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PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 4:01 pm 
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There is so much stigma with buprenorphine that has contributed to the views of society about this drug. I have 25 years of experience with opiate addiction. I was on methadone for 5 years. My whole family can attest to the fact that during this time that drive to chase the dragon was still active in me. I was still wanting more and more. When it comes to detoxing from this drug I couldn't find anywhere that would take me cause it was methadone. I finally found a place that was 8 hours away from me. I went there. I can not express enough how different and severe methadone withdrawals are compared to all other opiates. I had a stroke and had to have physical therapy to learn how to use my right arm again. It was a living nightmare in hell. It took 4 months of inpatient treatment including ICU to get me stable enough to come home. For someone like me that has been an addict for 25 years there are other contributing factors that must be considered in my treatment. There's more irreversible damage that needs to be considered. Plus I became an addict as a result of prescribed opiates given to me by a doctor due to over 10 surgeries I had from the time I was 13 until 19. These were during a time when my brain was still developing. The odds are really against someone in my position. Imo buprenorphine has no business beside the word methadone. Thats causing stigma. The two drugs are entirely different. Why can't I have 8 mg of buprenorphine everyday for the rest of my life? I am not abusing it. I will be under a doctors care. Why can't I have the medicine thats keeps me from being sick from my disease just like people on thyroid medicine for their disease? What's the difference? I can't help that other people are shooting buprenorphrine into their veins or that it is still sold on the streets. Some people are also injecting vodka into their veins. I am not doing any of these things. I refused to consider myself "still dirty" or "still dependent" just because I am on a medicine that keeps my disease from making me sick. Why aren't diabetics considered addicts because they depend are their insulin? I am sick of a society thats been conformed by stigma. Don't tell me that I have to accept that are system is so flawed. Who is going to change this? What can we do to make that happen?


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 8:40 pm 
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Hey This..

I feel your pain and hurt with Stigma. .it is attached to all of us. Those in recovery do feel it. Ive delt with it the only way I know how now.
I stood up. I told and tried to educate the people around me including drs in the profession, the caseworkers the therapist that I know and the sub drs I know.
Most can not understand im afraid. They do hear me. Im older and ive put 5 years of this togather in my life. So my answer to this is what ive told others in the two clinic im associated with and that is im a person first. One of lougterm recovery who works on my self, my health, my work, my community and my purpose in life. All the while having faith that it ll be alright if i do the next right thing as they say in thoses 12 step meetings.
Im sorry your having such a tuff ruff time with this flawed system. It blows my mind everytime I hear of this in town or see it on this forum.
If healthcare pros in this field had Any Idea what withdraw was they would change there tune. The fact is having spoken to many of them I can not make it clear enough. .
Only a true opiate addict knows. This is why I follow Dr Jeff Junig in everything Buprenorphine. If you go to the Talkzone and read you ll see what I mean. Hes had his fights with this disease and quite frankly seems to be the only dr I know who knows his Shit!!! Look for a post or two about stigma from him.

It seemed to me in early recovery that I was behind the 8 ball so to speak. Or that people in traditional recovery stigmatized me (us) just for being on the lifesaving med that works! "Easy way out" some of them smerked.. well im proud of all of Us damn it.
I will speak out ever chance i get today. Fact is ill be doing it tomarrow.

They call it a disease , it is. But for some dumb reason we take it on the chin just because we are addicts.
With this pandemic crossing this country more people are seeing that it can happen to anyone . This will bring more understanding. But it is slow going thats for sure.

Many new books. The movie, The Anonymous People will open you eyes, take a look at it. Your not alone This, I just pray you find your way back to an understanding dr in the only system we have right now.

Keep posting man...this is just my 2 cents this evening...

Razor R...


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 9:12 pm 
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I can't tell you how much I am right there with you! And thank you, by the way, for giving us the straight up version of your story. Satire is a lot of fun, but we are better able to give you the support you need and deserve when we know the problems you are facing.

You are 100% correct that recovering opiate addicts don't deserve stigma and condescension. Pharmacists, and other professionals should be patting us on the back for making the decision to get into recovery with buprenorphine!

I don't have an opinion on whether methadone and suboxone belong in the same category or not. I've never taken it and I do have one friend who is on it and doing very well. He broke his back and other body parts in a motorcycle accident and will have chronic pain for the rest of his life.

You have been through the ringer!! Not only having been hooked on opiates from surgeries at a young age, but having been through a stroke and the slow healing process that comes with it, to losing your suboxone doctor for reasons that I don't know. From what you said in your other thread you are on 4 medications that are difficult to get off of and only have 4 days of meds left before you will be on your own and detoxing, unless you can find another doctor.

One suggestion we usually make here is that you call local pharmacies and ask the pharmacists or techs who is prescribing suboxone in the area. They may or may not choose to answer your question, but it doesn't hurt to try. Include psychiatrists in your search efforts. Call everyone and everywhere to find a new doctor!

I am planning to do something about the stigma of opiate addiction and buprenorphine treatment. I am in a masters program and I'm earning a Masters in Addiction Studies in the next couple of years. I already advocate for buprenorphine treatment among my classmates and professors. I plan to write articles advocating for us addicts. Someday I hope to be in the position of writing policy at a governmental level. I proudly tell people that I'm a recovering opiate addict on sub. I watch as they make an adjustment in their thinking. If there are enough of us who open our mouths about our addiction, the number of people who are ignorant will shrink.

I certainly hope that you will find a way to improve your situation and that you can gain enough stability in your life that you can find work that will be fulfilling and pays the bills. Maybe you can tell us which medications you're on besides buprenorphine. Let us know if there is information we can help you with. Welcome to the forum!

Amy

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 15, 2015 10:08 pm 
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Thank you Razor55 for investing your time into my situation. Thank you for the advice. This feels very nice.

Amy I just took a jump and made a word press blog and site called buprenorphineforlife. I took what I just posted and added some things to it. I am not sure if I am allowed to tell this here. If I am not just remove it lol. I actually have no idea about how I have set it up and my first blog I added lol. I would love for someone like you to jump on board with me and push this issue any way we can. I don't have any college education but I am considered a genius intellectually if that counts any lol There's another issue with the stigma of having a high IQ also. People relate that to success when it actually hurts you more than it helps you. I have all kinds of screenshots of where I have studied the consumers review all the way back to the nineteenth century as far as how the laws where put in place with addicts and drug offenders. It sickens me at all the testimonies that were on our behalf by leading mental medical professors that were ignored. Its like we never had a chance. I am just not ok with this. The ignorance that has been applied to our issue is just outstanding to me. I wanna share my favorite quote with you all. I am sure you've prolly heard it before. .....

"Heres to the crazy ones. The misfits. The rebels. The troublemakers. The round pegs in the square holes. The ones who see things differently.
They're not fond of rules and they have no respect for the status quo. You can quote them, disagree with them, glorify or vilify them. About the only thing you cant do is ignore them.
Because they change things. They push the human race forward. And while some may see them as the crazy ones, we see genius. Because the people who are crazy enough to think they can change the world, are the ones who do."


I am tired of being told I am the one wrong. I am tired of being on trial my whole life and having my morality constantly challenged. Lets turn this around. Maybe the others are the ones in the dark. Lets show them the way to the light!


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 3:24 pm 
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We have all faced the stigma of our addiction at one point or another I think. During my active addiction, I lost everything and I literally mean everything including custody of one of my children to my ex husband. I finally found suboxone after trying everything and almost four yrs later I'm in a much better place. But after about a yr being on sub, after my life straightened out, of course I went bk court to get custody bk. Hired my attorney who is my family's attorney btw & he knew how much better I was doing, paid him completely up front 700 dollars. So I went in and explained what I wanted to do and u know what he said? He said, "well u may as well not ask to go in front of the judge asking to restore any custody because the judge won't take u serious if ur taking suboxone". My heart broke into a million pieces. I'd worked so incredibly hard to get my life straightened out, I'd done a complete turnaround and made sure I'd had at least a yr off pills so that I'd be taken serious. That was a spit in the face. He said that it was proven that when ppl go off suboxone they'll relapse and the judge isn't "a fan"! He wanted me to stop sub before I went through with it to prove I really was "better".


I'm not gonna go into the rest for personal reasons and I'm still somewhat in and out of court to this day because of the stupid hypocritical ppl in my community. But the stigma is real and it's flat out wrong. We shouldn't be looked down upon for trying to improve our lives, no matter what route we take to do it. Those ppl have absolutely no idea what it's like, but they sure want to throw their two cents in to shoot us down. I hope nobody has to go through this, but unfortunately it's happening everywhere.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 3:38 pm 
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Ughhh Jenn I actually felt your pain about what you just said over the attorney saying the judge would say that!! My stomach flipped. I know what you mean about when it comes to your babies. I actually advocate a lot for parential alienation too. You all should go put your stories on my blog site. I have been on the phones with SAMHSA and Indivoir the makers of suboxone. I am not going to shut up about it lol I have took the blame long enough. I have tried all other routes. Buprenorphine is my answer and for the sake of the next generation I am gonna do my part to push it. I refuse to let this world imprint me. But I will leave my mark here. There is no reason we shouldn't be able to have this medicine when we are taking it the right way and its serving it's purpose in our lives.

Truth is by nature self evident. As soon as you remove the cobwebs of ignorance that surrounds it...it will shine clear.
--Ghandhi


Last edited by this_is_not_ok on Mon Nov 16, 2015 4:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 4:07 pm 
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You can go ahead and provide a link to your blog in a post. The organization of like minded people can be a powerful force!

Amy

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 6:37 pm 
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ok well its a mess cause the site is so hard to figure out but I have done one before lol

https://buprenorphineforlifeblog.wordpress.com/


if you all see something I need to do let me know or that you think would be important lol


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2015 11:52 am 
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I am gonna tell you all somethiing at this point. I am a christian. I was saved as a little girl. I have always really got it too.. About what Jesus did for me on that cross. Thru this journey of addiction I have always knew the only reason I wasn't dead yet was because God had His hand on me. I have always had a really close personal relationship with Him. Even within the walls of a jail cell I have went on my knees everyday. But people just assumed I wasn't cause I was an addict. Well you all know how people like to use your past against you. No matter what I did everything has always been all my fault. This past two months theres been changes in me that I can't even explain. I always went thru conviction over my sins. But this was like God was trying to tell me something big. I felt so heavy. Well I started just really noticing how the hypocrites were around me. How fake they are even to each other. I have a strong sense of loyalty about me. But its like I just started noticing the immorality in everyone else. It was starting to hit me that maybe it hasn't always been just me. I started asking others what salvation meant to them. It was like they thought they were going to heaven cause they had that worked out like a math problem. I didnt see signs of any real conviction. Well you know how everyone has always brought our mistakes up to us. I got to thinking. Thats made us face our mistakes and own them. Some of the other people that society places on pedastels that go play church every sunday are always praised and built up by others. It's like some of them have been become in denial of their ownself. Also up until this time I had always knew addiction was a disease but I had been led to believe that God would take this from me. But that always left me feeling like I wasnt giving it all up to Him but I really felt like I was. I would pray so hard for Him to take this from me that I have thrown up before. I was stuck on this. Also others made me feel like as long as I was taking suboxone everyday I was still choosing willing to sin. As I started reading scripture and began to study so hard. It was like God was just letting stuff fall into my lap. First of all once you ask God to forgive you in all humbleness that sin is GONE. NEVER TO BE BROUGHT UP AGAIN. He is not keeping them in His back pocket where they are "adding up" against you. But after you sin two things can happen. One is conviction of the Holy Ghost and one is condemnation of the devil. The Holy Spirit wants to convict you which brings you to God in repentance asking for forgiveness. Once you do that the Holy Spirit wants to uplift you and strengthen you bringing you closer to God and further from that sin. The devil will come at you with shame and guilt trying to do the exact opposite. SO AFTER YOU HAVE ASKED FOR FORGIVENESS FROM GOD IN ALL HUMBLENESS YOU ARE FORGIVEN AND ITS GONE.After that point if its brought up to you again its from the devil don't listen to it. Also after I really understood the process of what addiction does to the brain and what parts are really damaged that affect your reasoing and decision making....when people would tell me to rely on my "faith" it left me thinking something was still within me to heal myself actually cause I have been begging God to take this from me the whole time. Which I know He can. God can come in and do anything He wants to anytime He wants. He is God. I have seen Him come into a situation and heal people in an instant. But that doesn't mean thats what He is going to do or is doing with me. And also people's beliefs and what their faith is varies so much now. Plus how is this any different from telling someone with any other disease to just rely on their faith alone to heal them? Which at no time am I saying God can't cause He can but that's His decision. As much as man wants to take from God but yet when it comes to a disease about something they can't quite concept they wanna throw the responsibility back at Him?!?!? Although when it comes to the twelve steps I do believe an important part of healing is realizing God is in control but you do have to give Him control. And it's not in just a "higher being". It has to be God almighty. But also know that 6+3=9 but so does 5+4. The plan He has for you might be different then the plan He has for me. Even in the end if we get the same solution. So I now believe it's unethical to tell someone with a disease to rely on their faith alone to heal them. Also with suboxone I know personally cause I have had true life experience with all opiates besides heroin. By the time you get to my point in the game of addiction it's not about getting high anymore. I havent been high in 15 years. Well except for a few weeks I have lost with xanax at few times yearsssssss ago lol. Even my mother can attest to the fact that the drive for more and more is not in me with suboxone. It just keeps me from being sick. I don't know about how it is if you abuse it or shoot it into your veins. But like I said kids are shooting vodka into their veins to get now. But I am not. I also have seen really young people getting high off of suboxone. If suboxone gets you high then you aint got no business into this advancement of treatment. You must be still on darvocet. I graduated from that and got on roxys over 15 years ago. Plus if you are that early in addiction theres more of chance for you to reproduce endorphins again. Someone just needs to get you some handcuffs and just lock your butt down somewhere for about 8 to 10 days and save you right now from this road of agony. I wish someone had done that to me when I was still that early into it. Believe me the older you get the harder the withdrawals are on you. Wait until you can look back and see 20 years of your life you wasted to this disease. There isnt anything about this "cool". But I just wanted you all to know that this is where I am coming from and that God is what lead me here. Maybe momma was right after all. They'll be boot leggers in heaven and preachers in hell.


Last edited by this_is_not_ok on Tue Nov 17, 2015 2:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2015 12:35 pm 
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Hi This, I like what you are saying and agree on many levels. I have worked for thirty years combating the stigma that those who have a mental illness face. It has gotten better, but it does still exist! I too am Christian and I can only tell you what works for me. If I am focused on being the best person, the best daughter of God, then I have no time to even notice those who criticize or judge. I keep in the back of my mind that we are all brothers and sisters and that we all make mistakes. I can make my life so much easier by just keeping myself focused on the positive that I am doing. Now, that is much easier said than done! But, it is how I start everyday! I am looking forward to visiting your blog! Have a wonderful day!


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2015 2:30 pm 
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What gets me tho is like the lack of humbleness in other peoples ability to see someone elses point of view. I know one thing this disease has been good about is keeping me humble. I am really quick to pick up on that in my kids. I also want their words to mean something to them. My son who is really young, said the other day "Justin Bieber is on drugs" I stopped him right there. I was like "and how do you know this?" and he said "cause" I asked "cause why?" I just kept pointing his attention on his source. Then I asked him how he knew everything he heard on tv was true. I don't know if Justin Bieber's on drugs or not. My point was I am trying to raise my kids to be careful about what comes out of their mouths. That way they can be accountable for what they say. I want them to care about not being the source of someone elses pain. I have just realized lately that I have always give everybody else more benefit of the doubt then I was ever gave. DCS do't bother me now but I went through a lot with them over other people just assuming. I am just tried of always being the one on trial.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:59 pm 
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You gave you Son the most wonderful advice! So look at it as your role modeling it for him. Meaning, you are not on trial and owe none of those people an explination! Someone gave me really good advice once when I was in a crazy relationship with a guy who liked to play alot of games. She said he can only play games with you if you are in the game! Once I really thought about it, I realized that she was right! You can only be on trial if you give the people the power to put you there. If you ignore it, and live your happy life, they will see that it has no affect on you and they will move on to their next victim. I hope you know that I am sharing from personal experience and only hope that my story can help you. Hope you are having a great night!


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:54 pm 
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well thank you!!I can be real mean tho if I think someone's got ill intentions toward me.....like if someone tried to tell me in a condescending way that I was still considered to be "using" since I was on suboxone I always replied with something like "yeah and at the next dr appt they will be teaching us a class on how to hack into bank accounts" and then just walk off and let them chew on that for a minute lol



if someone's going to be acting stupid...I am gonna treat them stupid lol


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 12:06 am 
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LOL...I hear you! And sometimes I do the same exact thing...on other topics. I am not "out" about my suboxone use. I am so envious of those of you who are. Most, even those closest to me don't know that I ever even had a drug problem. My husband,one close friend, and a nephew are the only people who know. I would not be upset if people found out but I am also not going to put it out there, you know what I mean? Have a good night!


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 12:18 am 
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Giving anyone the benefit of the doubt is one of the hardest things to do, especially when you haven't been the recipient of that benefit yourself. But it's a worthy goal!

I am a preacher's kid (a PK) and the only thing that makes me an expert on is that pastors are just as frail and human as the rest of us. I've learned that the only behavior you can control is your own. It takes enough effort to try to model my life after what Christ tried to teach his followers that I don't have the inclination to judge what others are doing. However, I do struggle when I witness others being judgmental toward their fellow human beings.

I am, admittedly, not always nice. If someone joins the forum to bash sub or our members who are on sub I get pretty feisty. I'm pretty protective of my peeps on the forum who are just trying to live their lives in the recovery that sub provides. Sometimes I feel like if we're not protective of our fellow sub users, who will be?

I would suggest that you go to the National Institute on Drug Abuse to come up with some really great ammunition. http://www.drugabuse.gov/ And by ammunition I mean that you should hit them with your smarts. If people are being mean to you I wouldn't feel bad about using sarcasm. However, if they are just ignorant, be ready to give them some facts about what opiate addiction does to the brain. The more we can inform people of the truth the larger the circle of knowledge will spread. :)

Amy

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 18, 2015 10:14 am 
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You are so right Amy! Knowledge is power! Have a wonderful day all!


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