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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 10:21 pm 
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Well hello all!

Some of you may remember me, most of you probably do not but I'm back. I haven't been on the forums for just over a year and a lot has happened since then.

My last posts were about stopping Suboxone and the troubles I have had trying to do so. In addition, I often spoke about the troubles in my life which I believed to be caused by Suboxone or, at the very least, Suboxone contributed to some of the issues I had such as sleeping, waking up, etc...

I spoke of trauma I have suffered over the years, some of which was somewhat recent and how I thought it effected me.

Anyway, I bought two types of oral syringes as I was going to use the "Taper Method" presented by Diary of a Quitter. It was a great idea and probably would have worked for me if only I could have brought myself to start the process. It seemed I was working at it in small steps with the first one being the decision to buy the oral syringes and then hopefully build up the courage to actually use them to help me come off of Subs.

Well, in the end, I decided to go into an sober living home/rehab whatever you want to call it. It may have been overkill but I thought it to be necessary. In addition, I was also on Adderall and Klonopin which I had been prescribed for as long as I was on Sub (about 5 years). Although, I had been prescribed Klonopin for 10 years or so but I never really had any issues with them and honestly, I never really took them unless I wanted to enhance a buzz or something of the sort. (In the past that is.) I was prescribed those for anxiety back in the day.

So, I went to rehab for 3 solid months. I remember pulling into the parking lot and taking three times what I normally would have of all 3 medz. Sub, Klonopin and Adderall. My thinking was that I may as well end this with a "bang" so to say. And immediately after I swallowed the pills everyone from the house was down at my car to help me move my stuff into the house and to welcome me. Shortly after, I gave all of my medz to the head of the household and that was that. They also took my keys and cell phone for a couple of weeks.

The first month was absolutely miserable. I can't say if it was because of the Sub, Klonopin or Addie w/d or if was a combo of w/d from all 3. My anxiety was through the roof and I came closer to having an anxiety attack on one particular day than I have in 10 years or so. Food tasted horrible (when I could eat), and my sleeping habits were just as bad as they were when I was on the medz. Everyone had different bits of advice for me but the only thing that really made it better was time.

There is, of course, a lot more to this story which I may go into later on but really I just wanted to let the people whom I had spoke with on the forums before know that I was off of Suboxone and that I'm grateful for being off of it.

To anyone out there who is trying to come off of Subs you probably won't have to take the same measures I did but for me it seemed the only way.

I do, however, still deal with an enormous amount of anxiety without all of the medz. I honestly believe that quitting the Klonopin was a mistake as I have used those for anxiety on and off for over a decade. But now what do I do? Lol! Well, at least the Sub problem has been addressed.

What do you guys think? Should I explain this to my old doctor (about the anxiety) Or what?

Moving on, it's great to be Sub free! :D I wanted to post sooner and thought about posting when I was in rehab but at that time I wasn't really motivated to do anything. Lol!

Look forward to hearing from some of you again and I hope that you are all doing well!

Oh, I've been off of Suboxone for over 5 months now!!! This didn't seem possible this time last year! :wink:

Sincerely,

PAinguIN

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2012 10:46 pm 
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I wanted to mention that one thing that did seem to make a big difference was taking multi-vitamins. They helped to give me energy when I ordinarily felt completely drained. I'm sure they aided in many different ways as well, perhaps even psychologically.

PAIN

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 3:51 am 
Im SO extremely happy for ya!! Thats a really awesome accomplishment and i'd just like to wish u total success with ur journey!! Awesome job man keep it up!!


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 7:45 am 
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I don't remember you, and I think I would have because I love your avatar! I didn't start lurking on this site until last October though, when I started sub.

I'm glad that you did whatever worked for you! We all follow a different path and sometimes it takes extreme measures or some trial and error to meet our goals. I was on 16 mg of sub for 5 months before I started tapering my dose. I've gotten down to 5 mg so far with very little trouble and no real anxiety. I know that the toughest part of the taper is still ahead of me, but I feel positive I can do this.

Thanks for coming back and sharing your story! I certainly don't think there would be any problem with you bringing up your anxiety with your doctor. I'm not an all or nothing type of gal. :) If you need help with anxiety then it's perfectly appropriate to talk to your doctor. Best of luck!

Amy

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 4:21 pm 
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nemesis wrote:
Im SO extremely happy for ya!! Thats a really awesome accomplishment and i'd just like to wish u total success with ur journey!! Awesome job man keep it up!!


Thanks nemesis! Much appreciated!!! :D

PAIN

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 6:49 pm 
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Amy-Work In Progress wrote:
I don't remember you, and I think I would have because I love your avatar! I didn't start lurking on this site until last October though, when I started sub.

I'm glad that you did whatever worked for you! We all follow a different path and sometimes it takes extreme measures or some trial and error to meet our goals. I was on 16 mg of sub for 5 months before I started tapering my dose. I've gotten down to 5 mg so far with very little trouble and no real anxiety. I know that the toughest part of the taper is still ahead of me, but I feel positive I can do this.

Thanks for coming back and sharing your story! I certainly don't think there would be any problem with you bringing up your anxiety with your doctor. I'm not an all or nothing type of gal. :) If you need help with anxiety then it's perfectly appropriate to talk to your doctor. Best of luck!

Amy


Lol! Thanks Amy! I love that avatar too! I've actually had a few comments on it over the past couple of years.

You're doing the right thing tapering like you are. Are you using the liquid taper method or just taking smaller doses under your tongue?

Tapering down helped me tremendously when I finally went to rehab. I guess I was down to probably 1-2 mg a day. Breaking up the 8mg tablets into pieces so small they would nearly turn to powder. I probably did this for a year or so. When I finally did detox I think I only threw up once or twice and other than a general feeling of discomfort and anxiety the process really wasn't that bad. Especially when I heard some of the stories from other guys at the place I was at regarding Sub withdrawal. They literally scared me to death and in my first week it was like waiting on a terrible storm to hit. I didn't really know when w/d would start and along with the stories it made things pretty nerve racking.

But again, it really wasn't that bad... And if I knew then what I knew now I would have spared my family the burden of paying $10,000 to send me to this place because with a little more effort I probably could have stopped on my on just as many of the people on here have.

I kept telling myself how horrible the w/d would be for a couple of years and thus made it much, much harder on myself than it actually was.

With that said, hang in there and I know that if I can stop taking Subz than anyone can. If they need/want to that is....

I don't think doctors should keep people on Subz for longer than a few months. In fact, I think it is only supposed to be taken for 2-3 months or something like that I believe.

Moreover, regarding the anxiety, I'm having a good day today. But I'm certain that it will come back as soon as I'm stressed out or whatever. And having anxiety with me being an addict is probably not a good thing. So I guess I will have to talk to my old doctor and see what he thinks.

We'll see I guess! :-)

PAinguIN

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 9:55 pm 
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Congrats PAINguin. I'm new here but it's good to see long-term success, as I am still a rookie success right now at 3 weeks off.

And don't you deal with those stressed out moments even better now clean? I know I have so far. In fact, nothing seems as stressful anymore.

That's the burden of abuse. We're constantly stressed out because that little voice is saying 'Do I have enough to get through"?

Not anymore!

Keep shinin'


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2012 10:25 pm 
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seaonasdad wrote:
Congrats PAINguin. I'm new here but it's good to see long-term success, as I am still a rookie success right now at 3 weeks off.

And don't you deal with those stressed out moments even better now clean? I know I have so far. In fact, nothing seems as stressful anymore.

That's the burden of abuse. We're constantly stressed out because that little voice is saying 'Do I have enough to get through"?

Not anymore!

Keep shinin'


Thanks!

And wow! What a difference when it comes to stressful situations! Everyone I know has told me how much I've changed since coming off of Subz. I used to be moody as heck before and would of course make any stressful situation that much worse. It was a crap shoot everyday as to rather I would be in a good mood or a horrible mood. I still have my ood and my bad days of course but nothing like it used to be.

I can certainly think more clearly as well. Although, I'm unsure if coming off of Subz is the reason why I couldn't concentrate before (even with Adderall) or if the combination of medz I was on was to blame.

And another bonus is that I don't have to spend money on Subz from the pharmacy or doctor's fees. :-D

Anyway, thanks for your post and if I may say so myself you're doing very well too! Three weeks is a big deal my friend. Hang in there!

Pain

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2012 12:42 am 
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I use 2 mg films right now, so it's really easy to slice off a precise dose.

I disagree a little bit on the best length of time to be on sub. While a relatively short stint on sub may be good for me, I know that for others, it's important to be on a steady dose for years. I think it's really individual for every person. There are people here who reacted so badly to sub that they knew they had to get off of it as soon as possible. And there are others who have never really had troubling side effects, and whose lives have so turned around for the better that it makes sense for them to stay on sub indefinitely.

I'm so glad that withdrawal did not hit you as hard as you anticipated! That's always a welcome surprise!

It sounds like your anxiety needs to be addressed in order to protect your sobriety. I've had panic attacks in the past and some general anxiety. I'm on 60 mg of generic prozac and I have xanax for any "emergency" situations. I've never used xanax to potentiate a high, so having around does not mess with my sobriety. I hope you get the help you need.

Cheers,
Amy

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2012 4:49 pm 
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@ Amy

Yeah, I tried the films for a short while. I think they were 8mg films though. I found it difficult to take smaller doses. I mean, you can cut it in half to give you 4mg. The half into a half for 2mg. But beyond that the small sliver of film that was left for less than 2mg just didn't seem (at least psychologically) as effective to me. I swiftly went back on the 8mg tablets.

Although, the films were a bit cheaper if I do recall. One thing I didn't like was this HUGE bottle they would give me the films in. Even if I only bought a 3 or 4 films they would give me this absolutely enormous bottle for them. Lol! I thought it was funny at the time...

But, all in all, the films seem to be just as effective as the tablets. I should have checked in to the 2mg films, that may have made it easier for me to take a small dose.

And you're right, in your thoughts on the length of time to stay on subz. It is different for everyone. In fact, I was on them for 5 years aside from a 3 month period where I relapsed shortly into my treatment. I have heard stories of people whom have little or no problems with the side effects of sub as well. In fact, when I first transitioned from Oxy's to Subz I stayed on them for about 2 weeks (the 2mg tablets) and just stopped cold turkey with no issues whatsoever. However, as I mentioned, I relapsed and ended up on the Subz again and this time for the long haul.

As my story suggests, I had a horrible time trying to quit taking subs after being on them so long. It was, however, more of a psychological barrier than a physical one.

But whatever works for the individual is what's important. And who knows, I'm off of subz now but I am a drug addict. I try not to tell myself that I will never abuse opiates again (or other drugs for that matter) because to me it seems that I"m setting myself up for failure. As long as I remember that I am an addict and there will ALWAYS be a chance that I could relapse I think I have a better chance of staying sober.

But if, lord forbid, I were to relapse with the opiates again I would go back on Suboxone because it saved my life before.

My problems with opiates started in 2005 or so and it has taken me until 2012 to completely go back to being the person that I was before opiates. With that said, I hope to never have to deal with any opiates ever again.

The anxiety issues must be addressed, I agree, I don't need anything to tempt my addictive nature. LoL!

I hope to go back to my doc next week. I haven't seen him since I left for rehab and I had built quite a relationship with him and his wife over the years. It will be good to see them again and I'm certain he will be able to help me with the anxiety.

PAIN

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2012 8:08 pm 
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Congrats man! I recently kicked Suboxone after ~3 years of use. Klonopin was also part of my story which you can read here: http://suboxforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=6749.

As they say in the program - you are now living life on life's terms. No Klonopin is certainly contributing to your increased anxiety, but if you want my advice I suggest that you learn healthier ways to deal with it than taking another pill - whether it be Klonopin or not. You've come this far .. and doesn't it feel great to be completely clean? I know it does for me. With the right habits, friends, support groups, etc., I'll confident you'll be fine and will learn new coping mechanisms.

I have to jet, but feel free to reach out to me via PM. Klonopin in a nutshell is a short-term fix to a long-term problem. People underestimate the power of benzos even in small doses. I just wanted to say congrats again on your recent accomplishments - you are doing a killer job and please do keep it up & keep us posted.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 06, 2012 11:03 pm 
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neilyoung wrote:
Congrats man! I recently kicked Suboxone after ~3 years of use. Klonopin was also part of my story which you can read here: http://suboxforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=6749.

As they say in the program - you are now living life on life's terms. No Klonopin is certainly contributing to your increased anxiety, but if you want my advice I suggest that you learn healthier ways to deal with it than taking another pill - whether it be Klonopin or not. You've come this far .. and doesn't it feel great to be completely clean? I know it does for me. With the right habits, friends, support groups, etc., I'll confident you'll be fine and will learn new coping mechanisms.

I have to jet, but feel free to reach out to me via PM. Klonopin in a nutshell is a short-term fix to a long-term problem. People underestimate the power of benzos even in small doses. I just wanted to say congrats again on your recent accomplishments - you are doing a killer job and please do keep it up & keep us posted.


Thanks for the post neilyoung,

I followed the link to your post and read your story. I followed a very similar path. I used drugs to feel better about myself and to be able to deal with the outside world. And then, I was prescribed adderall (at the same time I was put on subz) and I too felt like I had an edge over everyone else. In fact, from that point forward in my life I had become more successful (professionally) and more confident than I had ever been. But, as time went on things changed. I'm not really sure why but I started to become more withdrawn and anti-social.

Even today, now that I'm clean, I still feel somewhat withdrawn and anti-social. I don't really understand why, I always had lots of friends back in the day and was always doing something that most would call "living life". These days I'm trying to get back to work (in my field) and move forward with my life. I think a lot of what I'm feeling now, although I am clean, is due to the fact that I'm not satisfied with where I am in my life. Five years ago I was making great money, traveling the country and living a pretty exciting life. These days not so much..

But I guess it's a step by step process. At least for me... At least I'm not seeking confidence through drug use and am trying to change the way I feel by accomplishing goals I have set for myself.

Anyway, just being off of drugs is enough for me right now and I know things will get better each and every day! :D

I could really relate to your story and I appreciate you posting the link to it.

PAIN

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 07, 2012 7:42 am 
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[font=Comic Sans MS]Hello PAIN!!!! You sound terrific! Keep up the great work! I just wanted to say hello and congratulate you on your success. I'd love to hear more of your story and how things went with thte sober living facility. I"ll go back and read your old posts and try to get some details. You said you posted it back then? Cool, I like getting to know our members! LOL

Anyway, the avatar is GREAT!!!! Probably my favorite. I don't know how to upload those stinking things on to my profile...so I'm left with choosing from the ones the website has to offer. It always says that my avatar is too big???? Oh well, I love a sense of humor though....I think it can make any situation a hell of a lot better!

Best of luck to you, and again, Congrats![/font]

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