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 Post subject: Day 5- Please Help
PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:43 pm 
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To make a long story short, I have been doing pills of all varieties like oxy and opana for about three years. I never used more than 40 mg a day. Recently a friend of mine got prescribed suboxone so I decided I wanted to try to quit with him and he would sell me them since he is on 24mg a day. For probably two months I did anywhere from 1mg to 4 mg a day. I kind of tapered but not really because I would get one and do half of it sometimes. Anyway, my friend ended up going to rehab because he relapsed and I bought my last sub like ten days ago. I made it last about a week by doing about 1 mg a day. Then I thought I could quit since I was only on sub for like a month at at a low dose. I ended up getting until day five (1 thru 3 were fine) then four and five sucked. I hadn't slept at all and my parents were and gf were suspicious so I cracked and did three vicodin 10 mg to feel normal and actually get some sleep. At the time I thought it wouldn't set me back but now I am scared that the five days I went without are worthless and I am back to square one. If I don't take any more vics and continue to quit am I starting all over or am I still at day six? Please help, I want to quit so bad and am now worried because I was so positive I was done for good.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:46 pm 
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sorry my days are off and it is a little confusing. I used sub for anywhere from a month to a month and a half but not sure exactly. And also Im not sure the last day I bought the sub but i was on day five of cold turkey when I did the three vicodins


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 6:35 pm 
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There are different points of view on suboxone. One is to use it to do a short detox off DOC and then just quit. The other option is to go on sub for a period of at least 6 months-1 year +. In my opinion, sub should be used as a tool to help make the behavioral life changes so you break the habit of taking Vics etc. I was on oxy/vics/norco/whatever I could get for 3 years then was on sub for three years. Saved my life. Sorry to rant, to answer your question. There is a kindling effect when you take an opiate when trying to stop suboxone. The full opiate strokes the neurotransmitters that are trying to heal. Unfortunatlry, healing means you have to be miserable for a little while. if you have not cut ties from the scumbags that give you painkillers (doctors,or "friends") and changed your number it will be extremely difficult (dr J sais impossible) to quit for good. It's not just the sub your WD from its the past 3 years of opiate use. You WILL feel better, normal and happy again though.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 6:55 pm 
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I have cut ties and deleted numbers so I honestly dont even have a way of getting anything anymore. I just wanted to know if doing those three vics is the stupidest thing I have done and now I start all over again. And I have quit in the past numerous times but never for more than a couple months. So this is not the first time I stopped taking everything for a period of time. I just want to know if one relapse of vicodin is really going to make me start all over and feel like complete crap again. Thanks for the reply


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2012 9:05 pm 
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Hi centerice, welcome to the forum!

Taking 30mg worth of Hydrocodone on day 5 of your Suboxone wd will not start your wd all over again, it sure didn't move your wd experience forward, but I really don't think you're gonna be starting all over at day 1.

This next question is not intended to be rude or anything like that, it's just a question from one addict to another. What have you done different this time (quitting opiates) that makes you think you're gonna be successful this time?? If you really haven't addressed many of your addict behaviors, I'm afraid you're gonna use again. Know what I mean??

I'd really like to see you be able to make it clean for more than a few months this time, that's gonna involve some kind of recovery work, in my opinion.

BTW, your screen name, center ice.....are you a hockey fan?? I'm Canadian, so I'm obviously a hockey fan!!

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 Post subject: Jump
PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 1:22 am 
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I am not sure you will have too too many extreme withdraw symptoms but I am sure there will be some. The long use of suboxone is what causes the hellish long time withdraw and PAWS, if you have been using opiates you will have PAWS anyway.

I would not suggest staying on suboxone UNLESS you have no other way of staying clean, like you will relapse if you are not on it. As we all know reaching for an opiate seems to make it all better but well you know that story.

If you think there is another way for you to stay off the drugs then leave suboxone alone, just my opinion and we all have them, if it will save your life as an addict then know the pros and cons do a hell of a lot of research everywhere you can from others who have been there short and long.

Let us know how you are.

Romeo, great advice. I am also working on the program and support group so when I get off this subutex I can stay clean for once in my life. I have to be strong, I am ready for my life back. :lol:


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 9:52 am 
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Thanks so much for both the replies. Woke up today feeling great but probably doesn't mean much since I took those at 4p.m. yesterday and it is only 10a.m. Gotta go to work so hopefully I feel good. Romeo, I know it seems like nothing has changed but I thought I was quitting a month and a half ago when I said I would never user again and started suboxone. Little did I know the withdrawals from staying on that too long can be worse and longer than what I was already doing. I really am done though. I have cut ties with everyone around me that was a negative influence and told my girlfriend who I had been keeping it from everything that was going on because I get really depressed during the withdrawals and can't sleep and really need her support. I am 100% done with it, I just thought taking those would alleviate some of the symptoms so I could get one night of sleep. Then after taking them started worrying about the consequences. And yes I am a hockey fan, played my whole life. From Michigan originally but since your from Canada you're probably not going to like that my team is the redwings.

Ontoolong- Thanks for the great advice. I did not know what I was getting into when I started doing the suboxone. A month in I thought I was done with everything and ready to start my life again. Then I read online about the withdrawals. My friend failed to mention that to me and thats what I get for not going to a doctor. But again I had to keep this from people around me since I thought it was soon over with. Hopefully it is.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 10:19 am 
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I grew up in Windsor (we were only a 20 minute drive from Joe Louis Arena), the Wings are my team too. Plus, the Leafs suck so bad, who would want to be a Leafs fan? LOL!! I played up until my second year of college, had to quit, those guys just hit too damn hard!! :D

I'm glad you've made some changes in your life. Opening up to your girlfriend should help you a lot. Cutting old ties is essential too. You may want to look into some kind of recovery too. NA/AA or SMART or some kind of therapy, something to give you some more ammunition when temptation strikes.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 7:37 pm 
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Haha that's funny, I knew there were a lot of Wings fans in Windsor but I assumed you were from somewhere else. Man that home winning streak by the wings was something else wasn't it? Now they need to get their team healthy and get back to that form.

So usually when I have to work and I am going through withdrawals I can't get anything done. I am not the most friendly to customers and I am weak and have no energy. Also I do not usually have an appetite and worst of all time usually drags on FOREVER. Today though I felt great. I was happy and full of energy and my body still feels great. I don't know how long withdrawal from vics takes because I was never really into them, but about 27 hours after taking them I am feeling great. I know it is foolish to think that it is close to over, but I really feel like I am over the hump. Maybe I didn't screw myself over as bad as I thought.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 7:44 pm 
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Also, I have wanted to go to a group or something but I feel like I need to try and keep it a secret from everyone but my girlfriend and handle it on my own. My parents are going through a lot with my sister and the last thing I want is them to worry about it me as well, especially since I've always been the "good" one.


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 Post subject: Getting through
PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 8:06 pm 
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19,

I hope for you that it will not be so bad, but experience and stories from other sadly points in a negative direction. If you have trouble, sign on here and let it out, we will all help.
This has been a life saver for me, I too am ready to be done with this shit, taking it one day at a time, when I get clean I am taking the concept of saying "This hour I will not use, this day I will not use, I have the support I have to use it, I let everyone I know about it, it was the hardest thing I ever did but now it is out and will help me from screwing up, they will know and call me on it.

Good luck, maybe you will one of the lucky ones and it will not be so awful. I hope so.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 8:10 pm 
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I think it's fair to want to keep your family from worrying about it at this stage, if their plate is already full. There will be the right time to open up to your family.

I've found that using while in withdrawals of any kind can push back the days considerably. If I used heroin during day 3-4 of a heroin detox, I'd be back to day zero. That being said, I never used Vicodin. We don't even HAVE vicodin here (or they're called something else). But I get the feeling 30mg's of vics isn't as strong as a hit of heroin.

One thing I'd suggest though. If you can't make it through the detox without using a second time, do consider going on legitimate Suboxone treatment. Quitting opioids for life takes a huge degree of willingness / conviction. Staying clean through acute withdrawal, for me, was a lot easier than staying clean long term after withdrawal. Just a heads up.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2012 8:38 pm 
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If I am not strong enough to make it, which I still believe I am, I think my only option is to try to quit again. I have always wanted to see a sub doc but I am under my parents insurance and I do not know exactly how that works, all I know is that it would probably be impossible to keep it from them. I have no way of getting subs from friends and have zero numbers or friends that I can call to get anything else. Really I am in a spot where my only option is to quit, try and reconnect with old friends (which I refuse to do), or see a sub doctor if there is any way I can keep from my parents. I would pay out of pocket if I had to If anyone has info on that I would appreciate it. I think I can do this though honestly. The next week will probably be the toughest, but I will keep you updated.

Thanks everyone for the replies and I don't know everyone that is posting on my thread's history with sub, but it seems like most of you successfully quit? Anyway I know you don't want to tell me your story, but I really do appreciate all the time and help. It is great that you came back even after quitting to offer help to those struggling. You all are helping me out even if you don't know it and I really appreciate it. St. Patty's day party tonight. Hopefully I can be myself and feel ok the rest of the night....Happy Saint Patrick's Day everyone!


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:52 pm 
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Worked all day today again and felt pretty good. Decent energy all day, just hoping I can get some sleep. I think taking those didn't effect me much.


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