It is currently Thu Aug 17, 2017 10:02 am



All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Our Sponsors





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Dosage question.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 5:16 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2014 5:02 am
Posts: 4
Hello.
First off I am so glad I found this place as there seems to be a lot of conflicting information out there.
My first question is about dosage.
I am trying to kick a Norco/Soma dependance that was starting to get very out of hand.
I was knd of embarrassed to go to my GP who had prescribed them initially and who knew I had a problem with them.

I was taking about 4-5 Hydrocodone 7.5/325's daily and about the same amount of Soma 350mg. (Usually matched on a 1 to One basis-One Norco and One Soma at a time)

After many attempts to detox "cold turkey" I finally decided to see an Opiate Dependency clinic today and all went well and He put me on 2 8mg strips per day.

This has been day one. It's 3AM and I can't sleep but it seems that that is typical as I have a bit of anxiety.

For what I was taking, does that dosage seem a bit high?
I feel "okay". It has effectively killed the withdrawals and I do feel a bit weird and "off".
But I assume this early in the game that this is normal.
But I have also read that starting out at a higher dose will also make it harder to wean oneself off later.

Any advice at this point would be appreciated.
Thanks in advance.

Logaine


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dosage question.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 8:25 am 
Offline
Super Poster
Super Poster

Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2014 11:49 pm
Posts: 124
I'm new here and so can't give you any significant answers but I can tell you these people on this forum were a big part of helping me and they will have some good advice for u soon...Now what I can tell you is that my induction was started day 1 on 16mg and I was taking oxycontin,oxycodone,norco,and some of the devil H from time to time meaning that certainly is a lot higher tolerance..with that being said everyone is different...but hang in there and several others here will have u like a wealth of knowledge in a short period of time...


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dosage question.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 11:05 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 1:02 pm
Posts: 1342
Location: West Tennessee
Hi Logaine,

I a word, yes, I think your doctor is going a little overboard with dosage. The problem with that is that if you continue to take the high dose, your tolerance will definitely be going up instead of down. Suboxone is incredibly strong even in 4-8mg doses compared to what you were taking prior.

Now, that being said, if you feel okay on that dose it's not going to kill you to stay there. Will it make it harder to taper later on? Probably not. But it will probably make it take longer. Most people report having absolutely no problem tapering until they get below 4mg. No matter what dose they started on. The real problem taking a dose higher than you need is that once you have filled your receptors, your body doesn't absorb any more of the bupe. Most people will hit that threshold anywhere from 4-6mg. I have seen some reports of it being at 8-10, but I believe they have since done further studies placing it in the lower range. So, taking more than the ceiling amount does absolutely nothing for you physically. All you get out of it is increased side effects (headache, nausea, sleeplessness, etc...) On top of that, taking a dose higher than necessary can negatively effect your recovery by feeding that addictive behavior.

I would suggest doing a bit of reading here, paying close attention to comments from admin1, and some of our older members. You can get a pretty good idea of what is normal from looking around and being willing to consider the thoughts presented here. Unfortunately, those of us who have been on suboxone a long time and have actually taken time to learn about it can usually tell you more truth than the doctors will. Not because they don't care, they just don't seem to want to take the time to learn more than what that 8 hour course tells them about it. :roll:

Good luck, and welcome to the forum!

Q

_________________
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent. ~ Eleanor Roosevelt


Top
 Profile  
 
Our Sponsors
 Post subject: Re: Dosage question.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 11:35 am 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2014 5:02 am
Posts: 4
Thanks so much for the quick replies.
This was the first time I had seen this Dr. and possibly he may have "assumed" I low-balled my Opiate amounts. (I didn't).
And I hope I don't offend anybody with the next statement, but the clinic is a Business, and it is a $150 a month visit, every month, as well.

As I got Zero sleep last night, I think I may have already decided to half that dosage already, and see what 4MG twice a day responds.

My follow up question.
Have I already messed up by taking so much on day one?
I never really felt "good" yesterday but it was still a lot better than my normal WD's.
But since opiates were not my only "problem" drug, I assumed some of that feeling was the Soma withdrawal as well.

Also.
Prior to all this I had been taking one Ambien 10MG to sleep.
Would it be safe to continue to do so?

Thanks again.

Logaine


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dosage question.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 11:53 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 1:02 pm
Posts: 1342
Location: West Tennessee
Hey Log,

No, you haven't done any damage at all! It's actually quite normal for a doctor to give you a bit more the first day to get you out of the acute wd's and then prescribe less for a day to day basis. Honestly, 8mg a day should be plenty for you. I'm assuming because of the soma's and the way you talked that you might be dosing for chronic pain as well? Is that right? The reason I ask is because if you're not, it's actually better to dose only once per day. The effects of bupe will last at least 24 hours if you are taking for addiction alone, and the once per day dosing will help to break the routine of taking something every time you feel like you "need" a boost. The pain releiving effects don't last as long though, so breaking your dose into 2 or 3 times per day works better for that.

Just be prepared for a few weeks to go by before you will feel normal again. Even though the bupe should cover all of your wd's, it will take a bit for the cravings to be fully controlled. It is still a big adjustment. I'm not sure about the soma wd's, I would imagine they should be tolerable and you won't notice it after a few weeks.

As for the ambien, this is something you should talk to your doctor about. I know of some doctors who will allow it, and some who won't. Personally, I don't think it is an issue as far as being dangerous as long as you are taking it as prescribed, but it's possible it will show up on your drug test and it could cause problems if your doctor doesn't know you are taking it.

Q

_________________
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent. ~ Eleanor Roosevelt


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dosage question.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 12:11 pm 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2014 5:02 am
Posts: 4
Well.
That's great to hear.
My usage did start with chronic pain and I was on the Hydro/Lortab train for about 3 years.
We did finally root out and fix what was causing the pain, but the habit was pretty ingrained by then.
And due to situations at my place of employment, in patient treatment was out of the question and may have cost me my job.

I have just cut the 8 in half and took my "dose" for the day I guess.
We will see how that works.
Last night was kind of miserable.

I think I'm going to make an appointment with my GP early next week and come clean about all of this to him. (I think he can actually prescribe it)
I know it sounds strange, but he has been my Doc for many years and I just felt kind of ashamed to have to face him about it.

I REALLY REALLY appreciate the response.
The clinic visit happened very quickly, and I am sure I should have asked more questions there.

Logaine


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dosage question.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 12:21 pm 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 1:02 pm
Posts: 1342
Location: West Tennessee
Okay, after this I'll quit posting... :lol:

I just wanted to let you know that you will definitely have to tell your GP what's going on when you go back to him. First of all, he will probably be pleased to hear that you are getting help, and it might be cheaper to see him for the subs if he can prescribe them. Secondly, he will absolutely know that you are being prescribed them. Most doctors run a check on your prescription record when they see you. Bupe is a big red flag on that record so just be honest up front. And be aware that you cannot fill a prescription for another opiate while you are in bupe treatement. It's a big deal breaker and you will probably get kicked out of the program if it happens. (not that you were going to try...I'm just letting you know up front.)

Be proud of yourself for getting help. It's a big first step, and I'm really impressed that you are already willing to hear the truth about the lower dosage. Your body will tell you when you find the right dose, it just takes a few weeks of being on a steady amount.

Q

_________________
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent. ~ Eleanor Roosevelt


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dosage question.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 2:09 pm 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2011 12:35 am
Posts: 2801
Location: Southwest
Hi Logaine,

Welcome to our forum! Everything Qhorse said is spot on. Suboxone stays in your system for a very long time so don't expect any miracles soon. The amount you have taken already would take at least 3-5 days to wear off w/o having any withdrawal symptoms. That's how strong this drug is.

Yes, IMO you were given a large amount up front. Don't blame your doctor though, he is only doing what he was trained to do. 16 mg's is considered to be a "maintenance dose". I read that somewhere, either online or inside the package.

Q's suggestion to take it only once per day is solid advice. That will solve your sleep problem. I too agree with the Ambien script. If you don't abuse it, talk to your doctor and he'll probably continue to prescribe it. It is considered a semi-benzo so there is a chance he won't. I take it with no problems at all.

You sure brought back memories with the combo of Hydrocodone and Soma. It sure makes you feel like you've had a few drinks, doesn't it? I was taking about 14-16 Norco's 10/325's per day with about 8-10 Soma's on top of that. Throw in 12-20 Ultrams and that is what I was taking back then. My doctor gave me 24 mg's and it was too much. Almost immediately I went down to 8 mg's, taken once per day at 9-10 AM. Opiates mess up your sleep cycle so that's why it is best to take it in the morning. And yes, Suboxone is an opiate, just not a full agonist. It is considered a partial agonist or partial opiate in layman's terms.

Give it some time. It takes about two weeks to stabilize. Then try to stick with one regular dose and change it only if your body tells you to. Also tell your doctor so you both are on the same page.

Welcome once more, and I hope you become a regular contributing member here.

Rule

_________________
Don't take yourself so damn seriously


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Dosage question.
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2014 7:17 pm 
Offline
Average Poster
Average Poster

Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2014 5:02 am
Posts: 4
I do appreciate the info from both of you.
It's great to be able to get "real life" info rather than the generic drugs.com wikipedia tech speak.
Yeah.
I am thinking my prob today is the Soma equation.
I have "gone dry" on both and either or before so it's kind of familiar territory.
Nothing really physical. Mostly psyche. (Anxiety, Depression) That from my experience
will pass in a few days. (And there really is no "replacement therapy" for that)

Still having some trouble getting "insurance clearance" so the drugstore is selling them to me on a "how many do you need" basis. That will resolve on Monday.
Only did 8mg today and only plan on doing 8 tomorrow.

Sleep will make things better as well.
I plan on doing more reading here and being "better informed" and a friend suggested that I keep a journal on some of this as well, so when the time comes to pay it forward I'll have a little documentation.
Every situation is unique I suppose, and every experience will be different.

Anyway. Time to go walk. (trying to do that for an hour a day as well)

Be well all.
Will keep you posted.

Thanks againe.

Logaine


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Our Sponsors
Suboxone Forum latest topics RSS feed Subscribe to the entire forum
 

 

 
Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

  • Board Certified Psychiatrist
  • Asst Clinical Professor, Medical College of Wisconsin

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group