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PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 3:33 pm 
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Hi there... I'm new here. I had to talk about my side effects bc my husband is so sick of it and thinks I'm milking it so I've stopped talking about it. But I sure am living it. I've been taking Suboxone for 4 months after becoming dependent on percocet/norco. Well I did a very, very slow taper. My doctor knew I had anxiety issues so we even tapered down to .25 (1/4 of a strip per day), which he said is more mental than physical... But I don't know if that's the case. I took .25 for a week and then stopped. Well I'm having all the restlessness, insomnia, constant back pain, frequent urination (and not a UTI, I'm talking buckets full of urine hourly when I'm hardly drinking a thing), constant sneezing, fits of depression/crying, wanting to give up and succumb to the opiates. I work a full time day job and just feel like hell. I hate going through this at work but I have no choice since I'm the sole provider in my house. For 6 years I used opiates to get through my back pain, get things done, keep my weight down. Since I started the suboxone I gained 30 pounds in 4 months! I feel like I weigh 500 pounds and like everything is just so hard to do. They say exercising gives you energy but I'm serious when I say I can't move much. Just walking up the stairs at my job makes me dizzy and so weak and tired. It's so hard and I can't even exercise, I'm just horribly f-ed and I know the only way to feel good or OK is to go back on the opiates.... But I know that's the wrong choice. I'm just wondering how long this feeling of heaviness, worthlessness, tired and restlessness will last. I can't live my life this way. If this is life off opiates then I don't think I want it. I've also been taking Wellbutrin for 4 months and I really felt like it was working... Then I realized it was the Suboxone making me feel good, not the anti-depressant. LAME. I am at a fork in the road right now.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 12:01 am 
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Im sorry :roll:

YOUR RIGHT, doctors (most) JUST don't know much about what dose of suboxone, to "jump" at.

Here at least,,,, we have lots of information, how people get down to a QUARTER of a MILIGRAM.......


So, here's the number ONE, thread on how to do that, it's a long read, but WORTH the time......
http://suboxforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=296


Im not sure how long it's been since your LAST dose, and I don't know you may be more than HALF way thru the battle
ALREADY,,,,,
but if you start feeling worse, OR just can't take it ANY LONGER,,,,, tapering a bit longer, to a much lower dose,
could be an OPTION......
it's really YOUR CHOICE......


while Im thinking about it, here's ANOTHER good thread, with GREAT WAYS to get to a really low, but consistent dose::::
http://suboxforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=7449

of all the stories I've read here, and all the people I've talked to,
You definitely are experiencing withdrawls, its NOT JUST IN YOUR HEAD!!!!
im sooo very sorry,
that your doctor thinks so.........

Lastly, Im going to post the video by Dr. Junig, about "stopping suboxone the right way"
He also has 18 other videos on youtube,
MOST have to do with tapering, withdrawls, ETC.....
here's the link to his "channel" on youtube

http://www.youtube.com/user/SuboxDoc

[marq=right]*******BEST OF LUCK*******[/marq]
with WHATEVER you decide to do,,,,,
stick it "out" or go back on for a bit, and taper more......
Either way,,,
you'll find support here,,
and if you need ANY more information, don't hesitate to ask :wink:

One more thing, there are LOTS of taper stories, in the "stopping suboxone" section, and "bupe in the rear view"
just click on one of those titles, and scroll down the thread titles.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2CQ94aXDoQ&feature=plcp[/youtube]

_________________
anyone can give up,
its the easiest thing in the world to do, but to
hold it together, when everyone would understand if you fell apart
That's TRUE STRENGTH
http://almostoneyearclean.blogspot.com/


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 1:06 am 
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Hey Ambernicole..I noticed something in your post that may help explain what's going on with you:
You wrote that you did a long, slow taper, taking .25 for the last week you were on. But then you wrote something about 1/4 of a strip. So...were you down to 0.25mg per day or were you on a quarter of a strip? And if a quarter strip, were they 8mg or 2 mg strips? The difference is HUGE...the lowest you could've been on if you're talking strips would be the 2s & at 1/4 strip, you'd still have been on 0.5mg per day.
Also, one week at your lowest dose & 4 months total time on bupe isn't all that long.
It's no surprise you're having a hard time. Withdrawals suck...even most bupe w/d sucks! Sorry youre not getting much sympathy...you have mine.
Just wanted to point out those things in case it could help you. Maybe you can post more later. In any case, it will get better. It's just very dependent upon how much you had really tapered.
Hope this helps.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 1:30 am 
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Hi Ambernicole, how many days have you been withdrawing? When I jumped from a dose at about .5 mg, I had the same symptoms that you are having. Especially having a hard time climbing stairs. That is wonderful that you are able to at least go to work! That is huge. You are very strong and I am sure that since you have already gone to work once, you will be able to do it again. For me, my worse day was Day 2 and Day three was slightly better and Day 4 was slightly better and Day 5-6 the physical symptoms had greatly reduced. Day 6 it was over and then the mental stuff started for me. The anxiety. But I feel that if I would have toughed it out longer it would have went away. It was stupid, the very first time my brain said "Hey... you know what? You haven't had suboxone in 6 days. There's no way you're going to be able to function. You need suboxone to live or else you're worthless and won't be able to do anything and will live a boring empty life," I slipped up. I just know that if I would have toughed it out I would have been fine in a matter of days. So hang in there, your physical symptoms will be over soon.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 2:46 am 
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Hello and thank you for your replies. To answer questions I last took a quarter of a 2mg dose which you're right would be .5 mg. could I have even gone lower than that? My group of docs usually don't go lower than 1mg at the end of my taper but did it for me because my main doc (thru Kaiser Permanente) seriously loves me and wants me to be ok. He also knows I don't want to be addicted to the suboxone so he stands behind my decision to taper and follow doctors orders. So I took my last quarter on Friday 11/24. Saturday was an emotional wreck. My dad died 2 months ago and I never really cried till then but it was just intensified by the fear of withdrawal, losing my opiate crutch, and losing my dad who was my safety net. Sunday sucked too, my body was just crawling and I was so weak. I couldn't take care of my 2 kids or shower or move really. My husband took Care of the fam but I know he's fed up due to dealing with the slow w/d symptoms for a while now. (an example, I'm 24 and have sex w him once every 4-6 weeks and sleep separately due to this whole ordeal). I knew I had work Monday and that's when I had the back pain. I was taking so much over the counter pain meds that didn't help, I swear I was getting sick from overdosing. The last 2 weeks I've had these clonodine patches on to help with "mild w/d". The first one stayed on a week, then on Thanksgiving I changed it and the new one fell off after 4 hours. My husband duct taped it around my forearm because it was the holiday and my doc didn't prescribe a spare. That's all he gave me for these symptoms so I scoured my cabinet and found 5 low dose Valium from when I was in rehab and I took 1 each night to go to sleep. I was doubling up my espresso and Wellbutrin each day hoping for a boost. As for work, I didn't take any days off. I could've but I've taken days off in the past for so many medical things and I'm sick of being that way. Plus I'm out of sick/vacation hours so I wouldn't get paid. I'm going to stick to this because I feel ok right now. After work I had this surge of energy and wanted to have some fun with my son, so I went to pick him up from daycare and that winded me and put things back into prospective. That sucked. So I came home instead and learned a song on the guitar. "Folsom Prison Blues". Fitting, eh?


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 2:48 am 
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invisiblemovement wrote:
Hi Ambernicole, how many days have you been withdrawing? When I jumped from a dose at about .5 mg, I had the same symptoms that you are having. Especially having a hard time climbing stairs. That is wonderful that you are able to at least go to work! That is huge. You are very strong and I am sure that since you have already gone to work once, you will be able to do it again. For me, my worse day was Day 2 and Day three was slightly better and Day 4 was slightly better and Day 5-6 the physical symptoms had greatly reduced. Day 6 it was over and then the mental stuff started for me. The anxiety. But I feel that if I would have toughed it out longer it would have went away. It was stupid, the very first time my brain said "Hey... you know what? You haven't had suboxone in 6 days. There's no way you're going to be able to function. You need suboxone to live or else you're worthless and won't be able to do anything and will live a boring empty life," I slipped up. I just know that if I would have toughed it out I would have been fine in a matter of days. So hang in there, your physical symptoms will be over soon.



Thanks so much. How did u slip up? After 5 days of this crap I'd be scared to go back because then I'd have to go through it again


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 2:54 am 
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And the insomnia begins. I fell asleep at 8pm and now I'm wide awake a restless. I can't get comfortable. Time to drug myself. I hate downers and being "stoned". I wish if I were to have insomnia that I'd at least be feeling good and high. Benadryl and Valium=sleep these days. I feel like taking up drinking or something. I just can't feel normal yet and I hate it.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 3:47 am 
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I recommend going to Wal-Mart or a pharmacy and getting Valerian Root. Well, I suppose that going to be at 8, it makes sense that you are awake now. Many people only sleep a few hours during withdraw. But a suggestion to prepare for tomorrow would be to get the valerian root and take 3 of them. You can get Melatonin too and combine them if you want but I find valerian root more successful. It is nice because if you wake up in the middle of the night it makes it easy to fall back asleep. It is OK that you are up right now, because you will be extra tired for tomorrow night and get a good night sleep. Just remember, you just have to make it 1 day. 1 day, that's it! In one day, your physical symptoms are surely going to be even less and you will have a better chance at a good night's sleep tomorrow night. Also, I would always take some naproxen right before bedtime to help my muscles relax and eat a lot of food because that somehow would make me sleepy. Don't worry, you are on the path to normal. That is the good news. You have no where to go but up.

I slipped up because my best friend got the best china he ever had in his whole life and it was my first day going back to work, it was day 4, I felt like crap and had anxiety, and he lives only 1 block from my work and it was going to be free and so I slipped up. The second time I jumped, I was going back to work on day 6 and was super backed up with schoolwork and had anxiety so I took some subutex. The first time I ever jumped, a year and a half ago, I had only been on subs a few weeks and I stopped for a week or so and then I got an ear infection and it was excrutiating pain and the doctor gave me Vicodin. Yeah I know, crazy. Vicodin for an ear infection. Lol. Of course that didn't take care of the pain so I bought some OCs and the rest is history. I could have accomplished so much more in the last year if I would not have slipped up that one time. I wish I would just wait at least 2 weeks because I am confident that after 2 weeks you should be feeling so proud and have more energy than when you were taking these opiate depressants, therefore accomplishing more, and feeling proud of what you are accomplishing.

Tonight might have been bad for you, but it will be over as soon as you know it and things will be back on track.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 10:24 am 
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Thanks for clearing up what your Ending dose was. Half a milligram isn't bad, but believe it or not, people taper to 1/16 even 1/32 of a milligram!
I also think it matters how long and how much Sub you took throughout treatment. For instance, it's likely to be a good bit easier for someone who abused pills for a year or two, then took Sub for 6-12 months tapering to where the final month or so was spent tapering into tiny doses. Compare that scenario to someone who'd been mainlining huge amounts of oxy or heroin or dilaudid for many years, then spent 3 more years on 16mg of Sub, tapered for a few weeks then jumped off 2mg.
The 2nd scenario is almost always going to have a rougher withdrawal than the first. I guess what I'm saying is that the issue of withdrawal is very dependent upon a number of things....All the above, plus personal issues like general health & fitness, metabolism, pain tolerance or lack thereof, plus any underlying anxiety/depression, pain issues, etc.
The other big deal is attitude & willingness. Those with more positive attitudes and willingness to push themselves to do things they don't feel like doing, seem to do the best.
It sounds like you're kicking butt, actually! You've been working, taking care of your child, pushing yourself & that's great. Also know that for a lot of people Sub wd comes in waves....you'll feel pretty good, like you're really doing better, then a wave of symptoms crash over again. Just keep picking yourself back up. You can do this. Whatever you do, don't succumb to the lie of your former doc. If you are for sure not gonna make it, consider getting just a few more strips and take the tiniest piece
you can imagine as less often as you can for a few more weeks, then jump again.

Good luck! You're doing great! I believe you can stay the course & get this behind you for good!


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 11:57 am 
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Barelyboxed wrote:
Thanks for clearing up what your Ending dose was. Half a milligram isn't bad, but believe it or not, people taper to 1/16 even 1/32 of a milligram!
I also think it matters how long and how much Sub you took throughout treatment. For instance, it's likely to be a good bit easier for someone who abused pills for a year or two, then took Sub for 6-12 months tapering to where the final month or so was spent tapering into tiny doses. Compare that scenario to someone who'd been mainlining huge amounts of oxy or heroin or dilaudid for many years, then spent 3 more years on 16mg of Sub, tapered for a few weeks then jumped off 2mg.
The 2nd scenario is almost always going to have a rougher withdrawal than the first. I guess what I'm saying is that the issue of withdrawal is very dependent upon a number of things....All the above, plus personal issues like general health & fitness, metabolism, pain tolerance or lack thereof, plus any underlying anxiety/depression, pain issues, etc.
The other big deal is attitude & willingness. Those with more positive attitudes and willingness to push themselves to do things they don't feel like doing, seem to do the best.
It sounds like you're kicking butt, actually! You've been working, taking care of your child, pushing yourself & that's great. Also know that for a lot of people Sub wd comes in waves....you'll feel pretty good, like you're really doing better, then a wave of symptoms crash over again. Just keep picking yourself back up. You can do this. Whatever you do, don't succumb to the lie of your former doc. If you are for sure not gonna make it, consider getting just a few more strips and take the tiniest piece
you can imagine as less often as you can for a few more weeks, then jump again.

Good luck! You're doing great! I believe you can stay the course & get this behind you for good!


Gosh, thanks so much for the encouragement. I guess I am doing alright, huh? I think about the people who go to sober living places or long term rehab for months and all they have to do is go to meetings and make their bed, and rest. I wish I had that luxury but I knew this series of days had to come in order for me to become a teacher. I had 2 herniated discs when I was 18, I was very heavy and was in a car accident. Well this resulted in excruciating sciatic leg pain that hospitalized me for sometimes 4 days at a time. It was worse than child birth and I'd wake up screaming and was ready to blow my head off from the pain, all the while with a 10 month old to care for. I found a great back specialist after seeing 8 doctors, and this specialist prescribed me 180 10mg percocet a month, and 60 40mg OxyContin. I never tried any drugs before in my life... But they were the only thing that helped. I remember lying on the floor in pain with my hand hanging out my back door trying to smoke a cigarette, feeling like death, and then the pain relief kicked in and I finally had hope. So the meds helped me lose 80 pounds and my back pain went away. By that time I was already hooked. I wasn't getting early refills or anything bc she gave me well enough to last. It went on like that for 2 years and then Kaiser stopped dishing out OxyContin to their patients unless they were on hospice or had really bad cancer. So she cut my Oxys and left me with the percocet. That was hard but I continued on with my dependency. Eventually she cut my Percs down to 90 a month and I started running out early. I found people on the streets who sold me oxy, told me to try snorting it, and I also bought norco. I was just so out of control. I needed the drugs in order to function at not only work and school, but life. I didn't let a day go by where I didn't have pills, and lots of them. I planned ahead, I was crafty and my addiction came before anything else, I would've killed myself had I gone a day without... well so I thought. There was even a time I tried ecstacy and speed to substitute what I didn't have. That was short-lived though because speed made me crazy and I didn't like it. I didn't have any therapy or depression meds, and I was constantly self-medicating all this hurt, anger, and pain I had as a kid and still in adulthood. The INSANITY of it all is that I went on using like this and the only person who knew was my spouse. My facade was so professional, intellectual and high class, but secretly I was a damn junkie! Doing drugs in the bathroom almost everywhere, but walking out in business suit and heels. This went on for 6 years, from 18-24. When I went to rehab I was taking 20-24 pills a day (some days all percs, some all norco, some both) and VERY close to trying heroin. I was at a fork, I could've gone with my dealer and shoot up for the first time or I could walk to the chemical dependency building and surrender myself to them. Just prior to doing so, I got caught by a pharmacy for doctor hopping and my heart sank bc I have no criminal record and am working on my credentials to teach. They didn't get me in trouble of anything but it sure scared the hell out of me. I walked my arse straight into rehab and found God. God and reading. Something changed in me and I was just sick of the internal struggle, the constant worry, constantly blowing all my money (tons and tons of money). What I still struggle with is the fact that I attribute all my success in my career, education, family, friends.... all to pills. On pills I felt like supermom, like I could do anything. Of course I'd wake up each morning feeling like a bus hit me, but once I dosed I was alert and never in pain. I looked and felt great. I was suppressing the evil in the act of what I was doing. It was like the elephant in the room that my husband and I didn't talk about. So based off your comments, I'm hoping it is true what you say, that in time I will have more energy and feel better than I ever have. I already have plans for diet and exercise. I'm just waiting for that normalcy to come. I didn't have thoughts of relapse this whole time until Monday and Tuesday when I thought how easy it would be to feel better. I was thinking F- suboxone, I want the real thing. But I didn't do it. Still holdin on by a thread and the grace of God who put me here to teach and inspire children, not abuse opiates. What a waste of a brilliant mind my mentor told me.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 12:28 pm 
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Wow ambernicole, you have been through a lot. But the important thing is that you never made your drug habit a drug "crisis". You haven't lost your head through this whole thing. You're smart. You're good at analyzing the situation and realizing what's going on. I do the same thing, I attribute my success to opiates, and now suboxone. I received an award last year, and all I could think of was, "Hehe yeah it's cuz i could slave away all night cuz I was high!! muahaha my secret weapon". But I still try to believe that it wasn't the secret weapon, it was me. And you're not a waste of a brilliant mind. You're still you. Opiates are very very easy to get addicted to. It's like how 2 + 2 always equals 4. If you pump a bunch of pain pills into a human body, it gets dependent on them. What's to remember is the way you got into this whole mess. You were prescribed pain pills. You aren't a bad person inside. (And even those of us including myself that weren't prescribed them first, I'm not saying we're bad people but in comparison, I just find less guilt associated with people that started off prescribed, but in the end yeah we've all made mistakes). The fact that you were prescribed all those pills is really justifying your dependency on pain pills, so don't feel bad over it. You are a great person and you will be a great teacher. It's our educators that really make this country go around, and it's wonderful that you want to be one, giving the foundation for future generations. It's absolutely wonderful that you didn't succumb to your cravings the last couple days, and I give you a lot of respect. I hope today at work is even easier than yesterday.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 1:30 pm 
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invisiblemovement wrote:
Wow ambernicole, you have been through a lot. But the important thing is that you never made your drug habit a drug "crisis". You haven't lost your head through this whole thing. You're smart. You're good at analyzing the situation and realizing what's going on. I do the same thing, I attribute my success to opiates, and now suboxone. I received an award last year, and all I could think of was, "Hehe yeah it's cuz i could slave away all night cuz I was high!! muahaha my secret weapon". But I still try to believe that it wasn't the secret weapon, it was me. And you're not a waste of a brilliant mind. You're still you. Opiates are very very easy to get addicted to. It's like how 2 + 2 always equals 4. If you pump a bunch of pain pills into a human body, it gets dependent on them. What's to remember is the way you got into this whole mess. You were prescribed pain pills. You aren't a bad person inside. (And even those of us including myself that weren't prescribed them first, I'm not saying we're bad people but in comparison, I just find less guilt associated with people that started off prescribed, but in the end yeah we've all made mistakes). The fact that you were prescribed all those pills is really justifying your dependency on pain pills, so don't feel bad over it. You are a great person and you will be a great teacher. It's our educators that really make this country go around, and it's wonderful that you want to be one, giving the foundation for future generations. It's absolutely wonderful that you didn't succumb to your cravings the last couple days, and I give you a lot of respect. I hope today at work is even easier than yesterday.


I've received more support and therapeutic advice through this forum than I have in my intensive group therapy sessions. I swear, it really helps to talk to people who know exactly what I'm going through. Thank you for reminding me that addiction is a disease. Now I know I have an addictive personality and can look out for signs of any type of dependency. I just want to share that I think I am doing significantly better today (Day 5 without Suboxone). Remember how I was an emotional wreck and so weak and heavy? Well all that urination made me drop 3 lbs of water weight! WTH? And today I woke up groggy from the valium/benadryl I took the night before, but once I got my coffee in me... Wow what a freakin change. I'm at work right now and I'm able to work, and focus, no pain, no distractions. My leg keeps shaking nervously but other than that I think I made it through! I hope people who are in day 3-4 read this and know that there is light at the end of the tunnel. I just took my 15 minute break and power walked a huge 3/4 mile lap in the fresh morning air. I am losing the urge to smoke on my breaks and I feel so proud of myself and happy. (Hopefully I'm not being manic right now). I was able to get my heart rate going and I leaped up those stairs like I was 16 again. You guys were right. I hope this good feeling lasts because I need to keep the momentum going in order to get my weight down and be healthy again (and be a good example for my kids). I am tingling with happiness and I have no drugs in me. Who would've thought? Those in withdrawal are probably reading this all pissed off and annoyed, sick of hearing the success stories... Well YOU can be a success story no matter what your situation is. Take a week for yourself and be strong and you will be whole again. I don't want to jump the gun and say I'm back to normal, but if this is life from now on, I'm fine with that. Grace be to God. All things are possible through faith... and Suboxone... hehe jk


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 1:33 pm 
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Ditto what invisible said! I agree with the idea that there's a bit less guilt and shame to carry on yourself, as you're one of those who sort of fell into dependency & addiction with legit scripts. Nonetheless, most of wind up in the same spot...resorting to immoral, if not illegal means to obtain more when our scripts inevitably run out early or altogether. It's hard, but we have to stop the self-battering we tend to do, if we want to get past it.
So you're doing good. The cravings, for me, are the absolute worst, so work on techniques to face them down and know they will pass. Stay strong and continue on your journey with your faith and your readings. I personally believe that without addressing the spiritual side of our lives, we will have an even harder time making it through.


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Barelyboxed wrote:
Ditto what invisible said! I agree with the idea that there's a bit less guilt and shame to carry on yourself, as you're one of those who sort of fell into dependency & addiction with legit scripts. Nonetheless, most of wind up in the same spot...resorting to immoral, if not illegal means to obtain more when our scripts inevitably run out early or altogether. It's hard, but we have to stop the self-battering we tend to do, if we want to get past it.
So you're doing good. The cravings, for me, are the absolute worst, so work on techniques to face them down and know they will pass. Stay strong and continue on your journey with your faith and your readings. I personally believe that without addressing the spiritual side of our lives, we will have an even harder time making it through.


Thank you for taking the time to leave a note. All the support is helping me very much. I always knew God had a calling for me and gave me evangelistic traits but I turned my back on them for a while. I cried out to him in despair and just kept putting all my worries, all my pain, all my frustration and hopelessness to him, even though my relationship wasn't very strong. I completely surrendered and asked him for help every step of the way. He didn't give me a sign and illuminate my bedroom or anything, but he gave me strength whereas before I was weak and frayed, walking the line of faith (one foot in, one foot out). Doctors have told me a spiritual awakening will help one through rehabilitation. I guess one has to decide for themselves. There are some mental and physical things we just can't control as humans, and we have to just let them go. Give them to a higher power. Give up and surrender. I REALLY hope I'm not being manic right now. My mother was a disgusting manic throughout my childhood who would fly high as a kite and think she was the next Messiah and God was speaking through her pores. Then she would have fits of bedridden depression for days. She was arrested at our church for attempting to run over the pastor and then pepper sprayed immensely and eventually hospitalized for a looong time. I've never been really assessed and diagnosed properly bc at my assessments I've always been high as a kite but able to speak of depression... Thus the depression meds. So I sincerely hope that I'm not bi-polar. Bc that would really throw a wrench in the gears.

I know it's very hard with cravings, and I'll probably face them in the future. But I was told addiction is a lifelong disease and we will always be addicts and always have cravings. We must build up our strength and confidence and we can do it.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:09 pm 
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Day 5 and you're feelin' alive! That's great! I can't believe you powerwalked 3/4 of a mile. I know that when I have jumped it makes me so weak to be at work, but to actual exercise rather than rest on your break? That's amazing! I am glad that the worst is over for you. That's hillarious that you feel like a 16-year-old leaping up stairs, lol. And on day 5! Maybe you already know this, but I read that suboxone can retain your urine (and number 2). When I upped my dose I realized when I went to the bathroom not much would come out, too. So I suppose that could explain your longer bathroom trips. I am really glad that you are awake today and that you waking up in the middle of the night didn't affect you, you don't even sound grumpy at all. I know of many people (including myself) that have had a lot of energy and happiness after they have been a few days into their withdraws, and I would not worry about being manic. I think it is more of a rush of knowing that you really did it, you are really doing it, and it's like winning a baseball game, you feel like you have beat that sub, and you are feeling proud. I like how you share your thoughts on God because I also believe faith can play a huge hand in successfully beating addiction, and I have not had much time with God lately, so it is nice to be reminded of his strength. It's great to hear that you are doing good, and I wish you the best. A user Romeo just said this in another thread recently, that sometimes withdraws will come with waves of emotions, where suddenly you will feel on top of the world and then the next day can have a bad day again, and I just wanted to warn you that if you happen to feel a little down in the next week, don't get discouraged. It is temporary and don't worry about any sort of manic or depressive mood swings, because it is very normal and your moods will soon even out. Good job on being tough. smart, and positive!


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:25 pm 
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invisiblemovement wrote:
Day 5 and you're feelin' alive! That's great! I can't believe you powerwalked 3/4 of a mile. I know that when I have jumped it makes me so weak to be at work, but to actual exercise rather than rest on your break? That's amazing! I am glad that the worst is over for you. That's hillarious that you feel like a 16-year-old leaping up stairs, lol. And on day 5! Maybe you already know this, but I read that suboxone can retain your urine (and number 2). When I upped my dose I realized when I went to the bathroom not much would come out, too. So I suppose that could explain your longer bathroom trips. I am really glad that you are awake today and that you waking up in the middle of the night didn't affect you, you don't even sound grumpy at all. I know of many people (including myself) that have had a lot of energy and happiness after they have been a few days into their withdraws, and I would not worry about being manic. I think it is more of a rush of knowing that you really did it, you are really doing it, and it's like winning a baseball game, you feel like you have beat that sub, and you are feeling proud. I like how you share your thoughts on God because I also believe faith can play a huge hand in successfully beating addiction, and I have not had much time with God lately, so it is nice to be reminded of his strength. It's great to hear that you are doing good, and I wish you the best. A user Romeo just said this in another thread recently, that sometimes withdraws will come with waves of emotions, where suddenly you will feel on top of the world and then the next day can have a bad day again, and I just wanted to warn you that if you happen to feel a little down in the next week, don't get discouraged. It is temporary and don't worry about any sort of manic or depressive mood swings, because it is very normal and your moods will soon even out. Good job on being tough. smart, and positive!


Hey thanks again for the kind words. I really hope the mood swings aren't too severe... I'm hoping they get less dramatic as time passes on. I really don't want to face another day of feeling physical withdrawals but I could handle the emotional as my body held up on me. I didn't know about Suboxone retaining urine... That totally makes sense why I going like crazy. It was the weirdest thing ever... like buckets... Thanks for that fact.

It really does feel like winning a baseball game, doesn't it? I would've never thought I could've made it this far. 6 months ago I would've rather died then go through detox. I thought it would be SO MUCH WORSE. There's strength inside of us that we don't know we possess because the opiates just take over.

I know people speak of cravings and stuff and I hope it's not insensitive to say, but I really haven't had any cravings through this process. I think the logical part of me just decided, hey you're not doing that crap anymore, and knows that cravings could result in doing this treatment for nothing. When the memories of the drug enter my mind (I don't consider them cravings bc they are negative), I just kinda squint mentally and push it out of my head and think of something else. Eventually those thoughts stopped coming. I REALLY hope it stays that way. I hope I'm done with pills for good.

Now you mentioned you needed narcs for pain after you jumped. I'm wondering what I should do when faced with that scenario in the years to come. Do I take the prescription if I REALLY need it or do I absolutely not under any circumstance accept it? I think, "What if my pain returns, what will I do?" I know I should cross that road when I get to it, but I can't help but think that would be the only reason to break my sobriety.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:36 pm 
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A baseball game..? For me, it felt more like winning a war on an old school battle field.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 5:12 pm 
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tinydancer wrote:
A baseball game..? For me, it felt more like winning a war on an old school battle field.


LOL! Touche, my friend, touche. You have to keep in mind that baseball (well girls fast pitch softball) was the only thing I was passionate about when growing up. I truly loved to play, train, coach and those are the only happy times I remember growing up where I would shine. SO let me be more precise...

It feels like it's the all stars, and the last game of the championship, 0-0 and you're in the 9th inning (keep in mind softball only has 7) and you're up to bat, with 2 outs, bases loaded. The count is 4-2 and you keep fowling down the left field line, you're swinging late but you're catching on. You hear the "hey batter batter", squeeze your bat and cock it back. The pitcher throws a change-up right in your sweet spot, you watch the ball come in as if time had stopped, you take your step and watch the ball connect with the bat as you pivot your hind foot, then time resumes. You follow through with your swing and watch the ball in the bright night-time lights take an upward, soaring line drive so fast over the center-left outfield fence. You run like hell, and once you make it around first you jump with happiness as the other team throws their gloves down in disappointment. You don't bat #4 cleanup in the all stars for nothin. You watch the 3 runners ahead of you trot into home plate, and then your team runs to you and pats and hugs you. You see your dad in the stands; he's got a huge smile on his face, he's saying "that's my girl!", and has thrown his ball cap into the air.

YEAH that type of feeling... If you're a real ball-player... Life doesn't get much better than that. The glory days, where I was young and innocent and the only battle I faced was me with a bat against a pitcher. Maybe now that I'm drug free I can get back to some place like that through coaching. Either way... I'M FREE FINALLY. I can travel and not worry about if I have enough pills to do this or that... Completely free and it feels good. I hope you all can feel the same.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 5:51 pm 
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Haha! Sounds about right..


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 5:58 pm 
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ambernicole00 wrote:
I REALLY hope I'm not being manic right now. My mother was a disgusting manic throughout my childhood who would fly high as a kite and think she was the next Messiah and God was speaking through her pores. Then she would have fits of bedridden depression for days. She was arrested at our church for attempting to run over the pastor and then pepper sprayed immensely and eventually hospitalized for a looong time. I've never been really assessed and diagnosed properly bc at my assessments I've always been high as a kite but able to speak of depression... Thus the depression meds. So I sincerely hope that I'm not bi-polar. Bc that would really throw a wrench in the gears.

I know it's very hard with cravings, and I'll probably face them in the future. But I was told addiction is a lifelong disease and we will always be addicts and always have cravings. We must build up our strength and confidence and we can do it.


#1 - Everyone is manic during this time of withdrawal. You're on an emotional roller coaster right now. I am as even as they come, always have been and still am for the most part.. but during the first few months of coming off sub, I was totally manic. I sentimental commercial would make me cry. I lame joke would getting me laughing uncontrollably.. I didn't get angry much though. Mostly really happy and emotional. It slowly dies down..

#2 - I was convinced my cravings were gone while I was on sub and even the first couple months after detox. I had some slowly return but I'm at a stable place to deal with them now. I think the length of PAWS will get to some people. After a while, you just want to feel normal.. you know?

The good news is that you were not on sub very long and I'm hoping you "heal" quicker than I did.


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