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PostPosted: Tue Jul 28, 2015 8:34 am 
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Hi everyone,
I'm elated that this forum exists. especially being that I'm finding out that doctors who RX suboxone have less knowledge of this medication than I thought. I am honestly believing that patients who take it know more than the dr's do because they are the ones who directly experience it physically.
the doctors don't.
MY sub dr who rx's it from a clinic where I go insists that suboxone is NOT used for pain and DOESN'T work for pain, and I've always disagreed with his view.
so after doing my own research on the web, I found out that patients ARE put on it for pain. I find it also helps with my bipolarII depressive disorder. I would always get soooo depressed in my drops and didnt' know why. only for a few days though till I got acclimated on lower dosage.

I tore the meniscus in my left knee 3 month ago while mopping a floor. The bone slid in and out 3 times without pain in a period of a half hour. Not until hours later and near the night did the knee swell and I suffered pain. I didn't go to the Dr. I just continued on. The swelling and pain would wax and wane. Not until I moved the knee by squatting while weeding and the bone slid out again but this time I almost didn't get it back in. So I decided that I need to get this looked at.

So I made an appnt to see my GP. he sent me for an xray, and then and MRI which doc then referred me to an orthopedic surgeon who took one look at my knee, showed me the MRI and the damage in the knee and immediately said I need surgery and that he could fit me in next week, which is tomorrow already.
I am a new patient there, so I filled out the necessary paper work of what medications I'm on. I PUT that I'm on 2mg/0.5mg of suboxone. He NEVER told me to stop the medication, nor did he give me any literature about this.
He told me the hospt. wld be calling me with instructions within the week. Last Friday the call came, which is now four days ago. The nurse was SHOCKED when I told her I'm on suboxone. I 've been on a plan to getting off the suboxone within the next few months. I do it very slowly. anyway, she asked me if I told my surgeon that I was on the sub and I told her of course! and she asked me if I was given any literature on this med and surgery, which my reply was no. I started to get nervous as to why she was so serious about this. I had no idea.
she told me that I had to stop the suboxone 3 days before the surgery. I tried, but I couldn't do it. it's all mental with me. I"ve only been on the 2mg drop for four weeks now and wasn't ready to just stop it cold turkey.
I just typed in surgery and suboxone yesterday and found this site. before ystrdy I was only looking up suboxone and how to drop off the 2mg. to zero. My sub doctor told me I must NOT cut the strip in half like Ive heard patients do succesfully. He's wrong in my book. I asked him if he had any success stories with people just dropping from 2mg to 0 and he didn't answer the question directly. he told me everyone is different.
I've started out on the suboxone two years ago, which I did NOT plan on staying on so long. I only wanted to stay on it long enough to get through the horrible withdrawals of methadone that I'd been on for 13 yrs. I never planned on staying on the methadone that long either, but it helped balance my emotions. I don't really know why I stayed on it so long. time just goes by so fast.

I now also fear coming off the suboxone because of the scars imprinted in my memory bank of what I went thru coming off 5 mg of methadone to zero within only a few weeks time. the patients had to do a quick detox or go far away to another city to get their medicine. I had already wanted to come off it anyway and thought by being motivated and positive that I could do it. boy was I in for hell and I mean hell. you don't just stop methadone that way.

the clinic was forced to close down on the hospital property they were renting on. they tried to quickly open another clinic next town over but the town's people and the mayor wouldn't allow the clinic to open up. people had to go many many miles to a city to another clinic or detox off the methadone or get on suboxone. I wanted off. a lot of people died within these 2 yrs of them closing down. The mayor had blood on her hands for sure. it was a big fight for years. but they finally opened up a new one now and they just started filling out scripts for suboxone. they never offered it before. only methadone.
so it's pretty new to the dr who's prescribing it.
I called the hospt. nurse and surgeons office ystrdy with no results. I have to wait till today to speak to anyone about whats' going on in this crazy little head of mine.
I never had the time to do this properly. I should be off the suboxone totally. I know myself and how anxious and anal I become if things aren't done correctly. with me I know a lot of it is mental. and I admit that I'm weak in this area of my life. because I was able to drop from taking taking 16 mg in the beginning to 8mg, to 4, and now down to 2mg within a two year period. I want to do down to the 1mg. and then half of that and then stop it so I do NOT go through withdrawal.
IF I had known that the suboxone would cause such a problem for the hospital staff, doctors and myself, I wouldn't have booked the surgery so soon..
I'm embarrassed to reschedule it in fear the dr will get angry with me that he lost a slot for a patient, so the next time I see him to set up surgery again, I will be petrified to see him. PLUS my general doctor how had to perform the medical clearance went through so much trouble to fit me in to do it. they couldn't find a slot to put me in. so dr. saw me as his last patient one day. they jumped through hoops to help me. so I feel I'd be disappointing them too.
I'm SO confused and dont' know what to do????
In some places I read you can stop the sub 12 to 24 hours before surgery and other sites 72 hours, and so on. I have fibromyalgia, arthritis and osteoporosis. Fibro has something to do with nerve pain and nerve sensitivity, so I suffer more than If I didn't have the fibro . Before doctors used to think these people were depressed or hypochondriacs. but now they finally see that it's REAL.

I can't handle surgeries as well at the age I'm at compared to when I was younger. I'm 55 now and have had multiple surgeries though out my life. A lot of them female reproductive issues and an emergency twisted small bowel surgery where I almost died 2 yrs ago. New years day no less. the ER staff asked ambulance person if I was drunk, because my abdomen was in agony and I was vomiting like crazy. can you imagine??? they actually joked about it. But that problem took years of unknown abdominal pain. you can't see scar tissue with MRI's. so it was getting worst as the years went by. they thought I was nuts.

I am wondering if I should just reschedule the surgery, or do I go and have it done? will I suffer immense pain because the suboxone won't have been out of my system long enough? I wouldn't take it tomorrow morning, so that would be 24 hours.
any information would be so helpful and appreciated. I had NO idea so many people are on suboxone. I thought that it was a fairly new medication and had no idea that it's been on market longer.

I don't have a problem with addiction anymore compared to 15 yrs ago. I don't NEED the opiate blocker that's in the suboxone and my sub doctor agreed with me that I don't need to be on it anymore. I'll just deal holisitically with the arthritis in my spine, neck, shoulder, thumbs, toes and now knees. The fibro I can deal with, I think..... because it's been so many years that I haven't had my own pharmacology system working itself.
when I started weaning off the suboxone, I started taking super greens mix, multiple vitamins, flax seed, magnesium, and probiotics and started feeling awesome. I hardly felt the drops at all. But after reading what others have gone through stopping on only 2mg of the suboxone makes me feel I might not be able to do this after all. and that I MUST go lower. I don't fear going back to drugs, I fear the withdrawals. and I don't want to hear just suck it up and be positive, because that simply does not work for some people. some people are stronger than others. our bodies are all different. our immune systems are different. our pain levels are different. etc.
hope I explained my situation well enough. sorry for the length of this story.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 12:19 am 
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Hey lintek,
Very sorry no one including me has gotten to your issue.

I cant answer all of your problems right now, but my experience with this is that at 2mgs you could get pain relief with full agonist pain meds. If, and this is important, that your drs provide you a higher dosage of meds post op.

The best thing here is that your not on a high dose of bupe right now. You should be ok.

If you go over to the Suboxone Talkzone, the blog here that Dr Junig our founder writes,you will find many posts covering surgery and bupe..

Razor..


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 7:49 am 
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I am also sorry i didn't respond sooner. I haven't been on much lately. Please let us know what you decided to do.

You & I have many things in common. Our age, fibro & arthritis. I find sub helps my pain. I take smaller doses 3-4 times a day.

I hope all goes well and you come back to update us

Good luck


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2015 10:05 pm 
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So what did you do??? Please let us know how you are


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 6:50 am 
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Thank you both for your replies to me. It's nice to know that someone cares. I will go over to the talk zone as suggested too.. I'm interested in finding out about the dr. who started this site but don't know where to go. I heard wonderful things about him and about this forum and how helpful and inspiring people are here. thank God for this board. I felt so frightened and in such a dilemma that I was making myself sick by my worries. Fear is the cause of all wars, unhappiness, anxiety and projected things that might not even occur. The mind can do some crazy things to us.

Regarding the surgery I had set up. I cancelled it. I had to see my sub doctor day b4 surgery so when I told him I was having knee surgery he asked me "when"? when I told him the next day, I shocked him. In a joking manner, he called me "crazy woman". lol... He told others on the staff about my story while I was there. He told me he needed to speak with the anesthesiologist FIRST and the surgeon, before I could do the surgery and the surgeon was in surgery all day that day, so it was impossible for him to communicate with him. He didn't give me clearance.

I gave him the info to contact the chief of anesthesiology but he had to leave a msg. I told him I was embarrassed to cancel the appnt. since my g.p had to jump hoops to get me in for medical clearance in such a rush.
My sub Dr. said to just blame it on him and that I didn't have to stop the suboxone forever just because of surgery. I told him two weeks ago before I ever knew I was going in for surgery that my intention was getting off the suboxone, so why now the change in plans?
The sub dr. said to take the 2mg strip each day for two weeks. then the day I see him, do not take it. his plan is for me to go every other day, on and off. I asked him how this could possibly work if you're reintroducing the blocker back into the receptors? it never gives it a chance to leave it completely that way. it doesn't make sense to me.
from what I learned through other patients on the board is to drop slowly even though the directions are to stop at 2mg because there IS no lower dosage. The pharmaceutical co. expects the person to go to zero?????
I went on their website to find out how to come off of it but there's no answers. only how to get on it.

so I prepped myself emotionally and each morning I read inspirational, spiritual work that I LOVE and has helped me significantly to think positive.
So I did it. This past Saturday.
I cut the strip in 1/2 and for 4 days now I'm on 1mg. Then my plan is on the 5th day to drop to 1/4 of the half strip for another 5 to 7 days. then maybe just stop it all together. I'll play it by ear and see how I feel. either way, I HAVE to stop it 3 days before the surgery. it's booked for august 18th.

I CAN NOT believe my worst fear has not happened. AT ALL!!! so far, so good. no withdrawals what so ever. The only change I feel is the pain from my bulging disc that's in my lower spine is acting up again. when I was on the stronger sub, I didnt' feel it. So I just took an aleve. it works wonders for musculoskeletar pain. I find it works better than any OTC pain med. Naproxen is the real name of it.
all I've ever favored in my past was RX pain meds. But I now see that otc's really do work, just as good as the opiates and without the risk of becoming physically dependent on them. yahoo!!! I'm a happy gal right now. More than you know.
thank you both again for your inspiring words. Blessings to you.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 7:15 am 
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Tiki,
I forgot to ask you how much suboxone you're on total. you said you take little pieces through out the day. How long have you been on the sub? what was your schedule each time you dropped?. were you put on the sub because of your physical pain? I ask this because I want to see if more doctors are beginning to RX this medicine for pain relief, especially being you and I suffer similar ailments.

I have to go to a rheumy dr. this month that I waited to see for almost 2 months. My blood work has been showing since 2012 positive ANA tests and positive C-reactive protein. More so the positive ANA every single time. My knees just started acting up out of no where. The bone slid in and out and ripped the meniscus. then the right knee couple days later is acting up. there's no pain, but feels like something is growing in. Its' the only way I can explain it. MY GP mentioned "lupus" rather than rheumatoid arthritis. I've had problems with unexplained body rashes now for a year.
they come out of no where. I've had raynauds syndrome that started right after my divorce back in 1999. That's when all the trouble began. I was sent to a rheumy dr who diagnosed me with fibromyalgia.
I've had the psoas muscle go into inflammation for no reason. it was painful. My thumbs then started getting arthritis in them. at the base of the thumb. very difficult to turn round knobs to wash hands and to hold dishes to wash them. No dishwasher. I constantly drop things. Then the joint at the big toes. On both sides of the body with each join I mentioned. I suffer with neuropathy at night the most and as I'm writing right now my left hand and fingers are numb and tingly. I'm going bald on sides of my head. I used to be tired last year every day. I'd lay in bed and couldnt' walk far when I went for walks with my husband. could barely climb stairs, cook or clean.
but I started taking supplements this year and drinking super greens, powder form and take magnesium oxide and drink ground flax seeds and take a probiotic. all this helps clear out the alimentary canal which makes me feel cleansed and awesome. I've never felt so much energy AND I find I'm not suffering the symptoms of the fibro as much either. it's amazing. I think this also has to do a lot with why I don't feel horrible on weaning of the suboxone.
do you have the same symptoms? did you ever get your D3 level checked? A lot of people are walking around with D3 deficiency and don't know it. Mine was SO low years ago back in 2007, which was related to the mystery symptoms of why I felt so sick and achy all the time. I could barely turn my neck while driving car. I lost my job because of it. I missed too many days in what they call the probation period. the first 3 months you can't miss so many days.
That's when I threw in the towel and elected to apply for disability. I didn't want to be labeled, "disabled". I had the opportunity to get it back in 1999. but I cancelled appnt. So after going through 15 jobs in a matter of ten years, I finally threw in the towel, went on line to apply, saw the state doctor and he within 5 minutes of talking to him, a psychiatrist, he told me I was disabled.
it's embarrassing because people always ask when introduced, "what do you do for a living"?
people discriminate and judge. even though they don't know the circumstances of a persons life.
people are quick to judge addicts as well. In the medical field especially.
I want to be off ALL controlled substances. Including my clonapin that I've been on for years for my general anxiety and go on something else that's not a controlled sub.
sorry if this is so long and boring. I just wanted to give you an outline of my life.
it's a long one for sure.
I'd love to hear back from you and get to know more about you. it's your turn.
I am looking forward to your response.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2016 11:05 pm 
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I am having surgery in 4 days I got my sub script on the second of this month what am I going to need from the dr to show the pharmacy that these pain meds are needed so I don't get denied at the pharmacy?


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 9:00 am 
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Hi Cher, Welcome! I don't know why I did not see your post before this morning? Sorry about that! I don't know if you will have a problem at your pharmacy...your insurance co. might deny it but with a call from your doctor it should be fine. The problem comes with prescribing enough of a pain med to deal with your pain. Please, keep us posted!


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