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 Post subject: Getting Ready to Stop!
PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 10:06 am 
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Hello Everybody and I mean everyone here.I have been reading all of the posts on this site and it has given me hope.
I am the mother of 2 young children of toddler ages and married.I am a nurse but current not working.First I would like to say thank you for your help and I hope to be of help in the future because I would like to have this forum to document my withdrawal phase and make some friend that can help me to get through it.Only an opioid user understands another like anybody else. I have the typical percocet,Vicodin,oxycontin addiction history.When I had a c-section in 2008 ,whooooa I was off to the races.Long story short ,this is my 2nd time on suboxone,the 1st was to detox from the pills,I jumped off at 8 mg.in a detox.The PAWS and blackest ,dysfunctional depression led me to go back on suboxoneI could not take care of my baby's,the house..never mind a shower.But once A day I went to an AA meeting,running after sobriety and any help.Bad move probably goin back on sub.forPAWS/depression.Dont know whats done is done. Now I am on 3mg sub-lingual 2mg in the am and 1mg at night. I have been offered (by my sister)that when I am ready to jump off she will take my children for a fun filled week ,while I go through the worst of the acute withdrawals.So I'm gonna take the opportunity to do this,so my children do not have to see me in a bad way.Can anyone tell me what I should keep in my "arsenal" of meds,vitamins and supplement that "truly" help.I become a sleepless,mad woman and my RLS extends upwards to my arms..yes that can happen.That and the depression scare me the worst,nope the RLS does.I had a doctor who said you wanna get off quickly take 30mg. of naltrexon ,I said great allthis misery will be done in 12 hours,great!DERP..it was pure insanity,we had to call the ambulance,for a reason you could not explain..basically,I'm Flippin the f... out times a million.Went back on the sub.next morning Please do not try that method!Any advice or a friend would help.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 11:07 am 
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Hi hopewins,

Welcome to the forum!!! We're glad to have ya!!

First I wanted to comment on using Naltrexone to get off of Suboxone, Naltrexone is a pure opiate antagonist. When you took that Naltrexone, it went racing through your brain knocking all the Suboxone off of your happy little receptors.....when it did that.....your happy little receptors went :twisted: . You basically put yourself into Precipitated Withdrawal.....worst wd imagineable!!! You've heard of the Rapid Detox facilities?? They use Naltrexone to knock all the other opiates off of those receptors, BUT they knock you out cold for like 24 hours while they're administering the Naltrexone.......Ummmm, you didn't get the benefit of the being knocked out cold part and that's why you were sucking pavement so hard. I just wanted you to know what happened.

You said, "Only an opioid user can understand another opioid user". I agree 100%!! To add to that, only someone who has been through opiate wd can truly understand opiate wd. You have certainly found a site where plenty of us have experienced opiate wd!!

As far as comfort meds, I mainly used Clonidine. I took .1mg twice daily. It helped tremendously with calming the Sympathetic Nervous System and it has a sedative effect!! YAY, sedative effect....most of us know what a bear it can be trying to sleep while in wd. I also used Xanax, but I used it very sparingly.....I was scared shitless of it. I started on a good multi-vitamin a day or two before I quit Suboxone, I don't know how much it helped though??

I see you're at 3mg per day. I pray that you're gonna lower your dose before you jump off. Personally, I'd like to see you well under 1mg per day before you jump. Do you mind sharing what dose of Suboxone you were hoping to jump off of?

You sound like me as far as HATING the RLS more than anything. I had it reach my arms before too. NOT FUN!! The thing that worked great for me, as far as the RLS, was running on an elliptical machine for just a minute or two. Those two minutes of running would knock out my RLS for up to 2.5 hours at a time at the height of my RLS.

The last thing I wanted to remind you of was this.....staying as busy as you possibly can during wd is critical to minimizing your wd. I know your body will be SCREAMING at you to sit down and not move a muscle during your wd, but that's one of the worst things you can do......trust me.....I turned into a couch potato during my wd, I took 5 weeks off of work and it was the STUPIDEST thing I could have done(well, putting my hand on that burning hot stove when I was a kid was pretty dang stupid, especially seeing as my mother had just got done telling me not to touch the stove!! :D ). You have to keep your mind busy, first and foremost, then try to keep your body busy.

Best of luck to you and I hope you keep in touch.

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Last edited by Romeo on Sun Jul 10, 2011 11:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 11:09 am 
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Welcome! I guess the main question that comes to mind is...why do this to yourself?


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 11:48 am 
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Hi hopewins and welcome. You're certainly not the only person to go back on sub because of horrible PAWS. I would say it was that bad for you because you did such a short taper and jumped from such a high dose. PAWS isn't only just caused by suboxone. So when you had PAWS that time after using sub just to detox, it was likely caused by all the opiates that came before suboxone.

As for your plan to stop now, I agree with Romeo that you should taper down further before stopping. 3 mg is still way too high a dose to jump from. Ideally, if you do a long, slow taper and get really low before you stop, you will have less of a chance of extreme acute and post-acute withdrawals. When you don't taper slowly, you don't give your brain any time to adjust to being without the opiates. That's why the slow taper should give you less withdrawals - it gives your body time to adjust.

For withdrawals, the best medication for comfort is Clonidine - a prescription blood pressure med. And again, exercise and stay busy. Distract, distract, distract. Many a person has attested that once they did force themselves to get up and about they felt SO much better. Hot baths help too. And anything that will make you laugh...it releases endorphins and without the sub our body will start producing our own endorphins again.

So if you have the time, I'd advise you to slow down and give yourself time to get to a much lower dose before stopping. There's no rush and it's not a race. Isn't taking a little more time worth it to save yourself worse withdrawals?

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 2:39 pm 
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In the future 1 of you could tell me how to respond without posting your names to get your attention..this is new to me,LOL!. Romeo your 1st paragraph is so sad but true,why would a doc allow that?! A coma would have been nice..I see you and Hatmaker have the same beliefs on the meds and coming down to below 1mg,I agree,I would like to get to.25 if possible.OMG I could not imagine exercising while wd's but that is exactly why I am here! to do something differently so I can succeed.So when all is said and done the men is clonidine.What dose worked for you guys,I read at higher doses it stops RLS as,then I read that tramadol helps.And yes I am scared of those Xanax too,I dont need another :roll: story,do I?lol. Moman,I just feel its time for me to come off,I have been preparing in other areas of my life to do it,my meetings and my faith and support.Unless you are referring to the naltrexone I have no valid answer..In my mind(be Careful)I thought I would just have a lil worse wd symptoms and be done..was I ever wrong!Thank you so much everybody,I will keep you posted.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 2:55 pm 
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Yeah, Tramadol is gonna help ease your wd's......because it's an opiate!! DON'T take Tramadol to help with your wd, you would be playing with fire. We have plenty of people on this site who are on Suboxone because of addictions to Tramadol. I didn't really mean to jump down your throat, sorry about that, just wanted you to know what Tramadol is.

You can continue posting our names to get our attention or you can just post a reply and see who responds. There really is no right or wrong way. Do what works for you, OK?

I'm so glad you included the fact that you have been preparing for this wd in other areas of your life. You mentioned your meetings, your faith and your support group.....again, I'm really happy to hear that. Quitting Suboxone is one thing, staying off all drugs is another hurdle altogether.

Don't be afraid to post any questions you have. There are a lot of kind, caring and knowledgable people here who are more than willing to try and help you get through.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2011 11:52 pm 
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Thank You So Much!


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 Post subject: Hatmaker and Romeo
PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 7:00 am 
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I just wanted to share with you that my husband will not let my daughter go to my sisters for a week,while I'm in the acute stage! This is "some" of the reason that gave me more drive to quit I add again "some"It is quite visible when I withdraw and my lil girl is sooo in touch with me,we are like 1 person..we have a very intense mommy/daughter relationship.Some more info,my sis.is her Godmother and my daughter absolutely loves being there with her cousins,everyday is fun and something is always planned,she cries when we have to go home sometimes..so it would not in any way be bad for her.I honestly dont feel I could be the mommy she is used to during that time,I'm thinking of pressing the issue,strongly! what do you guys think about it?


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 10:11 am 
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If you taper down low enough (and do so slowly) before stopping, you're not going to be nearly as sick as you were the last time. Many people who taper down and off continue going to work and doing the normal things in their every day lives. I believe the trick is to not perseverate on every little withdrawal symptom - that just serves to make you even more aware of them. And think of it this way, your daughter will keep you busy and occupied. And it's normal for moms to get sick every now and then, right? That's all you need to tell her if she asks. She gets sick sometimes, and so do mommies.

You've got time while you're tapering lower before you'll stop altogether. Try to relax a bit and not get to wrapped up in things, as I think it will just add to your anxiety over the whole thing.

That's my two cents. Good luck. You can do this.

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-As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 10:34 am 
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Hi hopewins,

I'm gonna go ahead and tell you what I did, even though you might go :shock: !!

My wife and I decided to have our daughter, who was 11 at the time, stay home with me during my wd. She was out of school for the summer at the time. I thought it would be a good lesson for her to know what detoxing off of drugs looked like, plus she helped take care of me. She didn't sit and watch me 24/7, but she saw enough to make her think twice about ever taking drugs and that's what I wanted.

BTW, I jumped off of Suboxone at a fairly high dose, around 5mg plus, my wd was certainly on the harsh side....that's putting it mildly.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 11:41 am 
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I agree with the advice already given...... I jumped at .25mg and I lowered my dose as my body allowed me ( I waited till I adjusted on a dose then went down then started skipping days) the wd wasent so bad, I comared it to having a bad cold, clonidine helped the crawly skin feelings and I did ALOT of working out but I have been working out for years.... the best advice I can give is to not sit still and feel sorry for yourself.. even walking down the block will help make a difference


Good luck and keep us posted.........we are here if you need us..........go at your own pace and be kind to yourself :)

Lisa


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 12:31 pm 
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You got some good advice already, so I don't have much to add, other than to wish you tons of luck. I'm tapering too and have been since the end of October (from 8 mg).

One piece of advice I think I should have tried to follow but didn't is only dosing once a day. I'm down to .375, but I got super stuck at various levels and couldn't figure out why. I was dosing twice a day, sometimes even three times a day, which I'd gotten used to because I was taking my Sub for pain. I got serious symptoms during this taper, like painful, restless legs and sweats/chills all the time, etc. Recently, I committed to spacing my doses as much as possible. No more multiple doses during the day to take the edge off. Since I've been doing this, I've been amazed at the difference. For a brief period, I had to power through some uncomfortable times during the day, but I learned that I could do that because the symptoms would let up before I took more Sub. I'm doing higher percentage drops with far less pain. I think it trains your brain somehow when you are only dosing once a day and when you are giving your body multiple doses, your body demands it and throws more symptoms at you. This 'shouldn't' be the case, but for some reason it seems like it is. So, if you can, combine your dose into one before you drop and take it in the evening so you can sleep.

Other than that, just be consistent and dedicated. If you drop too much and cannot take it, just go back to the dose you dropped from and try the lower dose again in a couple days. I think tapering off Sub is entirely possible, but it takes a ton of resolve, so stick with it with all you've got. It will pay off.

Good luck!!

laddertipper

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 5:12 pm 
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Once again thanks to everyone,Hatmaker you are correct about thinking too much..I can make it a self fulfilling prophecy for sure! And I feel more hope when I hear ,that when you taper correctly,I wont experience what I have in the past.The detox I went to sent me to rehab..1 day after stopping 8 mgs.abruptly....wow know that I think about it,hmmm.I was forced yo be busy in rehab,it was AWFUL! but I did. It's when I came home and did nothing I became sooo very depressed. However I was not well liked @ rehab for the first week.lol Romeo I understand perfectly what you did..and I hope he/she really soaked it up and it becomes a permanent part of they're working mind"not to do it" and is it Laddertripper ,if I'm wrong please forgive me,not to good with screen names yer.How did you get to .375,film tabs I guess?please let me know....I was thinking today,whats with the opiates and me..and not to minimize any other addiction anybody suffers with,we all have are own.But to me a drug that made me feel euphoric,energized,happy to clean ceiling fans,plus supermom and I thought I wasn't High!...lol Something my mother told me and it shocked me because she does not speak this aggressively is"If your f.... around with opiates you are going to have to reintroduce your self to your children all over again and welcome real life in,because it's not meant to be euphoria!"and for some reason I think I should be skipping around all happy constantly and its just not the truth.Can or will any of you share your wd story with me and how you are know?Mostly how are you know?


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