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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:05 pm 
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I need help with a few question, if that's ok?

At what dose does suboxone become a blocker?
If a person stopped taking suboxone, how long before heroin would then work?
How dangerous is it to smoke heroin when taking a dose which is high enough to be a blocker?
If I don't take my daily dose of suboxone, how long before I become ill?

My partner has doubts as to whether or not i'm telling the truth about suboxone being a blocker, so would like to show him this thread with some answers.

Thank you x


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:13 pm 
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PS: I'm asking questions my partner has asked me. Might add more.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:29 pm 
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Quote:
At what dose does suboxone become a blocker?


Really, this is different for everyone but even small amounts of suboxone 1-2mgs can interfere with feeling the effects of other opiates.


Quote:
If a person stopped taking suboxone, how long before heroin would then work?


It would probably take at least a few days to feel the full effects of heroin, depending on how long the person was on suboxone for. The longer you're on sub, the longer it takes to leave your system. Suboxone binds to the receptors stronger than any other opiate including methadone, which is why there is a block effect.
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How dangerous is it to smoke heroin when taking a dose which is high enough to be a blocker?


It's pretty dangerous. The only time I ever used another opiate while on suboxone was in the first month or two of my maintenance. I smoked white powder from NY (was only ever previously used to west coast black tar) and I couldn't keep my eyes open. I was not high, however, or at least didn't feel high at all. It was quite bizarre. I was wide awake all night, just laying there but couldn't sit up or keep my eyes open. I have no idea how close I was to ODing, but I imagine if I had smoked anymore, I would have found out. At the sub dose I was on, using heroin was utterly useless. I never did it again (or any other opiates.) I figured if heroin couldn't break through, nothing else would.

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If I don't take my daily dose of suboxone, how long before I become ill?


Most people start feeling crappy the next day, but it usually isn't until day 3-4 that the worst of it kicks in.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:38 pm 
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Thank you so much for your replays. It's just backed up what i've told him. You've added more info though, so much appreciated.

Back to the first question. i'm told 12mg of suboxone is the dose i'd be on for it to work as a blocker. 12 and up!?


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:40 pm 
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12mgs is right around your average dose for most mid to heavy users, and yes, definitely enough to block the effects of other opiates.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:57 pm 
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tinydancer wrote:
12mgs is right around your average dose for most mid to heavy users, and yes, definitely enough to block the effects of other opiates.



Once again, thanks very much. Now he believes me, lol. I told him that people on this board know what they're talking about. He's just worried i'm bullshitting as he's been through hell with me recently!

I only use on average twice a week, but on 50ml of methadone. I want to switch over again, at a dose which acts as a blocker as want that extra help, atm. What would you recommend, dose wise for it to act as a blocker? I first need to drop to 30ml they said before I can switch over. Is this correct?


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 10:03 pm 
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I would drop lower, to 15mg. That's what I did and it's better safe than sorry. We've had a lot of members have issues lately transferring over from methadone. I only waited about 24 hours before dosing and ran into precipitated withdrawals. It is now advised to wait between 3-5 days (up from the previous 24-48 when I first induced) by doctors who know their shit.

I still used (cheated here and there) when I was on methadone, but other than that one slip in the beginning, I never used again during my 6 years of sub maintenance. I definitely feel it's a better tool for recovery than methadone, just from personal experience. You need to seriously find a way to change your "scenery" though. You can't expect suboxone to do all the work. Ditch friends that use, don't hang around family that are bad influences, etc. It's hard, I know, but you have to do it.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 10:15 pm 
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tinydancer wrote:
I would drop lower, to 15mg. That's what I did and it's better safe than sorry. We've had a lot of members have issues lately transferring over from methadone. I only waited about 24 hours before dosing and ran into precipitated withdrawals. It is now advised to wait between 3-5 days (up from the previous 24-48 when I first induced) by doctors who know their shit.

I still used (cheated here and there) when I was on methadone, but other than that one slip in the beginning, I never used again during my 6 years of sub maintenance. I definitely feel it's a better tool for recovery than methadone, just from personal experience. You need to seriously find a way to change your "scenery" though. You can't expect suboxone to do all the work. Ditch friends that use, don't hang around family that are bad influences, etc. It's hard, I know, but you have to do it.



I was told 24 hrs too.

I'm totally with you on that it's not a perfect fix, that I have to work hard at changing my life. I was on subs for years and done great during that time. I tried to come off and really messed it up. I posted on here about it at the time. I then switched to methadone and tbh things have not been great. Ended up in a Psychiatric ward for 2 mths after 3 overdoses in the space of 3 weeks. I had a breakdown. My daughter was took into foster care, and that just made things so much worse. Only just coming out of the other side of it, with help of medication. I need to stop this using though, I just feel like the self control I used to have, is missing? I'm hoping this helps kick starts it again. I can't think of another option. It worked before, and better to try it then nothing, right?


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 10:22 pm 
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I'm so sorry to hear all that. I think you're on the right track, resorting back to method that worked for you in the past. I would wait much longer than 24 hours, if you want to avoid nasty precipitated withdrawals.

Yes, addiction certainly has a clever little way of messing with one's self control. You're not alone there. I'm glad you're working on a better recovery for you, and your family. We're here if you want to keep posting.

When you get closer to suboxone induction, we can help you there too. The lower the mdone dose, and longer you wait to start sub, the best. Come back before you induce.. there is a lot of good info here, regarding the transition.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 10:26 pm 
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tinydancer wrote:
I'm so sorry to hear all that. I think you're on the right track, resorting back to method that worked for you in the past. I would wait much longer than 24 hours, if you want to avoid nasty precipitated withdrawals.

Yes, addiction certainly has a clever little way of messing with one's self control. You're not alone there. I'm glad you're working on a better recovery for you, and your family. We're here if you want to keep posting.

When you get closer to suboxone induction, we can help you there too. The lower the mdone dose, and longer you wait to start sub, the best. Come back before you induce.. there is a lot of good info here, regarding the transition.



I just found my old thread, you posted in there too -http://www.suboxforum.com/jumping-off-t8047.html

I will wait longer then 24 hrs, don't want to go into withdrawal. Been so long since i've done this.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 12:49 am 
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^ I remember you! Welcome back! I'm sorry it's not under better circumstances but at least you're here.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 12:21 pm 
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Hi Danielle, I remember you, too! Welcome back.

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Be kind to yourself. Our character defects do NOT define who we are!


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