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PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2013 2:00 pm 
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hi my name is allan. am new to forums. alittle about me. iam 65 w/ wife and 25 year old at home and 4 married kids .love those grandkids. 2008-2012 on 500 mg. vicodin.11/11 decidedto get off .prescribed by doctor for fibermyalgia for pain. in4 yearsnever abused pills. got sick withdrawal detoxed1 week .didnt work so doc put me on 2mg suboxon.so from 1/12/12to presenthave been on suboxon. i have tapered down to .5 mg and can go no futher. 1 doctor tried suboxon detox 4 days in hospital10/12. after 14 days too much nausea w/ clonidin and zofran .so went back. doc.2 kicked me up to 4 mg. sub. and wife said no. we are going backwards. at later visit he said go back on vicodin. doc 3 a suboxone withdawal specialist said why go off? laterhe put me on neurotin which iam afraid to take .before all this started in 2008 i never had any mental problems. now on .5 suboxon i have little panic attacks and get paranoid.i take 1mg ativan to help me thru these.when will this end? i dont know how to get off this small amount.am considering rapid detox 10000.dollars insurance not accepted. this shit is ruining my life. i feel like a prisoner.an addict wish original doctor warned me about how long withdrawal would be and how dificult to get off.any help comments,suggestions,would be appreciated. my kids want their dad back.


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PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2013 3:50 pm 
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Hi, Al71246, I am so sorry to hear about all the trouble you are having and how many differing opinions you are getting and all the confusion you must be feeling because of all of this. I am not quite sure why this happens, but a lot of people have agitation, panic attacks, and anxiety once they taper down to a very small dosage of suboxone. .5 is a small amount and my theory is this.... .5mg is not quite enough of the suboxone to completely block your receptors so your brain is fighting with itself. I know that sounds kinda crazy, but it is the best way I know how to describe it. You have chemical messengers and buprenorphine the active ingredient in suboxone attaches itself to these receptors blocking them from recieving full agonist opiates and my common sense tells me that it also blocks your natural production opiate that your brain makes naturally from being recieved by the receptors. Well, if you are on such a low dosage that your receptors are not staying completely blocked then your natural opiates start trying to produce again but since the receptors cannot absorb the opiates your brain is producing completely then your brain gets a little confused. It is trying to produce the natural stuff but there is this little bit of synthetic opiate buprenorphine attached to the receptor that would recieve this information, yet there is not enough of the synthetic opiate to block it completely so your receptor is getting a little of the natural opiate and a little of the synthetic opiate as well. It is keeping your brain in a confused state. I hope you can understand what I am trying to explain at least a little bit. This is my best advice, .5mg of suboxone is a low enough amount that you should be able to stop taking it without having terrible withdrawals or effects. You WILL feel some discomfort, but that is normal because your natural receptors in your brain need time to get straightened out so they can start doing their job again. It is normal to feel a lack of energy, anxiety, sleeplessness, restless legs and some general discomfort. Maybe even some stomach issues when you discontinue subs completely. You will probably start to feel some discomfort within the first day of stopping because you are on such a low dosage, it won't hold you over for three to four days before withdrawals set in like it does for some people coming off of higher dosages. This is not a bad thing though in the long run it is a good thing, it just means your receptors in your brain will return to normal function faster so you should'nt feel bad for as long as some people describe. I would guestimate around two weeks of feeling some mild withdrawal then you should start to feel better everyday after that. I would suggest you keep taking the ativan for the anxiety. You may even ask your doctor for some muscle relaxants and some extra ativan to take at bedtime so you can get some sleep. I would only take the muscle relaxants and ativan for about two weeks by then you should be starting to feel much better. If you have already been taking the ativan for a while you may consider just staying on it at a low dosage. Don't try to stop taking everything at once... Like I said if you have already been taking the ativan for a while that will cause you to have withdrawals if you stop taking it suddenly. You will need to wean off of it over several weeks if you decide to stop taking that drug. I honestly feel that by you taking .5mg of sub for a while you are just keeping your brain in limbo. It is as if you are going through minor withdrawals everyday and that is why you are not feeling well. I suggest like I said for you to just stop taking the suboxone at this point, expect a couple of weeks of feeling like you have the flu, then things should start getting better everyday after that. On the days while you are withdrawling get out and take short walks even if it is the last thing you feel like doing. Make yourself eat light meals and drink plenty of water. If you cannot get outside for some reason then just walk around your house several times everyday several times throughout the day. Turn on some of your favorite music and just walk or do some exercises. This is very important, it WILL help you get better faster. Take a multi-vitamin everyday as well. Best wishes and KNOW YOU CAN do this! A couple of weeks of feeling bad is nothing compared to all of the days you are going to feel so much better once this is behind you.


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 Post subject: al71246
PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2013 4:17 pm 
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Sorry. i forgot to address the nausea you mentioned. There are natural ways to treat this as well as otc meds that do help. Take Immodium AD as often as needed, you can take twice the amount suggested on the label and it is safe. Immodium helps with stomach issues and also helps with the goosebump chill feeling we get on our skin during withdrawals. Also, LEMONS, warm lemon water with a little natural honey eases the stomach and nausea. Lemons cut up and sprinkled with salt to suck on when you feel nausea creeping up helps. Any type of really sour candy to suck on will help nausea. OTC meds that help are Dramamine normally used for motion sickness, helps with nausea during withdrawal and any type of antihistamine like benadryl can also help. Just try them and see what works for you to ease nausea. Ginger is another good remedy for nausea, buy some ginger-ale made with real ginger and sip on it and eat some dry crackers to help the nausea. I have found that these remedies work sometimes ten times better than any of the prescription nausea meds.


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PostPosted: Sat May 25, 2013 5:55 pm 
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.5mg is still a pretty high dosage to jump from. The dr. that runs this site suggests that you think about it in micrograms. Right now you are taking 500 micrograms of suboxone. Maybe the reason you are having panic attacks is that you haven't stabilized on that dose yet??? There is a thread on this forum called the liquid taper method. I suggest you look that up and really consider tapering down as low as possible. The lower you taper down the less discomfort you will feel when finally jumping off suboxone all together. And remember you were on opiates for years so it's going to take awhile for your body to get back to normal, but the lower you taper down the more you can lessen your discomfort when you finally jump off. Good luck to you!

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 Post subject: Another Way
PostPosted: Sun May 26, 2013 1:44 pm 
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There is another way that isn't discussed too often here as a way to taper. Ask your doctor for the Butrans patch. It comes in microgram doses. 5, 10, and 20 mcg's. I did the math and the 20 mcg one dispenses around 2 mg's of Bupe every day for 7 days. So using my math, the 10 mcg is equal to 1 mg delivered continuously even for 7 days. You could start with that one or if you can taper to .50 of your Sub, ask for the 5 mcg patch and just leave it on for maybe 2-3 weeks. This is just a guess on my part but it sounds like it makes sense to me.

Talk to your doctor and see what they have to say. I am surely no medical expert but I do know one person who did this and had minimal w/d's at the end.

You were so close to the finish line. Keep trying, you'll get there eventually.

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PostPosted: Wed May 29, 2013 12:04 am 
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al71246 reporting. thank you thegreatestislove for your input.i tried some hints. helped some. on .5 mg still nausea.iam having severe off and on depression and paranoia. if i take half 1mg. ativan it helps alot. dont know what this means. scary sometimes.sometimes am close to edge .my wife is off school for summer. this will help. dont know why ativan helps my symptons.doc not avail. for 2 months. would like to talk to him about butrans patch w/ burpe.feadback is appreciated


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 Post subject: al71246
PostPosted: Sat Jun 01, 2013 12:45 pm 
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al71246,
How are you doing now? Did you ever get a chance to speak with your doctor? I just wanted to check in on you as it has been a few days since your last post here. I wondered if you had found a solution to your paranoia, nausea etc.? Check back in with us and let us know how you are doing and what your doctor suggested, if you have seen him yet. Your experience can help others who may be dealing with some of the same issues.

I hope you are feeling a lot better now. Hope to hear from you soon.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:37 am 
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Hi al71246....sorry to read of your problems. I get a little confused reading here on different mg's.....are you taking tablets or strips? I'm on the 8mg/2mg strips and try to only take 1/4 of a strip per day. I went through a painful withdrawal the last week of 2012 because I ran out and no Dr hours on holidays.....I LIVED in the bathtub!! Hot water helped so much. Hoping things work for you, its sad those of us who are trying to do right have to suffer doing it.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 02, 2013 9:38 am 
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Hey just thought i would mention that maybe the neurontin could really help you. I believe it is prescribed for nerve pain, so it should help with your fibro. But also ive read that it is sometimes prescribed off lable for opiate wd. Some people claim that it really helps out with anxiety ect from wd, so maybe its worth a shot for you to try.


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