It is currently Tue Aug 22, 2017 11:05 am



All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Our Sponsors





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 7 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Can't find a stable dose
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2011 12:45 am 
Offline
3 Months or More
3 Months or More
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 3:35 am
Posts: 91
Ok, Anita here again. So, if you recall, my husband was diagnosed with cancer 3 weeks after I started suboxone. I was on long acting but low dose opiates for pain and tapered off those to nothing, and then went on Suboxone. My dr. tried to keep me at a very low dose, use clonidine even , cuz I tend to have problems with my gut if I raise the dose but we have that figured out. So, the symptoms that I am still struggling with are these: inbetween doses I get shakey, sweaty, BP goes up a bad tremor internally, and my ears ring and my vision gets blurry. When I take a dose, about an hour, most symptoms resolve but the tremor stays in the background. That was the first thing I noticed long ago when I was on opiates, that my tolerance was developing. I mean the tremor and tinnitus were signs of w/d. So, now I am on more. I have increased to 8 mg possibly up to 10 mg if needed. MY dr. wants to try to get the symptoms to turn off. I've been on Suboxone since July. He thinks I've been dosed to low and haven't achieved good maintenance. The think I notice now is that I have less symptoms that I described above, but I feel totally stoned , I get blurry vision, and then I still get the tinnitus , shaking between doses. I'm dosing 3x a day. This is really frustrating. Has anyone else experienced this before ? I am at the point where when my husband gets better, I'm thinking I should just go into a detox program and get off the old fashioned way. These symptoms are identical to how I felt when I went cold turkey once off opiates- i got bad bad shaking, ringing in ears and a internal tremor- feels like a jackhammer banging in your bones. Any advice would be appreciated. Do some people just not work well with Suboxone ? As in can you flunk suboxone treatment ?
Anita

_________________
Live like you mean it !


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2011 5:38 am 
Offline
Super-Duper Poster
Super-Duper Poster
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 7:57 pm
Posts: 311
Anita wrote:
Ok, Anita here again. So, if you recall, my husband was diagnosed with cancer 3 weeks after I started suboxone. I was on long acting but low dose opiates for pain and tapered off those to nothing, and then went on Suboxone. My dr. tried to keep me at a very low dose, use clonidine even , cuz I tend to have problems with my gut if I raise the dose but we have that figured out. So, the symptoms that I am still struggling with are these: inbetween doses I get shakey, sweaty, BP goes up a bad tremor internally, and my ears ring and my vision gets blurry. When I take a dose, about an hour, most symptoms resolve but the tremor stays in the background. That was the first thing I noticed long ago when I was on opiates, that my tolerance was developing. I mean the tremor and tinnitus were signs of w/d. So, now I am on more. I have increased to 8 mg possibly up to 10 mg if needed. MY dr. wants to try to get the symptoms to turn off. I've been on Suboxone since July. He thinks I've been dosed to low and haven't achieved good maintenance. The think I notice now is that I have less symptoms that I described above, but I feel totally stoned , I get blurry vision, and then I still get the tinnitus , shaking between doses. I'm dosing 3x a day. This is really frustrating. Has anyone else experienced this before ? I am at the point where when my husband gets better, I'm thinking I should just go into a detox program and get off the old fashioned way. These symptoms are identical to how I felt when I went cold turkey once off opiates- i got bad bad shaking, ringing in ears and a internal tremor- feels like a jackhammer banging in your bones. Any advice would be appreciated. Do some people just not work well with Suboxone ? As in can you flunk suboxone treatment ?
Anita



TO ANITA: I hate to say this but maybe you are still not on a high enough dose? You say your symptoms feel just like withdrawal symptoms from opiates in the past? I know 8 mg is a good stable dose but you could try more for a time and see if the stoned feeling and blurry vision wear off. I really don't know what else to tell you and I am sorry sub is not working for you the way it should. I am on subutex and it made all the difference. Maybe you should change from suboxone to subutex?...just a thought...good luck to you..............Judy


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2011 8:23 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Apr 29, 2009 12:55 pm
Posts: 4933
Location: Leesburg, FL
Honestly, Anita, I'm really having trouble making sense of this. Even Dr. Junig says that if one is not at the exact right dose (tolerance conversion-wise) when starting sub, that one should stabilize to their sub dose within DAYS, not weeks and not months. So even if you were on too low of a dose to start out, you should have easily stabilized by now - according to reading Dr. J's posts.

If I recall correctly, Anita, your tolerance was never that high to begin with and that's why you started sub at such a low dose - is that right?

It IS possible that for whatever reason, you're just not suitable for suboxone treatment. I recall one or two other people on this forum that also weren't a good fit. It's not common, but it does happen, as it can with other medications.

You were only dependent on opiates, right? Never an addict? But were you ever able to taper off full opiate agonists?

Let me/us know if I'm remembering your history correctly or if you can offer more info.

_________________
-As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.


Top
 Profile  
 
Our Sponsors
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2011 8:25 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 15, 2010 5:08 am
Posts: 1503
Anita wrote:
Ok, Anita here again. So, if you recall, my husband was diagnosed with cancer 3 weeks after I started suboxone. I was on long acting but low dose opiates for pain and tapered off those to nothing, and then went on Suboxone. My dr. tried to keep me at a very low dose, use clonidine even , cuz I tend to have problems with my gut if I raise the dose but we have that figured out. So, the symptoms that I am still struggling with are these: inbetween doses I get shakey, sweaty, BP goes up a bad tremor internally, and my ears ring and my vision gets blurry. When I take a dose, about an hour, most symptoms resolve but the tremor stays in the background. That was the first thing I noticed long ago when I was on opiates, that my tolerance was developing. I mean the tremor and tinnitus were signs of w/d. So, now I am on more. I have increased to 8 mg possibly up to 10 mg if needed. MY dr. wants to try to get the symptoms to turn off. I've been on Suboxone since July. He thinks I've been dosed to low and haven't achieved good maintenance. The think I notice now is that I have less symptoms that I described above, but I feel totally stoned , I get blurry vision, and then I still get the tinnitus , shaking between doses. I'm dosing 3x a day. This is really frustrating. Has anyone else experienced this before ? I am at the point where when my husband gets better, I'm thinking I should just go into a detox program and get off the old fashioned way. These symptoms are identical to how I felt when I went cold turkey once off opiates- i got bad bad shaking, ringing in ears and a internal tremor- feels like a jackhammer banging in your bones. Any advice would be appreciated. Do some people just not work well with Suboxone ? As in can you flunk suboxone treatment ?
Anita


Hey Anita.

Really sorry to hear about your husband. I hope he pulls through, for both of you.

It is quite common to feel a bit "stoned" sometimes on Suboxone before we stabilise on a new dose. For me, if my dose has been increased, I may feel mildly stoned for a few days. The reason my dose was increased in the past is because, like you, I was starting to get mild withdrawals when it was nearly time to dose again.

I'm no doctor, but I can guarantee that you will eventually adjust to your new dose, but how long it will take, I don't know. But if you feel really stoned, to the point where you look sedated, or feel it's unsafe to drive, I'd definitely suggest your dose is too high, and you should see your doc soon to find a happy medium.

I noticed you were talking about tinnitus. I got this effect when I first switched to film actually. All the effects you mention, the feeling of jackhammering, the tinnitus, the shaking, all sounds like what I felt when I first switched to the Film. If you are taking the film, is it possible you can try the tablet and see if it helps? Apparently we absorb less naloxone in the tablet. If you still struggle on the Suboxone tablets, then maybe Slipper's suggestion of Subutex would work. Subutex contains no naloxone, the other drug in Suboxone which can cause issues in some people.

Good luck.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2011 10:31 am 
Offline
Long Time Member
Long Time Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jul 21, 2011 10:43 am
Posts: 893
Location: AZ
I too had tinnitus quite bad while on sub. My Dr switched me to generic subutex 2 months ago and a few days after the switch it was completely gone. I think naloxone affects some of us more than others and trying generic subutex might help you too.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: IMO
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:31 am 
Offline
Power Poster
Power Poster

Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2011 3:49 pm
Posts: 42
Location: Canada
Hi Anita,
I can relate and sympathize with what you are going through. I'm sorry this road has not been as easy for you as it for most.
In my, and only my opinion, I think you might be on too high a dose. Your symptoms sound 100% of what my symptoms were like when I was using opiates and took too much. Seriously every single thing you describing I went through if I used too many times in the day or took more than, way more....than I should have.
Have you tried only dosing once a day, or only dosing when you feel you need to? There is a big difference between dependance and addiction, and from the sounds of it you were dependent, which IMO should only be addressed when your body tell you it's time. You need to listen to your body, even if it might not jive 100% with what your dr. Recommends.
Ask yourself what YOU feel the issue is. Reading your post it seems that you too think yours dose is too high. Please correct me if I am wrong and please keep us all posted.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: more info on dose etc
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2011 4:20 pm 
Offline
3 Months or More
3 Months or More
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 3:35 am
Posts: 91
Thanks so much for your thoughts. Yes, I was on a very low dose of opiates, MS Contin 40 mg a day, then a brief time on Methadone, only 5 mg tid and had some of these same symptoms, and I was tolerant and that's why I wanted to go off them altogether. So, some of the symptoms I have are the same as back then just more intense. What I am finding is that some of those symptoms are lessening as I increase , yet some may be adverse effects. Either way I am miserable, but I think we are all afraid to make big changes right now. I am working with my dr. but it's a bit discouraging. My feeling is that with the subox I just don't tolerate it, like I just don't tolerate the full agonists. The info on subutex is interesting. I just appreciate the support here, and who knows.. maybe we'll find an answer down the road. Thanks again,
Anita

_________________
Live like you mean it !


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 7 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Our Sponsors
Suboxone Forum latest topics RSS feed Subscribe to the entire forum
 

 

 
Fond Du Lac Psychiatry
Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

  • Board Certified Psychiatrist
  • Asst Clinical Professor, Medical College of Wisconsin

Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group