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PostPosted: Mon Jun 16, 2014 7:46 am 
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I thought a taper journal from 1.5 to 0 would be helpful since so many people go through the same fears and roadblocks when getting to this final stretch.

Today is my 3rd day at 1.5, a few small stomach and leg cramps at various times, I wouldn't even mention it except I want to be really thorough so this can help others.

I think the ingest factor holding me back has been fear. When I live in this moment instead of anticipating the next next, I am in far better shape mentally and physically.

Going to take my dogs for a walk/run. STarting the week off on a positive, the sun is shining it's cool and clear..life is good today.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 16, 2014 8:38 am 
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Looking forward to following your journey! Enjoy your dogs and your walk!!!


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 16, 2014 9:36 am 
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Good stuff, GP.

I'm going down to .25 tomorrow, so I'm with you on the drop.

Since 1 mg, I've been doing my drops .25 mg at a time. The withdrawal cr*p has been manageable. But if I weren't in a hurry to get off Suboxone, I'd probably be tapering down .125 mg at a time, which might be gentler.

-- JI

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 16, 2014 5:40 pm 
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Johnny,

.25 is a lot when you're down so low. I'm interested to see how it affects you. I am anxious to get to 1 mg, but I think I may have to cut down in smaller amounts when I get there. We'll see!

I tapered off Effexor. I was taking it to satisfy my Doctor, never thought it was helping me, I'm not depressed, I get anxiety attacks sometimes. Anyway I tried just stopping cold, had no idea it had w/d's but it does, bad ones. So after a weekend of misery I did it the right way and went down pretty slowly. I had no problem at all when I finished, nada!

I keep that thought in my head regarding Suboxone. It doesn't have to be different. If you go online you can read stories of people suffering horribly from Effexor withdrawals, but tapering down I was fine. I am keeping that thought front and center, this can be okay and we can do it without a lot of drama if we work out, eat right and stick to the taper schedule we set for ourselves.

You are an inspiration, and you take time to reach out to a lot of people, that's saying something! Good for you and thanks.

Gingerpop


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 16, 2014 5:59 pm 
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Call me a guinea pig, lol.

I was originally planning to do at least a couple days at .375 mg, but at this point I want to just get to the end of my taper. Wednesday and Thursday will probably suck a bit, but by Saturday I hope i'll be coming around. After that it will be .125 mg/day for part of the following week, and that should hopefully do it.

But this is just a plan, if going right down to .25 mg turns out to be too much, then I will back off to .375, and add another week to my taper.

-- JI

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 1:40 pm 
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Here's where I am at today at 1.5 mg: Some cramps in my legs once in a while, and the odd pain in my stomach, nothing that stops me from my regular activities.

The main thing I'm noticing is emotions, bubbling up and all over the place. It's kind of a roller coaster, I'm fine and going along and then suddenly I want to cry. Im holding on to the thought that all of this will pass. I'm keeping the cardio up, today I'm doing an extra 30 mins to offset the emotions.

It seems like the less I focus on it and the more I focus on doing what's in front of me (my work!!!) that the time goes by fast and another day has come and gone. I have a lot to be grateful for, when I get into a dark place it's because I am allowing myself to fall into self pity or wallow in shame over behavior from the past.

Today I am someone who can be depended on. I do what I say I am going to do. I am present for my family, for my Fiance, and for my dogs, who need a lot of attention and exercise. The Border Collie puppy had graduation from obedience school last night. Now we're on to "Beginning Agility". I might be a puppy stage mother, but I think the little guy is a star waiting for his chance to shine. Maybe we all are.

Gingerpop


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 17, 2014 5:48 pm 
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Day 1 of .25 mg/day (down from .5) has been a breeze, other than I'm zombie-tired, but I don't think that's got anything to do with Subs. Fell asleep for an hour around 9 pm last nite, and then of course I was up to 2 am or 3 am (and up early as per usual).

Anyways, I was generally in a pretty good mood today. I don't expect tomorrow (day 2) will be as upbeat and symptom-free, but if it is, that will be awesome.

One thing about that knotted-stomach feeling I mentioned to you elsewhere; I've been getting that to some extent, but it's not building up. Three or four times today, I had to go find a quiet spot to let off some grief, but it's like this stuff is flowing through me now, as if my emotions are getting better at working in real time. It was relief to let this stuff out, and my stomach unknotted just as soon as I did. Right now I'm as relaxed as I've been in days.

Hope your coming days go well!

-- JI

Gingerpop wrote:
Johnny,

.25 is a lot when you're down so low. I'm interested to see how it affects you. I am anxious to get to 1 mg, but I think I may have to cut down in smaller amounts when I get there. We'll see!

(snip)

Gingerpop

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 4:50 am 
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Gingerpop wrote:
Here's where I am at today at 1.5 mg: Some cramps in my legs once in a while, and the odd pain in my stomach, nothing that stops me from my regular activities.

The main thing I'm noticing is emotions, bubbling up and all over the place. It's kind of a roller coaster, I'm fine and going along and then suddenly I want to cry. Im holding on to the thought that all of this will pass. I'm keeping the cardio up, today I'm doing an extra 30 mins to offset the emotions.

It seems like the less I focus on it and the more I focus on doing what's in front of me (my work!!!) that the time goes by fast and another day has come and gone. I have a lot to be grateful for, when I get into a dark place it's because I am allowing myself to fall into self pity or wallow in shame over behavior from the past.

Today I am someone who can be depended on. I do what I say I am going to do. I am present for my family, for my Fiance, and for my dogs, who need a lot of attention and exercise. The Border Collie puppy had graduation from obedience school last night. Now we're on to "Beginning Agility". I might be a puppy stage mother, but I think the little guy is a star waiting for his chance to shine. Maybe we all are.

Gingerpop

Hi Gingerpop, Congrats on your taper, sounds like it is going really well! I also had a bunch of those "emotions" come to the surface when I got down to about where you are (I'm at .375mgs today). Pretty intense after numbing them for such a long time! Good news is, the intensity dies down, especially if you talk it out (or write it out), and I am a big proponent of the "cardio cure"- works wonders on mind, body, and spirits! Keep it up!
rca


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 7:52 am 
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It's amazing to share with people who are doing this taper at the same time. My experience has been about secrets. First the addiction to pain killers and then Suboxone. It's not so surprising that when trying to go back to living a normal life that Suboxone wasn't high on my list of conversation topics. For most of the time I've been on it I didn't find online support groups where people were successfully tapering. I never knew another human who was on this medication and more to the point I didn't know anyone who got off.

Hearing from rca1004 and Johnny I gives me hope, more than hope.. I know I can do this, and that I don't have to do it alone, in isolation.

To the best of my ability I am going on with my daily activities, staying physically active and focusing on my work, which is an excellent distraction. I'm taking the attitude that it's not a big deal if I don't make it one. As soon as I adjust to a lower dose, I know I'm ready to lower again. The info shared in the Suboxone Cutting Guide has saved me from having to figure it all out alone. I am trying to avoid as many w/d symptoms as I can, so going down in small measured doses is the plan.

When I let this torrent of emotion out, it does pass. I was so afraid to cry, as if I would lose myself in grief that I didn't wholly understand. Now I know it's part of the process, I have been numb, much more than I realized, for a long time.

Off for the morning run. I feel a little boring, but I want to write this down for the next person who needs to read about the process day by day. I get a little freaked out when I am reading someone's taper story, and then -poof- they disappear. I wonder what happened, and I hope they are okay. There are several post-taper posters on this forum who are extremely generous with their time and advice. They inspire me and make me want to be one of them in the future.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 7:06 pm 
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Gingerpop, you have a great attitude! One thing my doctor asked me to do was to stay at each drop 2 weeks to 1 month with no symptoms before the next drop, explaining that it took 2 weeks for the half-life of the previous dosages to play out. If you are 3 days in, you don't have long to go.

Please keep posting...I'm at 2mg and planning my drop to 1.75 hopefully in the next 30 days. Nice to have someone at a similar place.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 18, 2014 7:14 pm 
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I've actually found it easier when I did my drops after 6 or 7 days. I took 2 weeks to go from 1.5 to 1.0, and another two weeks to go .75. Those were the toughest ones I experienced.

Going down to .5, and then .25, has been pretty easy.

-- JI

ClearAqua wrote:
Gingerpop, you have a great attitude! One thing my doctor asked me to do was to stay at each drop 2 weeks to 1 month with no symptoms before the next drop, explaining that it took 2 weeks for the half-life of the previous dosages to play out. If you are 3 days in, you don't have long to go.

Please keep posting...I'm at 2mg and planning my drop to 1.75 hopefully in the next 30 days. Nice to have someone at a similar place.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 5:06 am 
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johnny_ikon wrote:
I've actually found it easier when I did my drops after 6 or 7 days. I took 2 weeks to go from 1.5 to 1.0, and another two weeks to go .75. Those were the toughest ones I experienced.

Going down to .5, and then .25, has been pretty easy.

-- JI

ClearAqua wrote:
Gingerpop, you have a great attitude! One thing my doctor asked me to do was to stay at each drop 2 weeks to 1 month with no symptoms before the next drop, explaining that it took 2 weeks for the half-life of the previous dosages to play out. If you are 3 days in, you don't have long to go.

Please keep posting...I'm at 2mg and planning my drop to 1.75 hopefully in the next 30 days. Nice to have someone at a similar place.


From what I've read this past month on this forum and experienced myself, I think how much we drop, and how long we stay there before the next drop is a deeply personal choice, and we must each figure out what is going to work for us as individuals. i.e. there are success stories on this forum of everything from jumping cold turkey from extremely high doses (8-24mg range!! Ouch!!), to tapering very slowly down to under .125mgs and skipping days before jumping. What has been working for me has been staying at each drop for 3 weeks, which makes sense to me, since the half life lasts about 2wks, then another week to "stabilize". Before I joined the forum, I tapered by just increasing the denominator of the fraction of the strip I was cutting (once I got down to 1 strip that is). I have also managed 50% drops from 2 to 1 to .5, then slowed down a bit, and went from .5 to .375mgs and am at about 2 weeks there and just today feeling really stable. So, GingerPop, I suggest you continue to gather "ideas" but you have to choose what is going to work for you, and keep posting!
xo
RCA


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2014 9:30 am 
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Thanks for the post RCA. It's really surprising how differently we react to coming off of this drug, and how unpredictable the withdrawal symptoms are.

My addiction doctor told me that Suboxone would be easy to get off, but it turns out all her experience is with short-terms users who were only on it for a few months. For long-term opiate addicts such as myself, it seems like there is no way of predicting how things might go.

Being prepared and having support is indispensable as part of the taper process I think. 12 step has been really important to me (the steps themselves, not just the meetings), but I'm also really grateful for this forum, and having you guys to reach out to.

-- JI

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 8:09 am 
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I am incredibly grateful to finally have some fellowship with people who are working on the same issue I am. This doesn't discount going to meetings and other tools, but I was desperate to talk to another human being who was tapering off Suboxone. Of the 4 high priced addiction Doctors I have worked with only 1 had any counseling/group meetings of Suboxone users. Of those I was the only person trying to get off the drug, the other people were just starting this, just getting off full agonist opiates. That was only in the last 6 months, before that there was nothing, as a matter of fact we were discouraged from speaking to each other, I think there was a fear of having addicts in the waiting room together... oh well.

But now we have this resource, which makes all of the other tools work better for me. There might not be anyone in a meeting I am in who understands Sub withdrawal, but they do have other experience we can share and benefit from. I'm sure you understand where I'm going, this tool in invaluable, especially having contact with others who are exactly in the same zone, to see the breadth of experiences, what works for one person doesn't work for another. We are all cobbling together an individualized plan that works for us.

Thanks for sharing your experiences, I'm trying to go down the next step by taking 1.5 mg one day and 1.25 the next day. I'm not good at skipping days between doses, but I am trying to ease my body down below 1 mg. it's been 10 years, and I am scared, but reading and watching other people do it makes me brave. Also seeing that I'm okay at each taper point. That makes me feel like a drama queen, like why did I have to worry so much about something that is going just fine. The unknown is the monster under the bed, right?

Off to take the dogs for their morning run.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 8:28 am 
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Gingerpop wrote:
I am incredibly grateful to finally have some fellowship with people who are working on the same issue I am.

I'm trying to go down the next step by taking 1.5 mg one day and 1.25 the next day. I'm not good at skipping days between doses, but I am trying to ease my body down below 1 mg. it's been 10 years, and I am scared, but reading and watching other people do it makes me brave.


Good morning Gingerpop! I hear you on the "grateful" feeling- I am also SO grateful for this site- for various reasons meetings and drs. are not an option for me, so this is really my only support system, but it is proving (for me anyway) to be invaluable and so so helpful!!
Did I tell you I had / have about an 8 year habit, so we are both "long time" users? I get your "fear", but honesty, you will look back on your drops and wonder what you were "afraid" of, so try and let that go (I know, it is much easier said than done!). I have been dropping consistently and steadily, but have never "skipped" days (yet). I don't really plan on "skipping" days at all, unless when I jump it is just "so horrible" that I can't stand it, but I really don't think that is going to happen from what I've learned here. My plan is to get as low as I can (I'm thinking either .25 or .125mgs), stabilize, then jump. Not ready to schedule a "jump date" just yet, but feeling more and more confident the lower I go (at .375mgs for about a couple weeks now)
Happy you are feeling brave!!! You can do this!
rca


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2014 8:38 am 
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Speaking of this forum, I joined a different one months back when I was on a slow taper and ok with that. I was turned off after a couple posts because I was in no rush at that time to taper quickly and jump. I cant tell you how many people were like "welcome, here is a link to a taper plan (robert taper plan, maybe you heard of it and been on that forum), get on it and taper off quickly. Um no!!!!!!! Even after I clearly spelled out I was tapering with my dr and goin slow, they still posted that link over and over. So put off I left the forum.

Glad I found this forum and the supportive people on here.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 29, 2014 8:37 am 
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The last few days have been difficult. Mainly because my emotional state is all over the place. My feelings are raising their hands all at once, and it's overwhelming. The good thing is I am so scared and shaky that I'm willing to go to meetings I would not be willing to go to if I felt great. I tried going down to 1 mg one day and 1.25 the next, but I haven't stabilized at 1.25 yet, I need to back off a little, the plan isn't to draw out withdrawals for 2 months, it's to minimize them by tapering super slow.

I realized in the past 24 hours how serious this is, and that I have to manage it very mindfully. I may think I can jump down .50 at a time, but the body said a very loud NO yesterday. I guess from being on this medication for 10 years straight my body is holding on tight to having those opiate receptors filled. Even though I don't feel like it at all I am going to make myself do an extra long workout this morning, it's the only thing I can do that helps right now. I am not at the hot bath stage yet, but I considered it at 445 AM when my eyes opened wide my legs were cramping and I just couldn't sleep.

I went to a meeting last night where everyone was sharing on the topic of anonymity at work. I was listening to this raging debate, and thinking to myself that everyone who shared sounded pretty crazy. Darn me for judging when I'm there seeking help. I tried to listen with empathy, and after a bit i understood why each person had such passionate views about maintaining or abandoning their anonymity. To me recovery is a personal matter that I wouldn't consider discussing at work. Work is not the place I reveal my intimate self, it's work, and that is clear as can be for me. The thing some of the folks were saying is that their addiction led them to "the streets" where everyone knew they were using. In that state, thy wanted everyone to know now the aren't using. Fine, live and let live, right?

Ultimately I was given a reprieve of 1.5 hours last night from my self obsessed troubled mind and aching body. I am thankful for each person who shared their story. Unfortunately I have yet to meet anyone who was maintained on Suboxone, this is the only place I can go to communicate with others who are walking down this road. It can be lonely, I am so looking forward to the day I don't have to think about suboxone at all ever again. I am so over this, but not over it physically so I need to buck up stop whining.

I wish I had a more uplifting message today but this is where I am. The good news is it will change, probably 10 times over the course of the day. I am going to take my dog to his agility raining class in the afternoon, so that will keep mind and body occupied.

Thanks for reading, feedback is always appreciated.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 29, 2014 6:09 pm 
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Now that evening has rolled in, how are you feeling? In the first couple weeks after I jumped, my emotionsand thoughts were all over the place. I would go from being happy to this flat detached feeling within hours. Damn roller ccoaster ride for sure.

I absolutely know what you mean about having no one who was on subs to talk to. I only found that support network after I joined this forum. I also kept my recovery and sub use a secret at work. No one's business but mine was how I saw it. Still see it that way.

I hope your day went well!!!!!


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 30, 2014 3:52 am 
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Gingerpop wrote:
The last few days have been difficult. Mainly because my emotional state is all over the place. My feelings are raising their hands all at once, and it's overwhelming. The good thing is I am so scared and shaky that I'm willing to go to meetings I would not be willing to go to if I felt great. I tried going down to 1 mg one day and 1.25 the next, but I haven't stabilized at 1.25 yet, I need to back off a little, the plan isn't to draw out withdrawals for 2 months, it's to minimize them by tapering super slow.

I realized in the past 24 hours how serious this is, and that I have to manage it very mindfully. I may think I can jump down .50 at a time, but the body said a very loud NO yesterday. I guess from being on this medication for 10 years straight my body is holding on tight to having those opiate receptors filled. Even though I don't feel like it at all I am going to make myself do an extra long workout this morning, it's the only thing I can do that helps right now. I am not at the hot bath stage yet, but I considered it at 445 AM when my eyes opened wide my legs were cramping and I just couldn't sleep.

I went to a meeting last night where everyone was sharing on the topic of anonymity at work. I was listening to this raging debate, and thinking to myself that everyone who shared sounded pretty crazy. Darn me for judging when I'm there seeking help. I tried to listen with empathy, and after a bit i understood why each person had such passionate views about maintaining or abandoning their anonymity. To me recovery is a personal matter that I wouldn't consider discussing at work. Work is not the place I reveal my intimate self, it's work, and that is clear as can be for me. The thing some of the folks were saying is that their addiction led them to "the streets" where everyone knew they were using. In that state, thy wanted everyone to know now the aren't using. Fine, live and let live, right?

Ultimately I was given a reprieve of 1.5 hours last night from my self obsessed troubled mind and aching body. I am thankful for each person who shared their story. Unfortunately I have yet to meet anyone who was maintained on Suboxone, this is the only place I can go to communicate with others who are walking down this road. It can be lonely, I am so looking forward to the day I don't have to think about suboxone at all ever again. I am so over this, but not over it physically so I need to buck up stop whining.

I wish I had a more uplifting message today but this is where I am. The good news is it will change, probably 10 times over the course of the day. I am going to take my dog to his agility raining class in the afternoon, so that will keep mind and body occupied.

Thanks for reading, feedback is always appreciated.


Hi Gingerpop,

Just wanted to support you at what you are doing..and know that you are not the only one doing this..or the only one at this particular stage.
After seeing your post..I couldn't help but notice some similarities:
We both have almost a decade of using (I've been 9yrs on sub)
Both at 1,25mg atm :) and having difficulties..
From what I read you too are unpatient and would like to do it as fast as possible..I wanted to go down to 1mg after day 5, but my body just gave me a stronger than ever wd yesterday so I realised I have to take time to stabilize..
Anyway keep it up..stay patient..i guess we really have to take it day by day..


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 30, 2014 5:01 am 
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fuser wrote:
Hi Gingerpop,

Just wanted to support you at what you are doing..and know that you are not the only one doing this..or the only one at this particular stage.
After seeing your post..I couldn't help but notice some similarities:
We both have almost a decade of using (I've been 9yrs on sub)
Both at 1,25mg atm :) and having difficulties..
From what I read you too are unpatient and would like to do it as fast as possible..I wanted to go down to 1mg after day 5, but my body just gave me a stronger than ever wd yesterday so I realised I have to take time to stabilize..
Anyway keep it up..stay patient..i guess we really have to take it day by day..


Hey GP, just want to add my support as well today. We (you, I and fuser) have all been on sub for almost a decade. Today I am 5 days sober and I am 48 years old! If I can do it, so can you! Good advice, don't "rush", I mean, after 8-10 years, what is a few more months? I didn't give myself any dead line. I just thought "well, if I keep decreasing just a tiny bit, and do it every 3 weeks or so, "someday", I'll be at "zero", KWIM? It was just "logic" to me, and "one day at a time", it came to fruition. I am here for you guys anytime you need me. You can pm me if you like.

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