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 Post subject: How to help my daughter
PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2015 10:33 am 
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Good morning,

I am trying to really understand my daughter's addictions and her trying to get clean with Suboxone. She started partying at 12-my SIL introduced her into drinking, pot, then pills to finally she gave her heroin at 22-she did it for 2 months . Nice family I married into.

We finally got her into a rehab when she came darned close to over dosing on a 40 bag binge. It was scary to witness. Three weeks in there and we saw her clear eyed for the first time in years. They recommended her to a Dr who would give her Suboxone-8MG. While it seemed good at first, we've seen a huge change in her since she's been on it over the last 2 years. The Dr never has given her any counseling, just the Subs. She's addicted to sugar in sickening quantities and gets nasty when she doesn't have it here. She goes through a two litter bottle of soda a day. Along with dumping sugar on kid's cereals-5lb bags every two weeks. She throws up every day for hours also during the middle of the night.

She is argumentative-to the point it'll go on for hours with her not allowing anyone to even open their mouth to say anything. According to her, we are all liars. Lie about everything. She's been putting holes in walls, doors and breaking anything she can-I can't tell you how many dishes I've now lost. She can't sleep normally either. She is awake most days until 5-6am, then downs 15 or more Unisom to sleep. Then she'll get back up around 4pm. She doesn't work and god forbid you tell her she's needing help because that's not normal-another round of blow ups. She was diagnosed last year with Cataracts, Dr can't seem to figure out why at 24 she has them as no one in the family-4 generations traced has them. He's attributing it to the Subs.

She tried moving out of state to "Start" over. Well she ended up blowing the money given her to live in a apartment on clothes, makeup, food and what ever else she wanted. She tried getting a Dr down there to get her on Subs, but they wouldn't because she refused full treatment-counseling again-and the police were called to escort her of the property because she was throwing things around the office and the waiting room full of patients. She ended up in a hotel-again the police called because she damaged the room. She spent a week living in her car in a WalMart parking lot with her cat. I put money into her account and she came back to our state. She racked up a LOT of fines on the way home-she drove through every toll from FL-to NY without paying one. She also says she got stopped for speeding in NC and has a court date of Feb. 7th. I think it's much more because we've had mail soliciting attorney's from that area to represent her-you don't need to be represented for a speeding ticket-you mail in the fine and it's done.

We have tried getting her help-because all the signs are there somethings off. She can't get a Sub Dr here. The one she was at, we'd talked to because he's a quack in my book. When she left for FL, it took her 5 days to get there. She got "lost" she said. Driving I-95. She's confused quite a bit. She can't remember things. So she's been buying it off the streets. Wonderful. She's almost broke and the boyfriend who's a addict isn't helping at all. He's part of the issue-he taught her how to shoot heroin. He "was" clean, but he seems to have fallen into the drugs again-he was working, totaled a company vehicle along with 5 other cars and sent someone to the hospital. My daughter says he isn't in any trouble for it-like I'd believe that. He's controlling-it's part of why she won't work. He doesn't trust her. She was accused of cheating on him 3 days after she'd gotten back and he forced her to pull down her pants to "smell" her because she smelled different there. She cried for days over it-but she's back to defending him again. It's obvious he's a abuser and loser too.

We'd like to get her into some sort of treatment for all issues she's dealing with. But how? She's 25. She has such potential, yet she's lost. We think if she learned how to manage behaviors and feelings she'd be able to stop the Subs. The changes we've seen are so drastic. Subs can help-but it's tool. It's not the cure all of everything else. I'll mention her middle sister is now in detox, heading to rehab tomorrow-they did a lot of drugs together-and will be living at a half-way house for 18 months out of state. She admits she can't do this life any longer. She is leaving all of it behind and going to start new. My spouse is a alcoholic and he's admits he's powerless over it and is struggling to get sober. I didn't grow up around any of this stuff and struggle with it and go to Al-Anon to relieve my stress and fears.

Can anyone give me advice? Please? Thank you.

I could be AnyMom.......


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2015 11:28 am 
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Wow,..ok Anymom,
I just wanted to answer and welcome you to the forum. Glad you found us.
There is great support here Anymom.
I can tell you that your story isnt new. We see this all the time with people in active addiction. Im afraid your girl
needs much more than Suboxone. These are just my opinions after 4 years on sub and doing well.
Your daughter doesn't seem ready for change.And sub alone will not change much.
If she won't go the treatment or see a professional she will continue on her path. Hopefully her sister will show her the way. You have that going for your.
Addiction is a family problem and it seems to be all around you. So glad you are doing everything you can by going to support group.
The boyfriend, he doesn't seem to nelp matters either. Im sorry i do not have a real answer for you, although i do not believe Sub is the issue. She may be useing again too.
Some of the moms i know here will be aloug to help too..

Welcome and hang i there .....razor.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2015 1:13 pm 
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Hello Anymom :)

I too am no expert but have been on suboxone for 3 yrs. I do agree with razor, the sub is not what is causing these issues ur daughter is having. Sub doesn't make u violent at all. I have 3 children and I have never been violent or anything close to that. Some of the things that are going on could be signs of different things. One being, are u absolutely sure she isn't using again? Especially since her boyfriend is using, I find it very unlikely that ur daughter could be around someone like this without falling bk into active using right along with that person. And that would not mean she's weak or anything like that. Us addicts just cannot be around anyone that still uses. It is actually one of the first things we are taught in recovery. She def needs counseling along with her suboxone, my clinic requires it, if hers doesn't then try to get her to just try going to a meeting or counseling.

Thing is, there are so many things that could be causing ur daughter to be having these issues. I do not think subs are any of those reasons. 99% of us here at this forum will tell u from our experience, it takes just a couple weeks or so to get stabilized on sub, and after that, if we take it as directed and follow all the guidelines to recovery, life gets so much better. Better to the point most of us will use the word blessed or happy for the first time in years.

I really hope everything gets better with her, I know this is causing u a lot of worry and pain. I will keep u in my thoughts and prayers and maybe get ur daughter to read this forum....couldn't hurt. Welcome Anymom.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2015 9:33 pm 
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It sounds like your daughter, unfortunately, has not reached a point where she wants a real recovery. In order for her life to improve she has to want it. She has not yet become uncomfortable enough to leave the lifestyle.

But don't despair either! Most addicts relapse in the process of their recovery. Two steps forward and one step back, if you know what I mean!

Addiction is a chronic brain disorder characterized by relapse. Your daughter will likely go through several attempts to get clean before she is truly in recovery. She will always need to be vigilant to make sure that she guards against relapse. Addiction doesn't go away and there is no cure. Suboxone is just a tool to be utilized by opiate addicts. It is definitely not a cure-all.

I wish you luck in helping your daughter! Don't hesitate to ask if you have any more questions to ask!

Amy

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 17, 2015 9:46 am 
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Good morning,

Thank you all for the replies. We do know she's not ready to face any changes with her suboxone use or deal with the issues that go along with it. She was brought to the hospital last week by the county's mental health crisis team under a 945 last week. But because they just have a 7 hour hold, she was released-again. It's so frustrating.

Her boyfriend isn't making anything better-this 28 year old called me all sorts of degrogatory names and told me to go "F" myself because I am the cause of all my families addictions and what a "C" I am. If anyone I'd brought home that I was dating said that to my Mother growing up, he'd have been eating his teeth-but in this day we are now powerless against abuse such as this. I told her he's not welcome here. He's been taking her to his "dealer" to get her suboxone off the street. That's because she refuses to do the mandatory counseling most of the Dr's now have here with the med. She wants the magic pill to make it all perfect. Well, it's not. Personally, I hope they get caught buying it illegally. I just don't ever see it getting better.

It's sad to see such a beautiful person be so lost. I am always the one in the wrong-but I know I am not. I didn't cause it, I can't cure it and can't control it. But it still makes me want to make it all better and see her soar to her potential.

Any advice on how just to approach it without a blow up? Supposedly, she's waiting for the county to put her in section 8 housing. How, I don't know. She refuses to work-he's controlling that too because he's accusing her of trying to find a guy to screw with. I think he's hoping she gets it, moves in with her and it'll be even worse as I KNOW he's the physically abusive type. She'd told me a story about how he hit his last girl friend and she'd had enough and beat the snot out of him in front of every one on the college campus. She believes him when he says he'll never do it again. Yeah, um right.

She needs to face all of it. I see she's not ready. But dang it's impossible to keep watching this self destruction. Eventually, it's going to the bottom and I can only hope she isn't physically harmed when it does.

Any Mom


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 17, 2015 10:49 am 
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Hello again anymom :)

First of all I would like to say that ur daughter is very lucky to have a mother who hasn't gave up on her and still has high hopes that ur daughter can fight this addiction and come bk stronger than ever. Not all of us addicts have that continued support due to the crazy things we did during our using days. I'm sure there are a lot of different issues ur daughter is going through and I don't want to come on here and pretend that I know exactly what u need to do to help her. But one thing I do know, no matter how much u love her and protect her, she won't be able to get complete recovery until she is ready herself. I could only imagine how hopeless a parent feels to watch their child go through addiction. My mom used to say to me "I just want the old u bk and I know she is gone and I will never see her again". That is heartbreaking when I think of that and what I put her through. I got help when I had enough and did it for myself. I loved my parents and children more than anything but it only worked when I was ready. I'm sure that's true for most ppl.

The only thing that comes to mind when u say ur daughter won't go to a doctor or clinic to get her suboxone, is that the rules and drug tests are probably a big reason she won't. And if ur not ready to follow the rules and worry about drug screens, then she's probably still using something. It does seem like she is trying and knows sub is going to help her, but maybe she isn't totally ready yet. She definitely doesn't need to be around a boyfriend that uses cause not many addicts trying to stay straight could take that kind of pressure. This medication works miracles, but only if ur ready to use it exactly as prescribed and start recovery.

I'm not trying to write a book for ya anymom lol I just kinda wanted u to know that ur doing everything u can do. Never give up, but know its her that has to be ready. I think ur awesome for coming here and trying to find answers and u seem very smart. Even tthough she may not be ready right this second, that could all change tomorrow. I wish u such a happy day and please keep us posted.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 7:53 pm 
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Thank you all for the words of advice on this. Today is a really rough day. She throwing things in her room. She's full out mad at me because for her twenty-fifth birthday tomorrow she wants cash. No nice gift, no dinner, just cold hard cash. Why? Because she won't go see a Dr who will legally prescribe the medication. She's buying it off the street from dealers. She pissed because I refuse to do that. She's sick. I am sorry, but some days I just think, not my circus, not my monkey's. She needs to start dealing with this head on. She doesn't work-no way she can. The suboxone-however much she's taking-keeps her wired. Then she's doing large doses of over the counter sleeping meds to get to sleep. She just left because she was going ballistic because she feels lousy. She took off in the car.

I am not to blame for her feeling this way. I am also not giving in to give her money to get the drug of the street-I have health insurance that I carry through my job that takes care of this and she knows it. She won't go because she won't do counseling. That's why she's getting it off the streets. Her boyfriend is taking her to his old dealers to get it. And get this-he's telling her he's started school to be a CASAC counselor-I call BS. More than likely he's going to meet a dealer/girl that he's been hanging around when she moved away from her for 5 months.

I want to see her better. She is worth so much more than she gives herself credit for. Course she'll say I am the cause of all her troubles and ills. I was a nasty Mom-I never gave encouragement, never gave her support. Ok-I quit my job to raise my kids, ran Girl Scouts, took them to every travel soccer/field hockey game going and let them have fun with sleepovers. But I never once told her I was proud of her-according to her. Again bull. But she's gotten good at twisting memories and times.

I feel since she is getting really sick from withdrawal from the suboxone. But I can't always fix what she wants. I can't in good conscience give in and give her money to go see a dealer.

To make matters tougher around here right now is her other sibling whose in rehab. Her ex-boyfriend is another piece of junk. Well she just found out-3 weeks into rehab-she's pregnant. Great-almost 5 weeks. My concern is for that baby to be. She was doing 35 decks of heroin a day from the BF, cocaine and crack before she went to rehab. Then what ever meds they gave her during detox. I am worried that there's issues she can't even imagine that can come up from it. She's been put on Suboxone too-but is slowly being weaned of with the counseling she's getting. The BF told her to get rid of it. He's 24, she's 22. Both old enough to take responsibility for this happening. But he's walking. She's wobbling. We told her what ever she decides we support her choice. But I told her straight out-this will be her responsibility fully. You make a choice to have a child, you are the full time care giver. I think she needs to still find out who she is without this burden at this time. She used to say to me it's because he's "black", no it never was. (I am American Indian by the way). I told all my kids, I don't care if he's white, black, or a green martian, he'd better treat you with respect and love you with the depths of his soul. So far my kids haven't found any man like that. Just losers. And I hope she makes the right choice for herself. All I ever wanted was my kids to be happy and be everything they could be. Drugs rob them off all that. That's why I keep fighting to get them on a good path to see how far they could truly go in life.

It's been a trying day. Thanks for letting me chat with you all again.

AnyMom


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 27, 2015 9:38 pm 
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First of all let me say that you are doing exactly what a good mother should do in this case by refusing to give her money. I know it's very easy to let her arguments seep into your mind and make you doubt your resolve, but stay strong. My heart breaks reading these posts because it reminds me of how terrible I was to my family during my active addict days. I can't even imagine how heart breaking it is to see your daughters going through this hell and not be able to stop it. But you are absolutely right. If she really wanted help she would go to a doctor and do this the right way. Some part of her just hasn't had enough and there isn't anything we can do to make her see the truth. It's awful.

I just want you to remember that what she is saying to you isn't the truth. It's the addiction that is making her say and do the things she is doing. As hard as it is not to take these things personally, I can tell you from experience she probably doesn't believe half the things she is saying to you. She will say anything she can to hurt you just to make you give her what she wants. Guilt is a favorite weapon of addicts, and we learn how to use it to our advantage very quickly.

The only advice I can give you is to keep doing what you are doing. The more difficult you make it for her to get what she wants and stay comfortable in her addiction the quicker she is going to hit her bottom and realize she has to get sober for real. Until she wants it, it won't happen. In some ways, it will be harder on you than it will be for her but it is necessary to be sure you don't enable her. As long as you know that you are doing it because you love her and want her life to get better, don't worry about what she says to you. God willing, one day she will thank you for being tough on her and see how hard this was for you.

As for your daughter in rehab. All you can do is trust that she is getting the help she needs and hope that she makes the right decision. I agree that the timing isn't great for her to start a family. And you are absolutely right to be sure she understands you won't be raising this baby for her. It sounds like you have your hands full enough taking care of your other daughter. Maybe she could consider adoption? There are so many families that would love to have a baby of their own, special needs or not. It just might be something she could feel proud of herself for if she was able to help a family that has wanted a baby for years finally have one of their own to love. I'm no expert in pre-natal care, but I believe if she stays clean the baby has a very good chance of being born with no problems despite her early drug use.

I'm happy you found our forum. I wish there was a way that I could help you and your girls more. I hope you stick around and keep learning all you can about this disease and how to fight it. You are definitely welcome here. Stay strong, Mama. It doesn't matter what happened in the past, what matters is how you move forward and handle things from today. You are being a wonderful mother. Please don't doubt that.

Hugs,

Q

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