It is currently Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:08 am



All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Our Sponsors





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 13 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 5:05 pm 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2011 5:36 am
Posts: 138
https://youtu.be/66cYcSak6nE

_________________
Opportunity may only knock once but temptation leans on the doorbell...


Snake


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 7:07 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member

Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2013 4:49 pm
Posts: 517
I watched the video and really didn't find it was informative. Some things i agreed with, small men like power, we are destroying the earth but didn't agree with his statement that having a crappy childhood makes you an addict. Sorry


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:51 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 24, 2008 11:03 pm
Posts: 1543
I think that people who have experience addiction have a better understanding of the condition than anyone with a theory. People love to have complex things broken down into simple equations-- especially if they are given the impression that 'other people' have problems that they are smart enough to avoid...

I think that the AA definition of alcoholism is about the best description of addictive disorders-- that they are 'cunning, baffling, and powerful'. I also like the description of addiction that parallels the US Supreme Court's description of pornography.... as in 'I don't know how to describe it, but I know it when I see it'. http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2007/09/27/the-origins-of-justice-stewarts-i-know-it-when-i-see-it/

I think we all know that 'addiction is real'.... even if we struggle to describe it.


Top
 Profile  
 
Our Sponsors
PostPosted: Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:26 pm 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2011 5:36 am
Posts: 138
The part of the speech that lead me to some reflection time was when he mentioned; that to some people opiates are addictive and to some people they are not. food is but not etc..I reflected on this I can relate. For instance I have had several hydro bottles passed down to me through the years from people who either:

A: didn't like to take them due to the way hydro made them feel. Which was always tired, or sleep for 2 days.

B: The meds where only needed for a few days for pain and moved on without a second thought. Gee what a shame to throw them away I thought

then there was/ is looking back a handful of people who just didn't know what they had in their bottle. Some made it through and a few found it later on.

I fell into the last group. I remember it like yesterday. I wasn't primed or anything of the sort. just here take this. I thought everything was like 800mg Ibuprofen, from the pharmacy.

We where told in 8th grade health/Drug class that Black Beauties and the barbits come from the same place heroin and cocaine comes from, the street, anyway it wasn't an 800mg ibuprofen, it was a 10mg Lortab Watson 540, Carmina Burana was heard instantly playing in background, and it was game over psychologically. Why so instant?

I like the description they ended up with for definition of Porn. You know it when you see it.
Same could be said here to we, can't explain but we know it when we see it.

To tie in relating, everything together I think about Comedians. What makes a good comedian? It is being able to relate to what is being said. hearing a story you just lived 2 days ago. it's Priceless, just

Like you taking the time to comment Dr Junig! Thank You!

_________________
Opportunity may only knock once but temptation leans on the doorbell...


Snake


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 3:59 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2012 11:02 pm
Posts: 994
I agree with Dr Mate that addiction stems from a need to relieve pain, be it physical, mental or spiritual. Where our views diverge is that he attributes all addiction to childhood trauma. I know many addicts, myself included, who had relatively good upbringings. They came from loving families, were sent to good schools, had healthy relationships with their loved ones. In my case, my addiction started when I was in a lot of pain after experiencing my first acute episode of mental illness at age 17. It was a depressive psychosis, and ended up with me leaving school in my final year. I suppose you could argue it was a form of trauma in itself.

There was no violence or sexual abuse in my upbringing. I have two siblings who are quite well adjusted. I do however feel that I was more sensitive as a child. I was affected more by my parents fighting than my siblings. Something I've experienced in living with other addicts in both addiction and recovery is that addicts are on the whole more sensitive than others, and more easily affected by changes in life, be it a marriage breaking up, moving house etc.

I think Dr Mate's views are flawed due to sample bias. He only interviewed the homeless addicts living in Vancouver's downtown eastside. There are many addicts in the suburban enclaves who aren't homeless who he wouldn't have been exposed to in his work. I've been homeless at a couple of points in my life. I however, perhaps due to my upbringing, can't survive that life for any length of time. Any time I've had a housing crisis like that, I've gone to great lengths to change my circumstance by quitting my drug use, going on Suboxone, or going on rehab. Because of this, those phases of my life were transient. However, most of the people I interacted with in those phases who were long term homeless came from extremely disrupted upbringings. Parents in and out of jail, abusing drugs, domestic violence etc. Perhaps in coming from such upbringings, they could accept their lot more easily than I.

I take my hat off to anyone who can survive in long term addiction, with all its symptoms of destitution, homelessness and crime. I can't live like that for any length of time. I'd probably sooner off myself than accept that as my outcome.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 9:48 pm 
Online
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:42 am
Posts: 4127
Thanks for that thoughtful analysis, TJ. I, too, come from a loving, stable upbringing. I believe that childhood trauma potentiates the risk of addiction for people who are already genetically prone to developing addiction. It may also make it more difficult for them get help for addiction. I also believe that addiction exists on a continuum. Some become more easily addicted than others. For some addicts addiction progresses more quickly than for others, for some it progresses farther than for others.

For me, the trauma of my mother's early, unexpected death when I was 31 and my father's erratic romantic behavior for years after made me want a pill that made me feel good. At first my use was very sporadic. Years later, and after a year and a half of having a monthly prescription for 360 percocets, etc, I reached my breaking point and sought help. I was able to ask for help before I got into legal, financial, and personal trouble. Why was I able to do that when so many others don't hit a bottom until they're homeless or in jail? I think, in part, it was because I didn't have to deal with childhood trauma and the maladaptions that occur in the brain when such early trauma is part of your history.

Does any of that resonate with you, TJ?

Amy

_________________
Done is better than perfect!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 1:54 am 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2014 7:15 pm
Posts: 2296
Location: Tennessee
I definitely didn't have any trauma growing up either. My parents have been together for 50 yrs and gave me a great life. No abuse or unhappiness at all. I became addicted in my early 30's. I went through a heartbreaking divorce and was a single mother who was exhausted, that's when I tried opiates. I lost everything, went to jail at least 5 times, and was a walking zombie.

I believe the theory that addiction is somewhat hereditary because my grandfather was a raging alcoholic and died before I was born. My aunt, cousin and nephew are all addicts also and they're all on my mother's side of the family. None on my father's side whatsoever.

_________________
Jennifer


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Sep 27, 2015 11:28 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Tue Apr 21, 2015 11:30 pm
Posts: 27
While I don't think addiction is a myth I do believe it's definitely been looked at from the wrong angle for a long time. The idea of these all powerful and incredibly addictive substances is the myth. It's been shown in a few SAMHSA reports that the number of people who become problem users or even continue to use regularly is quite small compared to the whole population of drug users. With heroin they found 12% were dependent a year later with all other substances clocking in lower. These reports from SAMHSA also correlate with what was found with the heroin addicted veterans returning from Vietnam. There were about 20% of the veterans who were identified as heroin addicts but what Jerome Jaffee and Lee Robins found was after the soldiers were detoxed in Vietnam only 5% continued to use heroin when they returned home. The other 95% stopped using heroin with little, and in many cases, no treatment. I believe the role of the environment is seriously downplayed in addiction treatment. It can obviously be a huge factor, as it was with the soldiers returning from Vietnam. Of course this doesn't mean environment is the only factor to consider. I think there are many factors as to why a person falls into that 12% who become addicted. My personal believe is that for opiate addicts, many of us suffer from a deficiency of, or lack of sensitivity to, dopamine. This is why medication assisted treatment is so successful and other forms of treatment aren't. This would also explain why some of us will need medication for life and others won't.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 11:19 am 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator

Joined: Fri May 01, 2015 9:58 am
Posts: 882
Hi All, this is a great thread! For myself, it was childhood trauma, I lost my Father in a car accident when I was 3, my Grandfather passed away that same year. During my fourth year, my Grandmother died on my birthday and I was sexually abused by a male babysitter. My Mom lost both parents and her husband of four years all within 18 months. I have two younger siblings. My Mom became an overeating, abusive, alcholic. Our childhood was not the greatest of rides to say the least. I have worked with many people theough the years that are diagnosed with mental illness and addiction. There was trauma for some and for some it was the onset of a mental illness that led to addiction. I do believe that we can be predisposed to being an addict.Regardless of how you got there, it is work to find your way back to being free from addiction. And, I dont know that we are ever free...I think with us on suboxone it is controlled. I think with anstinence it is controlled. But,it is always there and it always requires needed attention!


Top
 Profile  
 
   
PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:02 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2017 3:57 am
Posts: 4
I don't think that drug addiction is a myth


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 9:38 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 8:47 am
Posts: 937
Location: Southeastern US (Alabama)
I'm not watching the video..based on the comments I see here, it wouldn't benefit me any.

I will say this..

We are the most medicated country in the world.

Most of our opiates come from some other country..mass produced and sent here...

I've read some things that say upwards of 95% of painkillers are used by united states.
That's astonishing...

Watch something informative, like the move on netflix, Oxycontin Express. Or, Oxyana..another great docu ...

_________________
Adam Wayne P.
DOB: July 1, 1985
October 8, 2013

RIP little brother. Gone, but not forgotten.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 6:07 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2012 11:02 pm
Posts: 994
A lot of the Thebaine that's turned into Hydro / Oxy etc comes from my country :shock:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 9:23 am 
Offline
Super-Duper Poster
Super-Duper Poster
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 30, 2016 7:01 pm
Posts: 353
Location: Mid-Atlantic
jonathanm1978 wrote:
I'm not watching the video..based on the comments I see here, it wouldn't benefit me any.

I will say this..

We are the most medicated country in the world.

Most of our opiates come from some other country..mass produced and sent here...

I've read some things that say upwards of 95% of painkillers are used by united states.
That's astonishing...

Watch something informative, like the move on netflix, Oxycontin Express. Or, Oxyana..another great docu ...


Also on netflix... The Wild And Wonderful Whites of West Virginia
the one guy shakes his oxy bottle and calls it the redneck mating call

_________________
Get your shit together and live your life." Black Snake Moan


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 13 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Our Sponsors
Suboxone Forum latest topics RSS feed Subscribe to the entire forum
 

 

 
Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

  • Board Certified Psychiatrist
  • Asst Clinical Professor, Medical College of Wisconsin

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group