prescribed by a physician. If mom is on sub legitimately, then no call to CPS would need to be made. And consider that testing for illicit drugs will depend on state laws and hospital policy.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 5:32 pm 
I know that people who are pregnant should be on Subutex, not Suboxone..but I don't know about tapering off for pregnancy.

Doctors usually do not taper people off methadone while pregnant, because the withdrawal can cause a miscarriage.

This page actually suggests methadone over Suboxone for pregnancy, but that is the first time I have heard that suggested.
http://www.buppractice.com/node/2641

I believe this article is actually from the doctor who runs this forum.
http://www.wellsphere.com/drug-addictio ... ne/1108122

I'm looking, and most of the things I am finding say that you should NOT discontinue buprenorphine while pregnant..but I think there are a lot of variables to consider. If you are on a low dose and it is early in the pregnancy, it may be okay. Listen to your doctor on this one!

P.S. Someone in an earlier post suggested that the second trimester was the best time for coming off Suboxone. I don't know if this is correct or incorrect, but it sounds funny and I can't find a single source to support it. If it is right, I would love to see a source, so that if I ever see this question on a forum again I can answer correctly.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 6:28 pm 
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hey! i am on 1 mg a day. i have been on the 1 mg a day for months now and for the past few days i have been splitting the 1 mg in half and taking half when i wake up and then the other half later in the day when i feel i need it. i am also wondering if it is a proven fact that babies experience withdrawal symptoms bc many do not when theyre born so im wondering if its just the nurses that confuse normal newborn behavior with withdrawal bc of them knowing the mother was on it. also i am 24 weeks.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2011 8:40 pm 
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With regard to it being safer in the second trimester, here's one source:

http://www.med.uvm.edu/vchip/Downloads/ ... BABUSE.pdf

"The decision to be on medication or not is a serious one. Generally, MAT is reserved for anyone who has tried to stop using before and has been unsuccessful. If a woman who is on methadone or buprenorphine becomes pregnant, the decision to stop the medication is discouraged. However, in certain cases, it can be allowed, but a taper should ideally occur during the second trimester to minimize any risk to the pregnancy. Again, the benefits of MAT generally outweigh any risks when pregnant, as a return to drug use is not desired."

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 12:01 am 
dollbabycass wrote:
hey! i am on 1 mg a day. i have been on the 1 mg a day for months now and for the past few days i have been splitting the 1 mg in half and taking half when i wake up and then the other half later in the day when i feel i need it. i am also wondering if it is a proven fact that babies experience withdrawal symptoms bc many do not when theyre born so im wondering if its just the nurses that confuse normal newborn behavior with withdrawal bc of them knowing the mother was on it. also i am 24 weeks.


Around 70% of babies experience neonatal withdrawal from methadone, but buprenorphine is less studied.

I would imagine it would be similar..I don't see how you can feed something opiates for nine months and expect it not to have withdrawal symptoms upon discontinuation.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14616186

^^This study suggests that neonatal withdrawal is not as bad with bupe as it is with methadone

So does this one

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa1005359


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:54 am 
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Ironic is correct-you should be on Subutex NOT Suboxone.The Nalaxone can have harmful effects on a fetus.Just do the right thing by #1, telling your doctor,its the best thing for the baby.Right now the baby is priority. #2 Please get it prescribed by a doctor,it will not only look better on your part but things like that make me worry that some day they will make it like Methadone,having to go to a clinic everyday to get the medication because people divert it to the streets for abuse or give it to their friends to try without a script.This is serious stuff and I hope you talk to your doctor soon to do right by your baby.You are on such a low dose,perhaps its possiblt to try and quit now.Trust me when I say now that a babies on the way,unless you have an exceptional support system,you will not have the time to check out of life for a wk or so to recover from this medicine.See if its at all possible you do it now and get it over with and then it will be out of the babies system by the time he is born.Good luck!

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 9:18 am 
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If we suspect drug use by the mother when she comes to us in labor, either by her admission, little or no prenatal care, prior known drug use, etc., we do a urine drug screen on her. Then, after the delivery, the baby's urine is tested, and a meconium drug screen is also done. The urine drug screens, which we get the results of within about an hour, show what is currently in the patient's system as of the last day or two. The meconium drug screen, which takes about 10 days for the results to come back, shows what has been in the baby's system for the last several weeks. We also begin Neonatal Abstinence Syndrome Scoring (NASS) on the baby, which means that we check their vital signs and score them every 4 hours around the clock. The way the scoring system works is that points are assigned to certain withdrawal symptoms that the baby is exhibiting and the severity of each. Different symptoms that we see include increased temperature, increased respiratory rate, tremors, high-pitched crying, poor feeding, sleep problems, tight muscle tone, excoriation of the skin, sneezing, diarrhea (which causes terrible diaper rash), excessive and inconsolable crying, in addition to many others. If the baby scores an 8 or above, we then score them again in 2 hours. If they get an 8 or above for 3 consecutive times, they are then started on morphine, and the dosage is adjusted slowly up or down every few days, depending on their NASS score, the goal being to ultimately wean them off of the morphine. When they are started on morphine, it usually takes weeks before they are weaned off completely (a normal baby is usually discharged after two days).

In addition to the morphine, these babies usually need a lot of care, swaddling, a dark and quiet environment, and sometimes it is just not possible to comfort them because of their irritability and suffering. The worst thing is that IT CAN AND SHOULD HAVE BEEN PREVENTED.”

The article then went on to talk about how birthcontrol should be a requirement for women who are on opiate replacement drugs-Subutex,Methadone.It is my personal opinion that someone should wean completely before becoming pregnant.Pregnancy can be prevented.But...now that you already are pregnant,please do the right thing by telling your doctor and getting prescribed legally.There is nothing worse than feeling guilty over something with your own child that possibly could have been prevented.Be honest with yourself and your doctor.Keep us posted.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 1:13 pm 
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when i became pregnant we had no idea. if i would have known i would have gotten off of the suboxone before. when i learned i was preg i was takinig around 4 mg a day and i have tapered down to 1 mg and have been on the 1 mg for quite a while. i dont want to be on the suboxone when i have my son i want to be completely off of it and forgotten about it i want to enjoy the rest of my pregnancy. i will be 25 weeks friday. i am wondering if there is a better way to taper... i am very scared about my son feeling the withdrawals and it hurting him so i want to do this to where i experience little or no withdrawals. all of my ob appts my son has been perfectly healthy. his heartrate is always in the 150s and kicks me thropughout the day everyday so he is very active and in my ultrasounds he is perfect nothing wrong with him and progressing along normally. i do noto have the money to get on suboxone and my insurance will not cover me and i dont want on it or subutex or anything else i just want off all together

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2011 2:10 pm 
dollbabycass wrote:
when i became pregnant we had no idea. if i would have known i would have gotten off of the suboxone before. when i learned i was preg i was takinig around 4 mg a day and i have tapered down to 1 mg and have been on the 1 mg for quite a while. i dont want to be on the suboxone when i have my son i want to be completely off of it and forgotten about it i want to enjoy the rest of my pregnancy. i will be 25 weeks friday. i am wondering if there is a better way to taper... i am very scared about my son feeling the withdrawals and it hurting him so i want to do this to where i experience little or no withdrawals. all of my ob appts my son has been perfectly healthy. his heartrate is always in the 150s and kicks me thropughout the day everyday so he is very active and in my ultrasounds he is perfect nothing wrong with him and progressing along normally. i do noto have the money to get on suboxone and my insurance will not cover me and i dont want on it or subutex or anything else i just want off all together


You really need to talk to your OBGYN ASAP. You may be on a low enough dose that you can taper a tiny bit more, quickly, and discontinue. They may want you on Subutex.

Suboxone (as in, not Subutex) is not good for a fetus. The naloxone can harm it.

I don't want to be rude, really, but you said you don't have the money to switch. You need to get the money, because this child needs to be the biggest priority for you for the next 18 years, as I am sure you know. You gotta do whatever it is you gotta do. Raising a child costs a lot of money, I doubt this expense will even compare to a couple years of shoes..they outgrow those shoes in days! Now that you have decided to have the child, you need to realize that the Suboxone can cause potentially disastrous effects on the fetus, and you NEED to consult a doctor and take the route that is the most likely to cause the least harm to your baby, whatever route that may be.

This is a REALLY big deal.


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