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 Post subject: Re: btw TO INDIGOCHILD
PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2011 1:43 am 
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slipper wrote:
indigochild wrote:
that was not a bottom story just a craving story that made a positive impact.....if that makes any sence?


TO indigochild: I agree with you on cravings and abstinence-based recovery. Maybe because I've fried my brain for 29 yrs...but i just have to have something and subutex does it for me. I have taken methadone (on the streets) and I just wanted more methadone. I hope you don't mind me asking, but how do you not want to increase your dose? Do you have any problems with that? I know there are a lot of people on this forum on meth and a lot on sub and I feel whatever works for you so be it. It is just that sub won't let me take more to feel better..it is what it is..but with the methadone more made me feel better. ALL MY LIFE I WANTED TO FEEL BETTER THAN I DO RIGHT NOW!...does that make sense to anyone but me???


I adapt quick. If I increased dose, it wouldn't give me a "buzz"....i take it for pain as well so I take 40mg every 6hr. If I went an entire day without anything and then dose dumped,...I might? get a warm glow but the pain wouldn't be worth it. I'm flat- completely normal and for the most part pain free


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 Post subject: i'm out of
PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2011 1:53 am 
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my "funk" for now- no cravings and very content. I don't know how many people out there have dual-diagnosis (sp), but because I suffer from Bi-polar as well when i get on a depressive state- that's when the cravings really happen. when i'm manic, i'm untouchable

I'd love to hear from someone that suffers from ADD/ADHD - I'm curious how that might affect their addiction by taking an addictive stimulant along with bupe or done....


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2011 8:56 am 
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indigochild wrote:
my "funk" for now- no cravings and very content. I don't know how many people out there have dual-diagnosis (sp), but because I suffer from Bi-polar as well when i get on a depressive state- that's when the cravings really happen. when i'm manic, i'm untouchable

I'd love to hear from someone that suffers from ADD/ADHD - I'm curious how that might affect their addiction by taking an addictive stimulant along with bupe or done....


INDIGO-My very best friend suffers from add/adhd and takes adderal 30mg. She is also on methadone, ativan, and several antidepressants(sp) She takes the methadone for pain and addiction. She was just laying in bed all day hurting and miserable....but since they have put her on the adderal she is able to get up and function. She looks and feels much better. She does not abuse the medications she is on...she told me with her pain stable and her energy level increased she doesn't feel the need to abuse drugs.


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 Post subject: To Indigo
PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2011 7:34 pm 
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Hey Indy,

While I don't have an official diagnosis of ADD/ADHD, I've been on Adderal for a while now, prescribed by my PCP for concentration issues as work. This script was OK'ed by my sub doc.

It has helped tremendously. I am doing much better at work, and at home too. It actually calms me down, allows me to focus, and I don't get a speed buzz at all. I'm on a pretty low dose (10 mg / day) and that seems to be OK for me.

A few months ago there was a show about ADD on PBS that I watched with my wife. She looked at me and said "that's you". I'm closer to 50 than 40, and I'm sure if ADD was diagnosed as much as it is now when I was in grade school, I'd have been on medication since then. I showed all the classic ADD symptoms in school and life. And of course tried to self medicate for many years.

I'm hopeful that ADD is my underlying psych issue and being properly treated for it will allow me to eventually get off sub. Taking adderal makes me feel normal. That's my experience.

Regards,
Jimmy


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 Post subject: Re: i'm out of
PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2011 11:01 pm 
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indigochild wrote:
my "funk" for now- no cravings and very content. I don't know how many people out there have dual-diagnosis (sp), but because I suffer from Bi-polar as well when i get on a depressive state- that's when the cravings really happen. when i'm manic, i'm untouchable

I'd love to hear from someone that suffers from ADD/ADHD - I'm curious how that might affect their addiction by taking an addictive stimulant along with bupe or done....


I can somewhat relate to that type of situation, I am not bi-polar but I suffer from severe obsessive compulsive disorder that leads to serious anxiety and panic attacks. And when my ocd takes off I start to get really really stressed out than work myself into a panic and most times into a full blown panic attack, when this happens my cravings become very serious and dangerous to my recovery. I start telling myself that a big dose of heroine would just knock me out and i wouldn’t have to feel this way. And that’s when the OCD takes over I obsess over the thought of not having to feel this way if I was high or if I took some valium I would be able to relax and so on and so on you guys get it. When I am having one of these attacks every single negative of using turns into a positive. The only thing that works for me besides taking my Prozac daily is getting up and taking my dog for a walk some days I walk for hours because my house is like a jail cell during one of these funks. I was on benzos I think for like 4 days till my next app when I told my DR how much I love valium.

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 Post subject: opioids and depression
PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 12:15 pm 
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This morning I woke up feeling blah!.... I took my usually morning dose of methadone, which I'm completely tolerent to... and bam! I feel all warm and fuzzy. This NEVER happens. I hear some people talk about the ' fresher' suboxone in the pharmacy "feel" better.

It's just weird because I never get an uplift when I take mdone- pain just goes away...now, I feel great! I don't know what to make of this..

Do any of you feel a little buzzed (warm) when you take your sub ? being an addict, I love this feeling


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 12:31 pm 
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Nah not really.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 2:05 pm 
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I did alot more when I first started. But not to long ago I decided to fill script at walgreens and I took my usual dose and BAM!!! Sweating hands and inside my body started shaking, I was like shit that is hitting me BIG time. I eat and felt better but I tell you it was a rush. So I have to say yea, But it was not warm and fizzy it was a BIG RUSH!!!
Mel :wink:

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 09, 2011 4:59 pm 
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indigochild wrote:
This morning I woke up feeling blah!.... I took my usually morning dose of methadone, which I'm completely tolerent to... and bam! I feel all warm and fuzzy. This NEVER happens. I hear some people talk about the ' fresher' suboxone in the pharmacy "feel" better.

It's just weird because I never get an uplift when I take mdone- pain just goes away...now, I feel great! I don't know what to make of this..

Do any of you feel a little buzzed (warm) when you take your sub ? being an addict, I love this feeling


I would be lying if i said no, some days my methadone does give me that warm fuzzy feeling u talk off and like you i love it. Life just becomes simple on those days is this a sign of active addiction maybe or maybe not. All i know when it happens i enjoy it but the best part is, I DONT CHASE IT! If it happens cool if not thats fine too.

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 Post subject: inspiration
PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:48 am 
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Momentarily, this is the most inspirational passage I've read, and NEEDED to 'hear' . It is an peice from Dr. Junigs 'sneetches':

I try to facilitate that process, by the way, by helping recovering addicts understand and believe that their addiction is a disease. I point out that while they had some role in the start of the disease, people have similar roles in the early stages of many, if not most diseases. I help them realize that they have been punished enough, and that at some point they have the right to hold their heads high again. I recommend that they avoid developing too large an ego, as righteous anger is a dangerous trait for any recovering addict. Instead, they should find the humility that most people find in recovering from any chronic illness, the humility that we all find when we realize that we are mortal beings. And at the same time they should give themselves a break, make amends where due, and feel a sense of pride for working hard at doing the right thing.

Often, I forget I'm treating two diseases(both deadly) . I'm so hard on myself, especially for things that happen , in which I have NO control. Reading this passage today is just what I needed.

I struggle with the fact that both my diseases (addiction, bi-polar 1) I keep in the closet. I've had a good amount of excess pain lately too, maybe because the weather- some neuropathy pain, which scares the shit outa me. Sure, I'm on here because I believe this is the best damn, most non- biased, non- judgemental group of folks out there in cyberspace. But still I hide behind a pen name.

I just started wellbutrin(sp?) because I go into a deep depression in the winter. It seem to be helping better than any SSRI. Honestly , I have no clue the difference between an SSRI or SNRI or MAOI? anyway, I think wellbutrin is in a class all by it's own. But anyway, life could be much worse , But I just wish I could get on a PA and scream I have 3 deadly issues I struggle with everday, give me a fucking break! Especially those that want to hold me accountable all through my active addiction of 14? yrs. I've watched all my classmates surpass me in everyway imaginable- that's the main reason I didn't attend our reunion this year. When everyone else talks about their acheivements, I just want to shout out loud but I sit in silence. It sucks - the stigma that goes with addiction, bi-polar, chronic pain....I sure as hell don't want to put that on my resume LOL.

But for now, I feel like I can give myself a break this holiday season and appreciate what I have. I try an remember all my friends that have fallen...this is all I can scribble for now..


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 5:14 am 
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meltalk wrote:
I did alot more when I first started. But not to long ago I decided to fill script at walgreens and I took my usual dose and BAM!!! Sweating hands and inside my body started shaking, I was like shit that is hitting me BIG time. I eat and felt better but I tell you it was a rush. So I have to say yea, But it was not warm and fizzy it was a BIG RUSH!!!
Mel :wink:


That sounds like mild precipitated withdrawal, for sure. When it gets stronger, that "rush" feeling becomes very unpleasant. Did it feel like a dirty hit of speed? Or like you'd just smashed down 20 coffees?

It's really funny you mention that mel. I'm suspicious that the naloxone content can vary sometimes between Suboxone batches. I'm also certain that there's more naloxone absorbed in the 8mg tablets than 4 x 2mg tablets.

Hear me out. For ages I've been having 3x2mg morning, 3x2mg at night. All goes smoothly. On the weekend, the new pharmacist decided to dispense me half an 8mg + 1x2mg to make up my 6mg. Anyway, about 10 minutes after I put it in my mouth, I got all goosebumps, eyes watery and ... tearful? I started to cry over absolutely nothing? For me, those are some of my withdrawal symptoms. Then it went away over maybe 20 minutes. I remember that this happened often when I used to take an 8mg tablet in the morning.

I'm convinced I get more of these symptoms with the film, which makes sense given we absorb 20-40% more naloxone in the film than in the tablet. Even though buprenorphine binds tighter than naloxone, they still have very similar affinities, and I'm of the opinion they still can compete over mu-receptors.

indigo. I also have bipolar 1 and addiction issues. Don't let your "conditions" rule your life, or define who you are. Often people with bipolar are extremely high functioning, and live healthy happy lives, as long as they steer clear of drug abuse and keep themselves treated. I've found that as long as my mood-stabilisers are maintained, my depression doesn't dip low enough to require anti-depressants.

And that "feeling", that buzz you speak of, is an illusion. If the opioid high truly made people feel good, then why do all the junkies look miserable?


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 Post subject: kinda agree
PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 6:51 am 
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indigo. I also have bipolar 1 and addiction issues. Don't let your "conditions" rule your life, or define who you are. Often people with bipolar are extremely high functioning, and live healthy happy lives, as long as they steer clear of drug abuse and keep themselves treated. I've found that as long as my mood-stabilisers are maintained, my depression doesn't dip low enough to require anti-depressants.

And that "feeling", that buzz you speak of, is an illusion. If the opioid high truly made people feel good, then why do all the junkies look miserable?[/quote]

I agree to an extent. Normally, I don't use an anti-depressant...just lamictal, gabapentin, klonopin 1mg prn (rarely take it)
This wellbutrin is kind of experiment. I get very depressed in the winter and have been in a deep depressive state( I'd much rather be manic). I know mania causes brain damage and sucks but if I had to pick.

I just wish I felt open enough where I could tell people: I had an awful, debilitating drug problem for 10 years. now it's under control. its just as bad as cancer so give me a fucking break instead of that 'junky' look! I do want to hold my head up high and say it

the more I think, I want to go into the recovery feild. I always wanted a job that impacted peoples lives' and this could be it...I have a PHD and several years of junky residency to fill the requirements...this is something I'm going to look into, but I need something real- I have to make a living and I cant live off a social workers salary. I will have to finish my degree and get a masters in a designated feild...an interventionist would be a kick-ass job!


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:03 am 
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Tear it was like a "dirty" hit of speed, Now that you say that I'm concerned about it. Of course when it happened it concerned me, the lady with me said my face turned beet red. I was seriously speeding bad. I have not felt it since but now thinking about it this is like the 3rd time this has happened to me. 1st time I called my mother over it scared me so bad. I've never felt that why with Wds. I thought it was just a strong dose, real strong.

Indio, I understand wanting to yell it out, without being ashamed. I know people look down at us and our addiction. I often think it is the same as an over weight person eating because they are stressed or bored. Or alot of other addictions, why do we have to be so ashamed of ours. When you go to see a doctor and they look at us "with the look" of course what do we expect the rest of the world to think???
Mel :wink:

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 Post subject: Cravings
PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:30 am 
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I found myself in craving mode by taking care of someone in Hospice. OMG Morphine was on my mind non-stop. I am truly interested in knowing for sure if I were on a stable dose could I or would I truly not be affected by cravings when it is right there in front of my face? My drug of choise is Opana, dilaudid, fentnyl etc...altho any opiate would do when these were unobtainable. I do pretty good on a daily basis of not craving all the time since I have been on MMT but when under strss or I know it's around etc....I WANT TO USE at that moment. Will I one day be free of this? I see a pharmacy bag I want to know what's in it. I hear the sound of a pill bottle in the bottom of a friends purse I gotta know. on and on and on it's gotta give somewhere sometime. I am not strong enough to be faced with this the rest of my life or I will indeed find myself in that one time too many positions where I just give in. I did in June of this year. I used one day and only one time, but I may have more if I didn't get popped the very next day at the clinic with a drug test and I admitted it in fear of losing my takehomes and and/or level. I am not sure the line drawn for posting and what maybe I shouldn't share but I will try to be careful not to say anything to endanger anyone's sobriety or recovery. Maybe I should not have mentioned the drugs I prefer let me know and I will refrain from calling drug names out in post etc... I am enjoying this site Thanking all who post for providing us MMTer's a place to vent.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2011 2:33 pm 
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I wonder sometimes if bup/methadone really work for cravings. Or do doctors just try really really hard to instill this in our brains which produces a placebo effect that it will decrese our cravings. I mean i have been clean for five years over those years i was either on subs or mdone, i still have cravings all the time. Say im having bad cravings and take my dose during this they dont just go away cause i took 170mgs of methadone.

Just venting long day just stressed with the cold weather and my pain im craving right now and i took my dose a hour or two ago.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2011 2:50 pm 
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Quote:
Say im having bad cravings and take my dose during this...


By having the craving and then taking the dose, you are reinforcing the stimulus reward cycle which IS active addiction. There are pathways in the brain involved in stimulus/reward and it's something that needs to be addressed in recovery. I suck at explaining it but Diary of a Quitter is excellent at it. With any luck she'll see this and explain it.

If I were you, I'd avoid dosing at times when you're craving.

As for if bupe/methadone work, they work in that they are occupying those receptors so as far as the brain is concerned it already has the opiates it's used to having, so it has no need to look for it or 'crave' it. I call those "physical" cravings. When a person is on an adequate dose of their maintenance med, then any cravings leftover I call "psychological" cravings. In other words, they aren't related to whether or not the brain/body NEEDS the opiate or not. It's more the mental or psychological side of addiction showing through. That's where other types of treatment would come into play during recovery. This is just the way I see it.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2011 3:37 pm 
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Yea hat i didnt mean it like that, sorry if it sounded that way i cant just take my dose when i want bc of the clinic hours. I meant more so if im having a bad morning pain wise and im having cravings that day before i get to the clinic. Once i take my dose the cravings just dont go away is what i meant.

My meds have never helped my cravings really cause my pain. What ive learned in groups and counseling is what does it for me. For ex i take my dog for walks, or i call my gf or mom, or stop and talk to my counselor at the meth clinic before i dose. Thats one real nice thing about a clinic setting your counselor is always in the building one knock away.

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 Post subject: weird
PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:52 pm 
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I just looked at this thread and read the post. I follow this thread all the time since I started it....like hat said, I must be having psycological cravings. Physical cravings would be quite obvious. Hell, I got methadone coming out my ears right now (figuratively speaking). I would love to be hooked up to a IV of dilaudid HP 10mg/ml every 2(?) hrs. that should do the trick! I feel like being in the hospital (nothing really wrong with me) only to be pampered by nurses at my beck and call; button to push so the IV of precious dilaudid pumps another 10mgs whenever I want.

This has to be some-kind of physical phenom, because I'm not in pain (currently), receptors occupied, and tolerent. I guess that's the addiction?...but as addiction is defined: I'm not going out of my way risking everything, comprimising my life for that 'hospital dream' that i was just speaking of.....maybe because it's (addiction) isn't active...thank God for bupe/done

damn, it's just nice to know I'm not completely alone. Some of you are the only ones that would understand why on earth I would want to be in the hospital- WITH NOTHING WRONG haha :lol: It has to do with the damaged neuro pathways- who knows... I'm not a shrink, scientist, brain surgeon....but before I die, I wish someone would figure that out...and world peace


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2011 1:01 am 
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You are definitely not alone. I can understand your feelings of the hospital. I have spent many hours in E.R. hospital rooms. Why, Drugs and because well I guess I think I kind of like all the attention you get also from the doctors and nurses. Just like you said, to have nurses waiting on you and people looking in after you etc.

I often wonder if my addiction also had anything to do with that Munchausen syndrome. I looked it up and this is what if found out about Munchausen

Munchausen syndrome is a psychiatric factitious disorder wherein those affected feign disease, illness, or psychological trauma to draw attention or sympathy to themselves. It is also sometimes known as hospital addiction syndrome or hospital hopper syndrome

I don’t know if anyone else can relate to this or not but besides the HIGH that I would get from chasing my D.O.C. I got a rush from the whole getting one over the doc kind of thing. Like when I would get a script when there was absolutely nothing wrong with me. I kind of liked that I could do it, and then of course the payoff… my D.O.C.

So am I crazy, LOL or am I just being Machiavellian. Maybe a little of both.


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 Post subject: makes
PostPosted: Sun Dec 18, 2011 5:46 am 
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makes sence to me...I didn't know there was a 'name'...I learn something everyday...you just better make sure you have damn good insurance :lol:


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