It is currently Mon Aug 21, 2017 4:16 am



All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Our Sponsors





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 14 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 1:42 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:21 pm
Posts: 8
I have been on subutex 8mg for 2 yrs...since day one I always would chew the tablet...let the pieces dissolve for 20 to 30 secs and swallow the liquid always with a drink...coffee or tea...do you think I am getting the 8mg per day?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 4:30 am 
Offline
Power Poster
Power Poster
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 7:20 am
Posts: 55
Oh man no way! :shock:

I would wager 1mg if you're lucky!!

If you think about it most of the dissolved liquid is being swallowed? Not much can be absorbed in that time.

When I put mine under my tongue to let it dissolve and absorb really well, it takes ME 30-40 minutes. I can't talk, or tlt my head forward, I breath through my mouth so I does not get too wet. No man I just can't see any possibility that you are absorbing much if any...


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 5:46 am 
Offline
6 Months or More
6 Months or More
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 3:53 am
Posts: 223
Well if what you have been doing is working fine and you aren't having any issues I guess there's no immediate reason to alter your method. Although, assuming you were to maximize absorption, you could probably take a much lower dose and achieve the same results.

Chewing the tablet certainly isn't a good idea and only having it in your mouth for under a minute will definitely waste a good portion of the buprenorphine. I remember reading that the average absorption time for the FILM was something like 5-7 mins and the time for the tablet was something like 8-12. It also says to not eat or drink 15 mins after taking it.

You would be better off dividing the tablet into small pieces beforehand rather than chewing it. Also, what is your daily dose? It doesn't sound like you're having any problems now but down the road if you were to lower your dose I think you'd be more prone to symptoms.


Top
 Profile  
 
Our Sponsors
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 9:53 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:21 pm
Posts: 8
I'm wondering bc I actually am starting to taper and not sure where to drop from 8 to 4?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 10:05 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:21 pm
Posts: 8
I don't feel any different when I take 1/2 or a whole one I really want to get off but I have no idea what mg my body is getting everyday to taper... I went 3 days with no sub last yr and had no symptoms but I also had the flu at the time....should I start my taper with 4mg?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 2:28 pm 
Offline
Power Poster
Power Poster
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 7:20 am
Posts: 55
You could give that a try although its more than you would normally drop, but considering what you've already posted?

If it does happen to be too much your body/mind will tell you and you can go back up a bit?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 4:06 pm 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:21 pm
Posts: 8
Do you know how long it would take to get symptoms if it's too much of a drop? I am 36 hrs into going to 4mg and feel fine...I also am always on the run doing things so I cannot feel any drop in energy...


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 10:21 am 
Offline
Power Poster
Power Poster
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 7:20 am
Posts: 55
Around 3 days I think is average although it can vary a bit between differential people. I'm no expert mind you, this is just what I've picked up on here!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:50 pm 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster

Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2013 11:17 pm
Posts: 157
I bet this is a troll post, it says not to chew the tablets, to hold them for at least 10-15 minutes under the tongue and to not eat or drink for another half hour after you have swallowed it right in the hand out you get for subs from your doctor or every month from the pharmacy and how funny you list that you do the opposite of every single one of their suggestions hardy har har. Do you live under a rock, take two seconds and read one of the million pieces of info out there about how to take sub.... TROLL


Top
 Profile  
 
   
PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 12:43 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member

Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2013 5:40 pm
Posts: 419
Bup, you might be on to something here.
I can't imagine going 8 years and not having this picked up on at some point by clinic staff,provider or a pharmacist. I think if someone told me this I would just have them stop and see what happens.
pax


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 6:23 am 
Offline
Power Poster
Power Poster
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 7:20 am
Posts: 55
Awwww.....really? Why would someone make something like that up?

And here was me trying to be all helpy!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2014 4:31 pm 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:21 pm
Posts: 8
Troll post? I am asking for advice obv I know what the correct way to take it is...sad to say but I feel I get better advice here then my own doctor...I should of been on this for a few weeks not years....


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 04, 2014 4:33 pm 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:21 pm
Posts: 8
I also ask this bc I went from rocs to sub with no drawls if I wasn't absorbing how the hell was I never sick...


Top
 Profile  
 
   
PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 12:03 pm 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2014 11:31 am
Posts: 13
Justoneday wrote:
I also ask this bc I went from rocs to sub with no drawls if I wasn't absorbing how the hell was I never sick...


That's just it, right there...

If you went straight from any decent amount of oxycodone (roxies, or "rocs" as you mentioned) to buprenorphine in any significant dose (at least 2 mg or beyond) without naturally withdrawing from the oxycodone first, then you would have experienced significant precipitated withdrawal. It may have been a short lived one, but it would have happened nonetheless. The fact that you did NOT experience withdrawal after taking buprenorphine immediately after oxycodone demonstrates precisely that you weren't absorbing any significant amount of medication. You said, "If I wasn't absorbing, how the hell was I never sick?" The answer to that question is that you were NOT absorbing. Either that, or you weren't taking more than 40 mg of oxycodone a day to begin with before you started buprenorphine.

If you swallow the dissolved tablets or films any sooner than 3 - 5 minutes after putting it in your mouth, then you will certainly have absorbed far less than 40% - 50% of the medication. When buprenorphine is swallowed, it's mostly destroyed by the pH of the stomach acid. What's left is extensively metabolized by the liver through first pass metabolism. This is why the medication is directed to be dissolved (AND absorbed) under the tongue/in the mouth for a duration of time. It's absorbed through the tiny blood vessels and capillaries in the very thin mucous membranes found throughout the cheeks, gums, palate, and beneath the tongue. To truly absorb a majority of the total medication out in the mouth, it would have to remain in there for a minimum of 10 minutes. Most people only wait between 3-7 minutes and although it isn't ALL being absorbed, most people are usually fine with the lesser amount since they get a significant portion of 8 mg well over the equivalent of 4 mg where the ceiling effect lies.

If you are dissolving your tablets for 30 seconds and swallowing, but yet you feel fine, then I guess there's no reason to change what you're doing BUT, with so little time to absorb your medication, I think you should try not taking anything at all and seeing if you feel the same. I wager that you would!

And as to getting better advice here than from your doctor, I'm very keen to believe that as well. I'm appalled at how little physicians seem to understand the pharmacology of the drugs they prescribe. I shouldn't have a better understanding of pharmacology than my prescribing physician but I do. However, as far as the remark about being on the drug for months and not years, I don't completely agree. Every year that passes, the idea of long term (years) use of Suboxone is more and more accepted as an effective treatment to allow a better quality of life and reduced risk of relapse in addicts. It varies from person to person of course, but if you feel that you should only have been on it for months, then taper on down. You can jump down to 4 mg without feeling a thing, no matter what dose you're at now since that's where the ceiling dose is. 2 mg shouldn't be too hard either, however you might want to stabilize at 4 mg first and then REALLY stabilize at 2 mg before dropping further. It begins to get noticeable below 2 mg for most people.

Considering you're probably absorbing all of 0.5 mg of your 8 mg dose though, I think you could probably just stop taking them altogether and not notice a thing!

And one last thing... Whoever made the remark about chewing the tablet being a bad idea, I have to correct your misguided statement... Typically patients are instructed not to chew a tablet first in the case of extended release medications such as OxyContin or MS Contin or other time release drugs. This is obviously to prevent a larger amount of medication intended for a full 12 or 24 hours from being released in 30 minutes instead. But with a sublingual tablet, think about it... The tablet dissolves completely anyways! What would it matter if it was chewed up first to speed up how quickly it dissolves?? The main thing is just not to swallow it so that it gets absorbed instead of wasted or destroyed. Hell... Even Dr. Junig sates in multiple places on his site in regards to improving sublingual absorption that it's more ideal to chew the tablet up first so it dissolves in a higher concentration into a smaller amount of saliva. Please be a little more informed before suggesting something as being a good idea or a bad idea next time. Thanks :D

Taylor


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 14 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Our Sponsors
Suboxone Forum latest topics RSS feed Subscribe to the entire forum
 

 

 
Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

  • Board Certified Psychiatrist
  • Asst Clinical Professor, Medical College of Wisconsin

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group