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PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2016 5:44 am 
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Hi guys,

Sorry it's been so long since i posted.

I stuck to 4mgs, it was not that bad but a little bit emotional, I suppose we go through all the emotions that we have been suppressing.

The last week I've been a little depressed but happy to see that a few people have commented here.

I think maybe i need to talk to my doctor about going back onto antidepressants again. But that's ok.

Thanks for your comments :)


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 5:26 am 
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I'm feeling much less depressed now, think it takes a few weeks to a month for the emotional side of decreasing to subside. I'm seeing my doctor in a few weeks and I'm going to ask him what he thinks about me decreasing to 2 mgs - it will be half the dose i take now so i think it will be fairly uncomfortable for a while. I'll see what the doc thinks, see how I'm feeling and take it from there. I definitely don't want to relapse or go backwards in any way! I'm feeling more confident - maybe because i had a good session with my psychologist, but mostly because I'm awesome! Ha ha! Jokes aside, 4mgs is doing the job and I'm going really well. :)


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 7:37 am 
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Hi manz,
I just read your posts.
In March I was at 10-12mg. day. Now I'm at 1.75mg/day for the past 3 days.
I'm tapering by dropping about 20 -25% mg. every 2-3 weeks.
I had some bouts of depression & lack of motivation when I went from 3mg./day to 2.5... but that's about it.
I'll stay at 1.75 for a 2-3 weeks, then to 1.5 mg./day for 2-3 weeks.
FWIW... THIS taper schedule has been working the best for me!
I plan on jumping when I've completed 1/8 mg./day for 2-3 weeks (though I might go every other day after that?)
No w/d's (yet) and only some depression & lack of motivation at the 3mg.- 2.5mg./day mark!
I split my dose at 7am (1.25 mg.) & noon (.5mg.).
This keeps me motivated throughout the day.
Good luck!
jonny
8-)


Last edited by jonny62 on Sat Jul 23, 2016 8:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 4:57 pm 
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Hi jonny, thanks for your comment.
So I've been stable on 4mgs for a little while now. Before I was on suboxone, I took antidepressants, so i am thinking that once I decrease a bit more that i should maybe go back onto the anti d's. This may be the reason I get so emotional when I taper.
The problem with splitting my dose is that i won't be able to do that consistently because 2 times a week i need to take my entire dose for the day in front of a pharmacist. So that would disrupt the flow.
Do you cut your dose with scissors?
I'm seeing my doc next week so I'll ask him his advice.
Ideally i would like to be off suboxone by end of year - that means i will have had a solid 2 years and a half on them.
I'll keep checking here and writing about how I'm going.
Manz :)


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 20, 2016 6:15 pm 
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manz wrote:
Hi jonny, thanks for your comment.
So I've been stable on 4mgs for a little while now. Before I was on suboxone, I took antidepressants, so i am thinking that once I decrease a bit more that i should maybe go back onto the anti d's. This may be the reason I get so emotional when I taper.
The problem with splitting my dose is that i won't be able to do that consistently because 2 times a week i need to take my entire dose for the day in front of a pharmacist. So that would disrupt the flow.
Do you cut your dose with scissors?
I'm seeing my doc next week so I'll ask him his advice.
Ideally i would like to be off suboxone by end of year - that means i will have had a solid 2 years and a half on them.
I'll keep checking here and writing about how I'm going.
Manz :)


Depression:
I know how debilitating it can be. From the 2008 recession, I ultimately lost my home (that I built) in 2013 to foreclosure. Also bankruptsy & my wife & daughter moved 1000 miles away to look for work. I stayed behind, as I finally secured a good job. I was SO DEPRESSED for a 2 month episode, I was like a zombie... crying, & my brain in a fog. It was almost incapacitating. That comes & goes, though not as extreme now. Before I was on Sub., I too was on antidepressants (Zoloft), but did not feel it helped.

"I need to take my entire dose for the day in front of a pharmacist.":
WOW! That is absurd! I guess you'll have to tell your Dr. you are trying to taper, to be able to take your tapered dose in front of the Chemist? I have found, most Dr's. are very ignorant about suboxone & tapering. Mine is. Mine has no idea about withdrawals & PAWS. I've been on Subozone for about 5 years? I hope your Dr. is very educated on sub, & tapering!

"Do you cut your dose with scissors? ":
Yes, I'm cutting the 8 mgs. film strips. It is difficult. I have not told my Dr. I'm tapering and trying to stop. Otherwise, I would get the 2mg. film strips. THAT would be so much easier to cut, SEE, handle in your fingers or tweezers, & taper at a low dose effectively. I'm placing tiny little pieces under my tongue! When you cut an 8mg. film into .5mg and .25mg pieces, they are tiny!

Worrying: What a common theme here. I too worry about everything. But most of all, withdrawals, or seeking out my DOC again, if I stop!

One last thing, IMO, Suboxone is not a bad thing. I think it saved my life? If you do succeed in "jumping", you may end up seeking out your original DOC? In which case, you need a support group & perhaps Suboxone again. Using Suboxone is not "failing at life", it is keeping you from using & ultimately dying. I'd rather live!
Peace,
jonny

Edit: My 30 y/o nephew just left in an ambulance 20 minutes ago, from OD'ing on H. The second time in 2 days. This drug epidemic (opiates) is very real! Suboxone is the answer, if anyone ever stops suboxone & starts to crave again!!!


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 4:10 am 
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Michelle F. wrote:
Hi Manz, No, actually, the opposite happens, I feel really good. I have heard people say that with suboxone, less is more. That has definitely been the case with me! I have just felt better and better! Now, I have also heard that getting under 2mgs is when it starts to get dicey! So we will see! I have been putting the next drop off because it involves cutting the strips and I am not sure how I am going to preserve the remaining half until I take it in the evening. But, I need to get on it! lol I will let you know when I start!




Hi Michelle, I know you were joking about preserving the half of strip you cut, but just in case some new comers to Suboxone see this I just wanted to clarify this point. You cut it in half, then put it back in the same packet it came in and and place it down or if you are traveling just place it in a zip lock bag. Easy.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 4:18 am 
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Hi jonny,

That's so sad, i hope your nephew is ok.

Yeah, in Australia you have to dose at the chemist until you can prove you're reliable, then you can only have 5 "take aways" a week - the 2 times you go into the chemist to dose you need to do it in front of the pharmacist so that they can see you aren't misusing the drug. It actually really sucks. One of the reasons i want to come off subs is so I'm not having to go to the chemist every week - it's humiliating! I take my dose before i get out of bed the other 5 days a week, so when i get to the chemist I'm basically strung out - it's horrible.

But you're absolutely right! Sub has saved me in so many ways. In so many aspects of my life.

Soon I'll be ready.

Thank you for sharing. It's just very hard to find other people who are like me and i find this forum really helps.

Manz :)


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 6:40 am 
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Hey manz!
My nephew had just gotten out of rehab., only to find his job gone, & his g/f dumped him. He was so depressed, he said "F-it" & used again.
I'm just gonna talk for the sake of talking here....
I asked my brother if "my nephew had heard of, or been offered Suboxone?" I guess there is a waiting list? That is unacceptable in my opinion, if someone needs help now! My nephews reply was " I don't want to trade one drug for another." Now I'm thinkin' to myself... "And how's THAT workin' out for ya?" He is home now & okay. But there is little I can do. I rarely see him, & I don't want to preach.

So, WE have it better than others. We have sobriety (for the most part)! Anyone who "bashes" Suboxone, is an idiot(IMO), who has not experienced what we have.

"Humiliating" : I can understand that. That must be difficult.

We here, are all in the same boat, pretty much. All sharing very similar if not identical experiences.
It is a good outlet. Talking about it, is key, IMO.
Keep in touch!
jonny


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2016 7:36 am 
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I've heard the "replacing one drug for another" argument - mostly from my ex husband - obviously didn't work out LOL! Suboxone is a controlled substance but it's legal, i use it as prescribed, I don't get high or low anymore and I'm not in active addiction anymore. I've reconnected with family, friends (who don't use) and most importantly myself. I understand what your nephew is saying, but us addicts fear the unknown so it would be hard to imagine not getting a fix or living that lifestyle - I'm so so happy i got out when i did! It's amazing the justifications we make so that we can continue to use and abuse.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2016 5:44 pm 
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Hey Manz,
I'm not a Dr. nor an expert. But, after researching all over the internet regarding tapering & jumping, this is what I found .

Quote:
I jumped off about 1/8 of a milligram. Doctors who understand buprenorphine, taper people down to fractions of a milligram before they jump.


If you can talk to your Dr. & taper lower , maybe he can work with you?
Good luck!


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 30, 2016 11:45 pm 
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Today I've only taken 2mgs! I feeling ok, I'll be taking 4mgs tomorrow and alternating for a few weeks to see how it goes.

I talked to my doc this week, he said people generally don't find it hard to go from 4mgs to 2mgs - he also said weight gain is uncommon after i put on 15-20 kilos after starting suboxone! So I'll just have to wait and see how my body reacts.

So far I'm just sweating much more than normal, a little runny nose - but it's only been a few hours so might be in my head!

The doc said after 2mgs, they put you on a tablet that you're only allowed to have 8 weeks of, then you come off sub all together! It's a scarey thought! But I'm not there yet so i won't worry about that until i get there.

:)


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 12:01 am 
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Today i freaked out and took a day off work to see a doctor, got onto a low dose of Lexapro so that when i try to come off suboxone, my body/chemisty/head will hopefully be better equipped to handle the drop.

I've been taking 2mgs 2 days in a row, then 4 mgs on the third day.

Tomorrow i will try cutting a strip in half and go to 3mgs every 3rd day and 2 mgs for 2 days, I'll see if this works and will post again soon.

I'm certain there's a better way to do this but also know these things work differently for different people. I had been on antidepressants for years before suboxone, before I was on antidepressants I was a wreck! But life, friends and i have changed since being on suboxone. I think things are going to be ok! I read over the weekend that being on an antidepressant might assist with my sobriety once I'm off sub completely - i hope this is true and not just cleverly placed advertising by pharmaceutical companies!

I'm finding this thread great because I can see when i decreased and how i was feeling, it's like a journal that other people might benefit from.

Manz :)


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 2:38 pm 
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Im proud of ya Super M!

Your doing this your way, the way that works for you. I like the idea you have to take a tad
more every three days as you taper down.

There are many ways to leave this medication behind. No one way is best so keep on keepin on.

Good Luck to ya.. :D


Razor R...


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 3:02 pm 
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Yep I agree with Razor. Sometimes what method that's regularly used to taper doesn't mean it's best for everyone. If I were tapering, I'd do it whichever worked for me. We're all different and we just gotta figure out what's best for us as individuals. That's how I feel 100%.

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 08, 2016 5:56 pm 
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Hi Manz -

Just read your entire thread and wanted to comment on how great of a job you are doing. Hang in there you are doing great!

Brett


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 11, 2016 7:03 am 
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Oh wow!

Thank you so much for the positive feedback guys!

I took the 3mgs but actually had a particularly bad day that day, maybe because of the nalaxone? I'm not sure. So tomorrow I'm sticking to 2mgs of suboxone and see how it goes.

I've had a few rough patches, a headache behind my eye that pulses on and off, a little bit of the runs, been a bit tired, night sweats the first night on Lexapro, tiny bit of sleep disruption and concentration not 100% - but I'm doing it!!!!

I've also taken a few nights off of my boxing class because I've just been really beat by the end of the day.

I'm so thankful for your support and for you reading my thread.

I'll write again in a few days to tell you how 2mgs is going.

Manz :)


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2016 4:53 pm 
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Morning! (Or evening)

So 2mgs is going well, took till a few days ago for my morning runs (i only get the runs just after I've taken my dose and then can't go for the rest of the day - been like that the entire time while on a lower dose of suboxone TMI - sorry).

But i feel good! Work is good, I'm back exercising twice a week and i feel like I'm nearing the end - but of course I'll remain on 2mgs for some time.

I also have a real sense of accomplishment from going from 14mgs to 2mgs, I'm proud of myself.

Also every time i drop, I drop another kilo or so - obviously I'm working hard to exercise but I'm not craving sugar like i was when on the higher doses.

I've definitely had a few dicey days where i needed a panadol for my head but really over all things are good.

Manz :)


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 30, 2016 4:49 pm 
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Hi All,

I've noticed that I want to go to bed really early as of late, basically when i cut down to 2mgs. Is this something that will pass? Is it normal? I'm not sure.

But 2mgs is still going well. Going to stay on 2mgs for some time just to see if my sleeping habits get a bit better. I'm getting 9 to 11 hours sleep. Mostly i want to wake up before 6am. Usually going to bed around 8pm - which equals a limited social life! Not that that's bothering me for now.

Hopefully I get more energy soon :)

(I have gone to 10mgs of Lexapro - could this be leading to lack of energy?)

Manz :)


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 5:41 am 
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Hi guys,

So i just saw my doc, wants me to stay on 2mgs until November as I'm looking at moving house which can be stressful.

In Australia after you go down from 2mgs, you go onto just bupe - without the nalaxone. It's a course of 8 weeks and you go down by .4 mgs every 2 weeks i suppose. This has scared the hell out of me, which is why i decided to continue on 2mgs until November because I won't be getting the nalaxone and what if i become hooked again? Only having the opiate made me think "awesome" which made me think "oh no addict thinking!!!!!!!", so I'm staying on 2mgs.

I'm very nervous about not having the opiate blocker and only having the opiate. Has anyone else experienced this?

Thanks Manz :)


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 29, 2016 10:35 am 
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Hi Manz.
Ther are many posts in Dr Junigs Talkzone that will explain just what and why Naloxone is and was put into or mixed with Buprenorphine.
The short answer is the Naloxone isn't what gives you the blocking ability in the medicine, it is the Buprenorphine only when taking sublingualy as you are.
Plain bupe or generic Buprenorphine does the blocking it the reseptor level.
Its not like your taking methadone or oxy in this manner.
I hope this makes sence to you, if not go to the search box in the Talkzone and punch in Naloxone. You will find there what dr j says.

Naloxone was put in Buprenorphine to stop or block IV drug users . It has no purpose for thoses who take this med correctly or as directed.

Congratulations on your low dose. Your doing great. Just know that at these low doses your cravings can show themselves and there is les Buprenorphine to block other full agonist opiates (oxy,herion etc.).

Hope this will calm your fears a tad my friend.. Spring is coming your way..Enjoy :D


Razor


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