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PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 10:58 pm 
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I think you could definitely try going to 4 mg. The way to tell if you're at a good dose for you is that you should not feel over medicated, but you should not feel cravings either. If you get to 4 mg and find that your drug of choice is looking better and better, time to go back up to 5 mg or 6 mg. Try the taper to 4 mg and let us know how it goes for you. You might not notice a real difference until 3 or 4 days after the change because of sub's long half-life. Keep in touch!

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 2:33 pm 
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Thanks razor, that is definitely helpful. Can you tell me how an afternoon dose works better for you over an evening dose? I've been wondering how timing of dose affects things. Please share how this helps.
It seems to keep me up and spacey until 1am. Is that why you take it earlier?
I literally fell asleep while eating breakfast today, and it took a couple hours to get the feeling back in my left hand.

And thank you again Amy. Last night I chickened out on reducing to 4mg. I got scared it wouldn't be enough (even tho I know it takes a few days to notice a difference). But to my addict self, that dreamy state is kind of pleasant. So my addiction said to me
"Don't take 4mg, you won't feel as calm. Take 6 just one more time."
Typical addict thinking.
Today I will cut all my remaining strips in half.
It's also a huge help to know I can adjust back to 6 if cravings return.
Thanks for all the encouragement.
4mg happens tonight!


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 3:05 pm 
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Hey TBW,

I'm glad to see an update from you! Try not to worry so much about the reductions. Nobody is forcing you to do it if you aren't ready, but you should be able to take your dose without feeling these adverse effects. That addict inside you doesn't understand that you will actually feel better if you get your dose to a level that takes care of your cravings, but doesn't leave you feeling groggy. If you reduce and don't feel it's enough you can always go back up.

I'm wondering if you have been able to get involved in any kind of recovery program aside from taking your suboxone? It seems to me that you are still obsessing about your dose, which is completely normal this early in treatment. But, I think you would hugely benefit from some kind of outside help. Have you sought out any kind of counseling with an addiction specialist or looked into any support group meetings? I hope you don't mind me suggesting this, I only do so because I have been where you are. Still hanging on to that addictive mind set that screams at you not to take less than you have been. There is a real fear that is involved with thinking you won't feel as good, or even that you will feel fine, but not great. Breaking this obsession will give you a freedom you can't even begin to imagine. And it's not something that most of us can do for ourselves. You may need just a little extra help to get there.

In the mean time, recognize how far you have come. The fact that you got away from your active using and have been able to stick with only your suboxone and have even had the courage to make at least one reduction, VOLUNTARILY, is a very big thing. Just keep in mind that no matter how hard it is to understand why suboxone works the way it does, you will feel your best if you get to the right dose for you. The yucky side effects will be reduced as you find that magic number, and you can spend however much time you need at that dose once you get there. I have faith that you will do fine. :)

Let us know how it goes tonight!

Q

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 11:00 pm 
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TbW...ok im on day 6 of 4mgs and feel better than on 6mgs. I need to say that you are fairly new to suboxone.finding a sable dose can be tricky, but it isnt that hard if you are willing to try and work at it.
You have gotten some great suggestions from addicts here who know there stuff. I agree that you need more help. Some kind of support. I do meetings and check in at this forum all day loug. Also go over to Dr junigs Talkzone an get reading. You will understamd more about what this med is and does by checking out his blog..
One time dosing is what we strive for . However, many dose twice, sometimes three times daily. I moved my second dose up to the afternoon becuz i wanted better sleep and better mornings.
Im doing great on 4. You will too. Good luck, and we cant do this alone. Find some recovery help...raz..


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 12:13 am 
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qhorsegal2 wrote:
Hey TBW,

I'm wondering if you have been able to get involved in any kind of recovery program aside from taking your suboxone? It seems to me that you are still obsessing about your dose, which is completely normal this early in treatment. But, I think you would hugely benefit from some kind of outside help. Have you sought out any kind of counseling with an addiction specialist or looked into any support group meetings? I hope you don't mind me suggesting this, I only do so because I have been where you are. Still hanging on to that addictive mind set that screams at you not to take less than you have been. There is a real fear that is involved with thinking you won't feel as good, or even that you will feel fine, but not great. Breaking this obsession will give you a freedom you can't even begin to imagine. And it's not something that most of us can do for ourselves. You may need just a little extra help to get there.

In the mean time, recognize how far you have come. The fact that you got away from your active using and have been able to stick with only your suboxone and have even had the courage to make at least one reduction, VOLUNTARILY, is a very big thing. Just keep in mind that no matter how hard it is to understand why suboxone works the way it does, you will feel your best if you get to the right dose for you. The yucky side effects will be reduced as you find that magic number, and you can spend however much time you need at that dose once you get there. I have faith that you will do fine. :)

Q


Thanks again, so much- I really do need to check in here more often.
I planned to post an update at day 4 or 5 on 4mg, and life got in the way. If I had read your post, I would have given an update much sooner! Thanks to you too, raz. Here's what happened:
I was on 4mg for four days. I was fine, except I noticed I was on edge and caught myself wishing I could take pills again. This easily could have been coincidence, but I took it as a sign of cravings, so I went back up to 6mg and am maintaining there. There is a dark side to this though, and you and razor are right about finding real recovery help. Even though I'm maintaining on 6mg, and only take one dose a day, I get a buzz a couple hours after my dose. It's a pleasant, fully relaxed feeling, and not euphoric. But it's there, some days more than others. And I am in the habit of coming home, taking my sub and waiting to feel the buzz. I know that's addict behavior. I need a place to talk this out and keep sub in its proper place in my life.

When it comes to seeking help..
The last therapist I saw who specialized in addictions thought Vicodin was a benzo, I had to explain its an opiate, that I was abusing pain pills. And that was after a year of really investing in therapy! So that ended. After that was sub. The sub doc told me do 12 step, but to start with AA not NA. I think it's just until I get stronger in my recovery, so I don't make any friends with anyone who can get me access to pills (which is smart). I went to my very first one about a week ago. And it went great.

But I haven't gone back and I don't know why. I guess I'm lazy and groups scare me. I was shaking at the meeting. Any suggestions you have about how to get connected and stay connected would help a lot. Do you think my doc is wrong and I should seek out NA?

I'll try to check in more, so my posts won't be so God awful long!


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2013 8:49 pm 
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Last night I felt no buzz on my 6 mg! I had this burst of energy (which I've heard sub can bring on) and was able to clean my apartment for the first time in ages.
No more lethargy or nodding! No druggy feelings, no zoning out.

Is it possible I've finally reached the point that I've fully adjusted to sub?
I am finally feeling the anti-depressant effect, and mild energy lift I have read bout.

I don't want to get my hopes up too fast, but I may finally be at the goal of "normal."
I haven't dosed yet because of work. I'll update if anything changes.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2013 10:57 pm 
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Well it sounds to me that you have found your dose. Congrats. Sometimes it takes awhile. This is hard for to understand. I was great after the first 4mgs the first evening an all the next day. ..
I have gone to N A these last three years. As you may have read here many members of the fellowship take issue with addicts useing a med in there recovery. AA can be more understanding of Subozone being part of a recovery tool. This is a tuff subject really. I can only tell you this,ive never said a word to anyone about my use of bupe. But at this point it isnt a big deal. I just think i wouldnt be coming up on 3 years without the help of other addicts face to face. Plus we've started a sub/12 step group at our clinic Very lucky to have this in my recovery. maybe check out both fellowships. And ya i was a shaking mess my first few meetings. Lol. Hope this helps and so glad your feeling great.



razor..


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2013 9:29 pm 
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razor53 wrote:
Well it sounds to me that you have found your dose. Congrats. Sometimes it takes awhile. This is hard for to understand. I was great after the first 4mgs the first evening an all the next day. ..
I have gone to N A these last three years. As you may have read here many members of the fellowship take issue with addicts useing a med in there recovery. AA can be more understanding of Subozone being part of a recovery tool. This is a tuff subject really. I can only tell you this,ive never said a word to anyone about my use of bupe. But at this point it isnt a big deal. I just think i wouldnt be coming up on 3 years without the help of other addicts face to face. Plus we've started a sub/12 step group at our clinic Very lucky to have this in my recovery. maybe check out both fellowships. And ya i was a shaking mess my first few meetings. Lol. Hope this helps and so glad your feeling great.



razor..


Wow, razor. Your post put things in perspective for me. I knew there was another reason my doctor suggested AA over NA. You reminded me that someone I knew who was a recovering addict who chose to stick with AA for that very reason- they were more accepting.
I've been to more meetings. I like them, I feel safe.
I hope for an experience like yours where I can make a strong connection.

I'm not 100% sure 6mg is the right dose because I still sometimes get a buzz after I take my dose.
I'm still behaving like an addict with it, in terms of looking forward to it mellowing me out at the end of the day. I took my 6 mg three and a half hours ago and I'm pretty mellow & relaxed as I type this. 4 mg might the more appropriate dose. But I don't want to lose this feeling. I also know that's addiction talking.
Thanks to everyone. Thanks for this space to just check in.


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