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 Post subject: 13 days off sub SCARED
PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 2:03 pm 
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Real quick history. Was on 32mg sub for 8 years tapered down to 2mg over the last year and took my last dose on 12/10/12 of 1mg. It has been hell to say the least. I have all the comfort meds clonidine, baclofen, ativan, taking wellbutrin for depression. I still have pretty bad aches in my legs that burn really bad at night. I am able to make myself sleep with the meds. I will wake up every two hours and have to take something else to help me sleep. I know the depression is normal but this is so different. When I move I feel like I am walking with a suit of armor. So this is day thirteen, I thought I would feel better by now. I know there are a lot of you out there who have done this. Just wondering how others have been at this point. Is there a magic date when I will feel somewhat normal, at least able to function? I feel like I'm in a horror show of my own life!!


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 4:18 pm 
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Opioid withdrawal extends over weeks, not days. For any opioid, including bupe, plan for 8-12 weeks. It WILL get better-- but it takes time. Good luck!


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 8:20 pm 
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It WILL GET BETTER

I think that "magic date" for every person is a little bit different......

you know, there's a really good older thread, I will put the link below, where the guy jumped from a
pretty damn HIGH dose of bupe, and he journaled every day at first, then every couple, then once a week,
YOU GET THE IDEA...

anyways, it might be worth the time to take a look at it, His
"experience" is kind of a "wost case" scenerio, since he didn't really taper AT ALL............

so here ya go
http://suboxforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=5965

Hope this helps, hang in there, your in the battle FOR your life afterall, it's worth it to fight like hell :wink:

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its the easiest thing in the world to do, but to
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That's TRUE STRENGTH
http://almostoneyearclean.blogspot.com/


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:23 am 
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Well, if it's a horror show, you're certainly not the only one starring in it. Nothing pretty about getting off this stuff. Back pain? check. (baclofen seems worthless....) Temperature regulation issues, intestinal stuff, lead feet, sleeplessness, ANXIETY, check.

I totally agree....if I knew when this CRAP would be over, it would make it SO much more manageable. As it is, we have no idea just how long we might feel like this. But....we're doing it, and every day is a little better. Keep talking to people, keep posting here, and keep your chin up.

This will not go on forever, and you're in good company.

Jo


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 Post subject: What can I do
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 1:27 pm 
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So now the acute agony seems to be less, but I am anxious, its soo bad. The only think I can think to do is just get up and walk everytime it happens. But of course it's freezing out now and I can't get warm. I feel empty, just pure empty. I am going to see a massage/accupressure person again and see what had maybe help out. I feel like sub took my soul and I am not sure how to find it again. Maybe I am just not a strong person but I guess I need to learn how. Mind over matter etc.... Deep Breathes. This has been the most horriffic experience of my life. That is what will keep me clean, one day at a time, but no way would I go througth this again. I know exercise is key, I have started that, does anyone have any other ideas about how to combat this empty feeling. I feel like I have lost the person I was before being on this stuff. :cry:


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:22 pm 
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I hope it helps you to know that I know exactly what you are feeling right now. Freezing cold and emotionally empty...that sums it up to a tee. I'm not a big NA person, but when I went off Sub I attended pretty regularly, and I got a sponsor who I spoke to almost every day. I kept telling her how shitty I felt, and I cried a lot. I felt like an idiot, but they say you can't save your ass and your face at the same time.
I also have a husband who, even though he totally doesnt "get" it, was willing to just give me hug or put his arm around me when I said I felt horrible, which was about 4-5 times as day. If you don't have a significant other I would suggest trying to get with friends or family and let them know you are going through some shit, even if you don't want to spell out exactly what it is. This isn't a do it yourself project. You really, really need some human support.
And yes, getting out, exercising, staying busy - all that helps. And I promise, it does get better.
Good luck,
Lilly


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 11:17 pm 
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You're doing awesome. Never forget what you've achieved!

Recovery from opioids - especially the longer acting ones like Sub and methadone - is a really gradual process. In many ways, once the acute symptoms have faded (and they can sometimes recur out of the blue, esp with methadone), there's still a bit of recovery to be done. And this more gradual, post-acute withdrawal recovery happens so gradually often it can be hard to notice it's happening at all. But it really is happening.

I think what might bring hope, is when you feel yourself getting bogged down and questioning whether you're recovering... As you get more clean time, think back to 2 weeks ago, 3 weeks ago, a month ago, 3 months ago ... think of how sick you were back then. That should help you realise that you ARE recovering, that you HAVE come a long way and you ARE doing well and things WILL be better.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 2:00 am 
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I did exactly what TJ said. After I had a little time off of Suboxone, I would look back a few days and realize that I was better than I was a few days ago. Then, as I got a few weeks under my belt, I would look back a week or so and realize how much better I was. During those early days, I was still sucking pavement pretty bad, BUT I was better than I was the previous few days or weeks and this realization was crucial to keeping me on track.

Also, it's so easy to want to give up and say "eff it", but then I knew I'd just have to go through all that effing nightmare again and there was no way on God's green earth that I was putting myself through that hell again.....once was enough!!!

During my first week or two of wd, I had anxiety attacks the likes of which I had never encountered before. I would always remind myself that it's just the wd, it'll go away and eventually the anxiety would pass. It was extremely uncomfortable, but it does pass.

The emptiness you're feeling is likely to hang around for a little bit. Right now, your body is trying to remember how to produce its own natural opiates. Your brain will get there, it's just gonna take some time. Try watching some funny movies or read the thread on this forum called Laughter is the Best Medicine. Laughing will help.

You said, "Maybe I am just not a strong person...." ARE YOU KIDDING ME?? By the time you read this, you'll be on day 18 of your wd......you're WAY strong!!! For some of us, wd from Suboxone can be an absolute shit kicking and you've survived 18 days!!!! You're strong as an ox!!!

Don't give up Cammie. I know you feel like crap, but it will get better. Keep fighting!!!

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 Post subject: 18 days
PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 10:53 am 
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Thanks for all the support and encouragement.
Ron: I do think the anxiety is the worse feeling I am having. It is huge and kinda takes over. The only thing that I have been able to do to help is to just move and go for a walk. I am in and out the apartment, am sure my neighbors think I am crazy. BTW I did like the video, def motivating.

Tee and Lilly- the empty feeling sucks and I am pissed too because my doc did me no justice on 32mg for eight years. I suppose getting angry is good. I basically have been crying myself to sleep everynight. I don't even remember christmas. I know I feel better, a little I just need to keep telling myself that I guess. Lilly, what you stated about being around people struck it, my husband drives a semi so he was here for a few days and then back to work. I do have my daughter right now, she stays with her dad, but once she is gone I am pretty much on my own (my son is 20 and works or is gone a lot) I am actually thinking about going and staying with my parents for a while, they are close by. I am not working but going to school online which starts again on January 7th. So right now I have nothing to do and I think that is getting to me.

The one thing I know for sure is that I will never go through this shit again, I'd rather die than form an addiction to any opiates. My new pain management physican has found other ways to help me so the only pain I am allowing myself to have is the kind that advil will help. I have seen people on here that seem to relapse quite a bit, I have this withdraw experience embeded in my head to keep my clean. Whatever it takes is all I can say.

Cammie


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 9:15 am 
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Cammiek wrote:
Real quick history. Was on 32mg sub for 8 years tapered down to 2mg over the last year and took my last dose on 12/10/12 of 1mg. It has been hell to say the least. I have all the comfort meds clonidine, baclofen, ativan, taking wellbutrin for depression. I still have pretty bad aches in my legs that burn really bad at night. I am able to make myself sleep with the meds. I will wake up every two hours and have to take something else to help me sleep. I know the depression is normal but this is so different. When I move I feel like I am walking with a suit of armor. So this is day thirteen, I thought I would feel better by now. I know there are a lot of you out there who have done this. Just wondering how others have been at this point. Is there a magic date when I will feel somewhat normal, at least able to function? I feel like I'm in a horror show of my own life!!


Hey..I was right there where you are. Feeling exactly the same as you do. Bad news is that it will last a bit longer...Good news is that you will also start to feel better soon. You will have good days and bad days for the next 2-3 months or so, maybe longer. That is what my nurse told me as I walked out the door from my last visit to the sub doctor WITHOUT a script. I've posted this thought before, "Two or Three months?" I thought this whole business would be over in 2-3 weeks...lol
Hang in there, I know its been hell, but it does indeed get better!!
I was on 32 mg just as you and I went down to 2 mg just like you...Finally just like you I said enough of this...
Good job and you will be fine, but you have to be strong.
Aloha


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 Post subject: Re: 18 days
PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 9:25 am 
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Cammiek wrote:
Thanks for all the support and encouragement.
Ron: I do think the anxiety is the worse feeling I am having. It is huge and kinda takes over. The only thing that I have been able to do to help is to just move and go for a walk. I am in and out the apartment, am sure my neighbors think I am crazy. BTW I did like the video, def motivating.

Tee and Lilly- the empty feeling sucks and I am pissed too because my doc did me no justice on 32mg for eight years. I suppose getting angry is good. I basically have been crying myself to sleep everynight. I don't even remember christmas. I know I feel better, a little I just need to keep telling myself that I guess. Lilly, what you stated about being around people struck it, my husband drives a semi so he was here for a few days and then back to work. I do have my daughter right now, she stays with her dad, but once she is gone I am pretty much on my own (my son is 20 and works or is gone a lot) I am actually thinking about going and staying with my parents for a while, they are close by. I am not working but going to school online which starts again on January 7th. So right now I have nothing to do and I think that is getting to me.

The one thing I know for sure is that I will never go through this shit again, I'd rather die than form an addiction to any opiates. My new pain management physican has found other ways to help me so the only pain I am allowing myself to have is the kind that advil will help. I have seen people on here that seem to relapse quite a bit, I have this withdraw experience embeded in my head to keep my clean. Whatever it takes is all I can say.

Cammie


HI again
I hope your feeling better today!! I know how you feel regarding your Dr. and the 32 mgs. I thought to myself the same thing, what the heck was he thinking prescribing me that (32 mgs) for all the time? I just kept taking them for 3 years, until I finally figured out what the f am I doing?
I too am going to school on line, and thank goodness for the holiday break as I just have not the energy lately. I have been off subs for 4 months or so, and although I feel "pretty good" I must say that I had a rough go of it over this time. Physically after a month the worst was over. Then the mental part kicks in. Which is pretty bad, with bad mood swings, lack of energy, lack of focus, etc..
Be strong, there are still challenges ahead, but on day 18 or so, you hopefully are feeling better than the first week, right?
Aloha


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 Post subject: 21 days??
PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 3:34 pm 
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Grr.... I'm losing track of my life. I so thought this would not be so bad. I have thought of giving up so many times right now but I just go for another hour. I have never had time pass so slow and no one gets it. How many times have I heard think positive over the last few days. Ok but that is not so easy right now. I am trying to have a more upbeat attitude about the whole thing but I feel like total fucking shit and it won't go away. Its bad when sleep is what you look forward to every day and even that is only a few hours at a time. I wake up and think really it's still dark out why the hell am I awake again?? I just don't know how people get through this, I have been sad before in my life but never anything like this. I am going to try the accupuncture again, something at least when I had that done it hurt and I was feeling something, even if it was pain. Well I am saying one more hour right now, and will just keep saying that. Did the people who make this crap realize what it would be like to come off of it? I have to wonder
Cammie


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2013 3:55 pm 
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HI Cammie
It's hard when you are not feeling well to hear the words, "hang in there," "it will get better," etc..Buts its true. Right now if you are at about 3 weeks you should start to feel better soon, real soon.
You probably feel better now than what you did a week or so ago.
All I can say is that there was something inside of you the spurred you on to this decision to get off of these subs, and you are doing it!!
Hang in there
Dave


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2013 10:08 am 
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Cammie, you are so close - don't quit 5 minutes before the miracle happens, as they say. I think you are right at the point where you will start having more good days than bad. I remember watching entire PBS miniseries in the middle of the night. Boy, did I get an education about the wild, wild, west and stuff like that.
Also, I agree that most doctors don't know how powerful this medication is. That is why I cringe when I see people new to the forum going on Sub for a hydrocodone habit or something like that. I seriously believe it should be reserved for people who are at the end of the road - to avoid jails, institutions or death. I regret going on it, too. And I went BACK on it after going through the WD because of a relapse. But such is the nature of opiate addiction. Suboxone DOES saves lives. But I think both doctors and patients have the right to be educated on what starting Suboxone treatment really entails. RB introduced this drug without doing one single study on getting off of it. But I digress...anyway, I hope you feel better.
Lilly


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:01 am 
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Cammie! Did you go for accupuncture? I have been battling the shitfest of depression this week, and after a good session and armed with some personalized love, attention and Chinese herbs, feel SO MUCH BETTER. It was worth every cent to see the look on my hubby's face when he saw my smile when I came home. I don't care what part of it works--the needles, the attention, the love, the kindness--it's worth a try. I know everyone is different, and it may not be your cup of tea, but jeez, it can't be worse than feeling THIS SHITTY, right? I hope you'll give it a try.

The woman I saw (and will continue to see) gave me herbs for anxiety, depression, sleep, and helped me truly see that the work I'm doing is going to pay off....eventually. Some of the stuff she gave me is actually going to stimulate the poor, sad receptors that keep waiting for me to toss back the magic pills, and then they can relearn (a little faster) how to do it on their own. Wow, right? All I can say is that I feel good right now, and that I might be able to fold the massive piles of laundry that my husband has been kind enough to wash. And from the pit I've been in, that seems BIG. (If couch luge was a sport, I would be a gold medalist after this week!)

Be kind to yourself, and send me a PM if you'd like the info on the specific herbs she gave me. You can get them online, if you decide that an appointment isn't possible.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:35 am 
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Go to your parent's. You have to have people that you can tell your woe's too. I went clean Nov 14. If it weren't for my mother I would have committed suicide. I have been having all the terrible withdrawals and that was yesterday. I would never go back to having to taper again. That was a nightmare. This is only terror. I am feeling more myself finally. Like tapering the fog lifted. Some days.

If I can do it, so can you. You must have an outlet at any moment of the day. Read, start using your brain, it needs to heal. It helps. Exercise. do walk when you are feeling bad. I paced my room for hours. Treadmill is great. It gets the endorphin's going. That is what you need. That good daily vitamin and healthy foods.

I will only wish you good luck. We do know what you are going through. Keep posting...

Yes no energy, but once you get going it helps immensely. Turn on the music and dance.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:43 pm 
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suboxdoc wrote:
Opioid withdrawal extends over weeks, not days. For any opioid, including bupe, plan for 8-12 weeks. It WILL get better-- but it takes time. Good luck!


Um.. try 3-4 months. I know everyone's different but I'm just being honest.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2013 2:48 pm 
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Music. Baths.

I hope you have the strength to get through this. It really is worth it but if you're looking to feel better over night, it doesn't happen that way. It's more of a back & forth type thing and it's easier to measure progress over weeks & months rather than days. It really is worth it on the end. I remember being where you are. You just have to find a reason to keep moving forward and do anything you can to take your mind off it.


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 Post subject: Day 26
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2013 10:38 am 
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Thanks for all the support from everyone. It has helped so much knowing I was not crazy and the only person in the world to suffer through this. I think maybe I am finally a bit on the upslide. The body aches diminished two days ago and I do feel a bit of hope at this point. I am not great by any means but certainly better. My doctor was a bit rattled that I was still in w/d on Fri when I went to see him. He is not the one who kept me on the high dose for eight years, but the one I found when I was in crisis and my doctor went overseas with no one on call for his patients. My new doc has been there helping me along the way.

Jolene- I did see an acupuncture doctor, actually two the first one did not seem to understand the addiction aspect of what I was telling him so I called around some more and found another one who was great. He spent three hours with me getting the history and started treatment. He is also making me a herbal remedy that helps with the same things you mentioned. He put these needles in my ears, six of them and they stay in for several days. Not sure what part of the whole process might have helped but like you I am going back for more. Maybe it psychological but I really feel that this physican knows what he is doing.

So today I am going to start my school classes online and actually feel like cooking something. After twenty six days, this seems like a miracle to me. I have never been so happy to actually want to do something as simple as cooking or cleaning up.

Cammie


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 2:46 pm 
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So glad things are progressing for you! It really does get better slowly but surely. Please don't be alarmed if you have off days again or seem to move backwards at times, this is normal. It really is an up and down process but one that is totally necessary to even out in the end.

Keep us posted!


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