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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:20 am 
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This is my first post ever.....i staggered onto this site yesterday after work. I've been on subs for 9 months... tapering down till 4mgs in the mid morning with no real issues. In that time i quit smoking cigarettes 62 days ago & quit smoking highly potent marijuana on a frequent basis almost a month ago.

6 days ago i decided to go down to 2mgs daily. I was fine the first few 2-3 days and was highly overconfident. The past few nights i have gotten little sleep & repeatedly wake up covered in sweat. No other taper level elicited a response from my body similar to this.

Yesterday i woke up a little before 4am and couldn't take tossing & turning anymore so i got up and showered. After studying a little, shaving & getting ready for work, i realized it was 6 am and i was ready to leave for the office, although i didn't need to be there till 7:30 AM.

Frustrated i simply went into work to get an early start. Towards the end of my work day, i was talking to one of the partners about questions i had regarding the client i was working on. We somehow got on the discussion of not sleeping well, and the Partner remarked "Usually i just take 1 of my wife's Vicodin when i can't sleep." I emotionally shut down upon hearing this & like a robot swung around in my chair back to the computer screen & continued to ask only pertinent questions about the client. I pushed all my emotions down into the hole in my stomach until i got home.

I got in the shower as soon as i got home and cried for a 1/2 hour. I have overcome so much in the last few months with little struggle and then this. I had realized my fight was just starting. In the past week i haven't been able to study much. I have gone from the top student in my CPA review class to barely being able to study a few pages a day. I am supposed to sit for my first section in 5 weeks, and i am no longer confident in how well i will do. I'm already this far into this level of taper... no way in hell im going back up! Stumbling onto this site has definitely reinforced that! I am in awe and so proud of those who have tapered to such a low level, and have been humbled by knowing i still have so far to go.

I can't seem to find accurate information on what mg level is the ceiling & did i just crash through?

Thanks to all & keep up the good fight!


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:38 am 
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Greetings & welcome, Congrats on quitting cigs & MJ. Not easy I know.
If I am understanding you correctly, you went from 4mg directly down to 2mg. That is a 50% reduction. (obviously) You are experiencing withdrawl. (again obviously) It is advised when tapering to reduce your daily no more than 25% every couple weeks or as tolerated. I have been tapering from 4 mg. for 6 months. I am curently at .0625. I have made small drops and stabelized after 2-4 weeks at each drop. I guess what I am telling you is that in order to have a less painful taper you MUST take baby steps. Now there are so amny people on this forum that are going to reply to your post and I know they will give you more info than I have. Being emotional, crying is for sure one of the most comon symptoms of tapering. Gosh I feel for ya. Sounds like you may want to read thru more of this forum specifically the "stopping suboxone" section for some really great advise and info. I understand you not wanting to increase your dose, just be aware that you will more than likely endure some rough days... I wish you luck and hopefully you can find a way to manage your taper in a way that suits your needs...


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:57 am 
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As HAtmaker said in a recent post, try alternating 4 mg one day then 2mg the next. You will average 3mg which is only a 25% drop. When you get below 2mg, you should slow that to 10% or so. I know that sounds like it will take forever, but listen to your body. Also, 4mg is the ceiling for Bupe. When you go below that, your receptors are not totally saturated, so you will have some screaming for dope. Alternating days, or splitting your dose into twice daily might help even you out. I know it has helped me a ton. I am stubborn and have no patience, so I have done a very fast taper. I was on .075 a week ago and now am shooting to be at .025 today. But I have no doctor anymore so I have cause.
Honestly try the every other day and dosing twice a day (I know some say this perpetuates the addict mentality but it really helped me) and see if you can level out. Give it a month and your body WILL adapt. Good luck!


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:58 pm 
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you should actually be very proud of yourself for what you have accomplished! dont be so hard on yourself. i have been on 16 mgs for 2.5 years and having a huge problem dropping at all. i see people here going from 16 to 12 to 8 to 6 and so on with little problem. i just dont get it.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:39 pm 
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If I were you man, I'd go back up to 4mg and sit on that for a month or two. IMO you've been going way too fast, and taking on too much. You've quit smoking, quit weed. Those two things ALONE can make recovery from opioid dependence a lot harder.

To a certain degree, our addictive brain cannot and doesn't care what drug it's taking. Most addiction is linked to dopamine in some way. So when we quit smoking, there's a "hole" there our addictive brain wants to fill, and to a degree it doesn't care what it gets filled with. I remember quitting smoking once, and within a couple of weeks I was using heroin.

It looks to me like you're rushing your recovery at the moment, and you gotta sit tight for a bit to consolidate the progress you've done so far. IMO after every dose reduction, a person SHOULD sit on that level for a little while until they are certain they're able to handle the increased cravings on that level.

Rushing my recovery has brought me undone many times in the past, so much so that I believe often it can be our ADDICTION that pushes us to do this, as some way to self sabotage.

IMO bring it back a bit, make sure you can sustain yourself on 4mg of Sub as a non-smoker (of all kinds), then consider a slow reduction. IE 4mg -> 3mg. And if you find that too hard, go back to 4mg then try 3.5mg.

With the tapering gig, it's better to be patient than to be relapsed. And it sounds to me like you're getting too close for comfort. And when that happens, bumping up the dose a bit is a MUST.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 11:47 am 
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Thanks for some great info folks! It's great to hear the viewpoints of others..... no sense for me to try & reinvent the wheel. Today is day 7 at 2mg & I slept 7 hours last night w/out any sweats. Still haven't taken today's dose yet but it's getting to be about that time of the day. Don't have to be at the office till Tuesday, so i think im just gonna ride this out. Will def let my body/brain fully adjust to this level before dropping again. Keeping busy seems to be important, distracting, & productive. Just got home from a charity pancake breakfast my firm put together. I keep telling myself that if i can pretend to be normal long enough, i'll wake up in a few years and will be. I'm off to see how much studying i can do.

To Sweet & NoMore.... so you guys are down to 0.0XX levels daily and im at 2.0 levels daily?

TearJ3rker, you are right about the brain wanting a replacement, the only thing that iv found to replace cigs is running & golf. Totally agree about our addictions pushing ourselves too fast & setting ourselves up for failure. It's the monkey on the back tricking us to getting back with/in snorting range again ;). I've cut myself off from all my old friends, run or hit golf balls if i do get bored, or study when I'm not working. It's worked this far... so i just gotta keep pushing!

Thanks to all & keep up the good fight!


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 6:53 pm 
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Yep, I was at .05mg, then .0375 for a day and now I am on mysecond day after jumping. Check out the Tale of two Quitters for my story and Sweet 16's. Even a jump from here is not great. No tbad during the day just crap for sleep. I am sure that will pass in a few days though.
THe main think is to listen to YOUR body. everyone is different. There are no points for putting yourself through pain. I wish you the very best and keep us posted.


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