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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:30 pm 
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Wow...am I ever feeling better! I have been on 2 mgs/day since 6/29. The first week was a little rough but each day gets better and better at this point.

I was going to continue my drop mid-July but I have felt so yucky for months dropping at a pretty quick clip. It is so nice to feel the most normal I have in a long time. I think I am going to sit here for a bit and let my body/brain rest for a bit from this taper. I'll start my taper again on Aug 1. I have come a long, long way in a short period of time...it's ok to take a break! Also, I know that some of the hardest work could come at under 2 mgs....I think it's wise to pause, take a break and get strong for the last leg of this journey.

I want anyone to know that is going through depression as part of a Sub taper or jump that it DOES GET BETTER. 2 weeks ago, I could barely get out of bed...the sadness, despair were not fun. I kept telling myself that it was all chemical and my awesome husband would remind me of that too. Otherwise, I might have jumped on the antidepressants.
I didn't just lie there and wait to feel better. I would make myself walk, and get out in a crowd (a mall or movie). Also, I watched lots of funny videos and music videos (lots of old ones from my younger years in the 70s and 80s :) They would always make me smile. Oh, and I also ate some dark chocolate everyday (supposed to help with dopamine).
Lastly, when I felt like crying, I would get by myself and let it out...just sob and sob. I always felt better after a good cry. We don't have to hold it in.

Just my mid-month update...I am so proud to be at the 2 mg mark. What a journey!


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2011 4:09 pm 
Hey Aqua! I'm glad you're feeling so much better and glad you've gotten down to a low enough dose that you can feel good about taking a little break from the tapering.
I'm at about the same spot as you....on 2mg/day for a couple of weeks now and feeling quite good. I had taken my dose way back to 16-24mg/day back in mid May due to a brief lapse with oxy. I started counselling shortly thereafter and was able to get my dose on down to the 2mg/day in about 10 weeks time. Personally, I've never experienced anything worse than some very annoying sweats, yawns, runny nose and mild anxiety any time that I have tapered quickly to 2mg/day. So like you, I realize that the harder part is yet to come. However.....I am NOT expecting it to be terrible. I am expecting myself to be one of the ones who tapers the rest of the way off with very mimimal symptoms. Reasons being....I will do it slowly, and I will be sure the timing is right before attempting my final taper.
I have a big vacation coming up, starting tomorrow, which I plan to enjoy thoroughly as well as do some 'work' recommended by my therapist while I'm there. Therefore, I will likely stay at the 2mg/day like you, until the first of August or so. And God willing, I'll begin to taper more at that time, be at 1mg/day by September and then (again, God willing) finish up in the microgram doses sometime over the winter or early spring.
Anyway, glad you're feeling better! I feel better, in many ways being down around 2mg/day than I ever did at higher doses! It's just that I've got to work harder on my issues with craving at the lower doses. But I'm going to have to learn to do that anyway, because I am certainly not going to be satisified with myself and my recovery until I am off Suboxone. I mean no offense to those who choose otherwise......it's just not for me and I know it.
Keep updating your taper, Aqual! Good job!


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:10 pm 
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OMGosh, we have back to back 2mg'ers. Congratulations to ClearAqua and setmefree for getting to the 2mg mark!!!! You both have come a long way and I'm REAL proud of y'all. You're pushing through your symptoms, understanding that it's your brain doing its thing and I'm so happy for both of you.

ClearAqua, I know, being a guy, I'm not supposed talk about this, but I've never bought into that macho bullshit that comes with being a guy, so here goes......I hear ya on the crying thing. A good bawling session releases TONS and TONS of pent up stress AND it must release some kind of "serenity" chemical into your brain. I don't know of anyone who likes to cry, ESPECIALLY in front of others, but it does seem to do wonders when life's becoming unbearable.

setmefree, you're going on vacation and you didn't invite me??? WTF??? I thought we were cool........I wanna go on vacation too, you know. :cry: Have a GREAT vacation, don't get a sunburn......they suck!!!

Congrats again ladies!!

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 11:18 am 
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Aqua, you deserve huge kudos. Your taper has been pretty incredible. You've gone so quickly and been so dedicated and regimented. From 24 to 2 mg since....wasn't it February? Girl, I am still not done and I started from 8 in October. Sheesh, I'm such a wimp, lol. At least I own it.

I think it's very smart to take a break. Everyone gets burned out and I think your body needs to catch up. I am nearly positive that if you take a good, long break before continuing, it will be way easier for you to go further. Best of all, the emotional stuff may quit bugging you. I know I've gone slowly, but I'm not having any sobbing either. So, I guess it's worth it. I'm not at all convinced that there's a way to short cut through Sub detox. I cannot imagine going as fast as you've gone. It's pretty remarkable and you deserve a break. :D You used to take twelve times this much only five months ago. Crazy.....

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 Post subject: Hi Aqua
PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 9:06 pm 
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I to am down to 2mg's myself..I am having the exact same feelings as you,Romeo stated there are 2 people at 2mg's together I would love to be 3.I simply need support and would love to know how you 2 are doing,at this moment I for get the 2nd persons name,please forgive me,its important!I feel like the nerd trying to fit in..but no one else understands.My doc.said jump now and I will give you some clonidine.I tried to explain to him more about suboxone and what I have learned..he looked at me like:silly little girl" As for my family everything revolves around when I get off suboxone! everything!kinda like we will deal with that after you taper is done.And any valid emotion or complaint I have,that is really logical,my husband dismisses due to the suboxone! Here is what I am experiencing since down to 2mg's.Tired! cranky,aggravated by everyone over petty nothings,craving sweets and an obsession about finally getting off this stuff.And a huge fear of PAWS depression..I get it real bad.Ladder tripper! thats it...she is a great inspiration for me as well.BTW my doc.stopped my concerta just like that! she looked in the chart,like she cant believe she ever prescribed it!To many controlled sobstances she said.OK I get the concern,but does that mean My a.d.d is just forgotten,makes me think she gave it to me without believing the dx.I dont know,but my work will surely suffer.She gave me neurontin 300mg bid,any feedback on anything at all is appreciated.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 16, 2011 1:59 am 
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Hi hopewins,

The second person I was talking about is setmefree. She posted right after ClearAqua. So, it would seem that we have a trifecta of 2mg'ers now that hopewins has joined the club too!!!!

Hopewins, you are TOO funny!! You said you feel like the nerd who is trying to fit in......that's been me my whole life!!!! Honestly, you're doing just fine.

Ummm, my doctor told me I could jump from 2mg and that I'd only experience 3 days of withdrawal, I laughed so hard when she said that I almost went pee in my pants!!! I knew she was completely out to lunch. Don't jump from 2mg unless you absolutely can't taper any lower. Trust me, jumping off Suboxone at too high of a dose is NOT fun.....not fun at all!!!

All of the symptoms you described for where you're at are perfectly normal. Try not to let them stress you out. Everytime you taper lower, your brain has to adjust to having less opiates being fed to it and it produces the symptoms you're experiencing......it's your brains way of saying, "hey, I need more opiates here dude.....can you help a brotha out....NEED OPIATES!!!", but you have to ignore your brain while it's begging you to feed it opiates. Eventually, it'll start producing its own natural opiates again, but right now it would rather be lazy and have you feed it some external opiates.

Keep hanging in there, you guys are all doing great!!!

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 2:04 pm 
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A big HI and Happy Labor Day to my old friends here :)

Just updating my taper journal...it's been a while (which is a good thing!)

I think last time I posted I had made it down to 2 mgs/day. I stayed there until the end of July..I couldn't shake some pretty icky depression and anxiety and on my doctor's advice, went back up to 2.5 mgs day, where I have been ever since.

By mid-August, it was almost like a miracle..I started feeling so much better...the depression was lifting, the anxiety leaving. Just saw my doc last week and he wants me to stay at 2.5 another month before we begin a very slow descent again.

The way my doctor explained it, I had dropped so fast and my poor brain never had a chance to adjust inbetween my drops. Those of you who have known me since the beginning on here will smile because I was so impatient and was going to come off Sub at record speed! All I did was make myself pretty sick. It has taken me months (almost 5 months) to come back to a semblence of normal. I am very, very proud of myself for making it without anything...just sheer will.
I have learned the most important lesson about being on Subs....when ready to taper...slow and steady wins the race.

I did not taper the right way and paid the price but am happy to report that you DO rebound from the anxiety and depression. Time is a great healer with our brain. My doctor says I will be off Subs one day but it will realistically probably be another year to come down as comfortably as possible from 2.5 mgs. I am finally OK with that :)

Oct 6, we will begin the next drop which will be 2 mgs and 2.5 mgs every other day, then 2 months of 2 mgs, then one month of 1.5 and 2 every other day. We're going to go very slow as my trip from 24 mgs/day to this point was fairly rough. I'm really happy to be buying the 2 mgs strips now which makes it so much easier to taper than cutting 8 mg strips or tabs.

Just wanted to say hi and that I'm doing really well, mentally & emotionally. Very rough ride there from April through end of July. Do not try and come off this medication too fast....slow and disciplined is best.

Hope everyone is doing well! I don't hang out a lot as for me, it's better to keep my mind off the taper as much as I can....trying to not think about it much, just doing it (if that makes sense).
xxxoooo


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 2:36 pm 
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Hi Aqua i read your taper thread-WOW.
CONGRATS!
I am at 1.5/2 every other day right now, i will stay at 1.5 friday for about 2 weeks then drop to 1mg.
the depression is terrible. i have a thread DEPRESSION HELL in side effects if youd like to share.
much love!


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 11:51 pm 
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ClearAqua,

Are you ever a sight for sore eyes!! We've missed you!!

Thanks so much for coming back and updating us and I'm so happy that you have found YOUR pace for coming off of Suboxone. I'm proud of ya!!

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 9:52 am 
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Hey, Aqua! So happy to hear from you. Sheesh, I guess I get a bit attached to the nice folks here on the forum, because I was really worried about you. I knew you'd been struggling with the nasty mental parts of it and then you fell off the planet. Um, scary!! :shock: You only crossed my thoughts about three hundred times. I did kinda figure you just hit a very, very rough patch and needed to get away from focusing on tapering too much, and it sounds like that's what happened.

Girl, I'm here anytime for you and for whatever you need to talk about. I know how hard this can be. It has taken me way longer than I expected it would. I'm still not done. Please know that nobody on here has any expectations of you to get off Suboxone in any certain time frame. You were going too fast. Bottom line! Good for you for woman-ing up and accepting the need to take a break and take care of yourself. You know what says about you? That says that you will be successful in the end.

Welcome back, sweetie.

laddertipper (1/16-1/8 -mg/day)

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 11:00 am 
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jenzo - I will read your depression thread and I'll let you knw what I think! I suffered from some pretty harrowing times this summer and still, it comes and goes but the good news is it is going with much more frequency! I feel more "normal" than I have since I started tapering.

romeo - I will always come back! Especially once I am off Sub for good, I would like to help others. I needed to take a break from thinking abou the taper all the time and that meant a break from the site :) Yes, I have found my pace and it is very slow from here on out. I will be where you are someday!

ladder - I hit some very rough places this summer. The depression/melancholy (whatever you want to call it) really hit me hard starting about mid-May and lasted until the first week of August or so. I don't know when it began to lift....I just noticed day to day that I was doing better, feeling more like my old self and the important part....finding joy and happiness in life again. My doctor had a name for what I went through...it's when you cease to find joy or happy in anything....but I don't remember the psychiatric term! I kept telling myself that it was my brain coming off years of high opiate usage.
I have learned my lesson about dealing with Sub and tapering. I could not WILL myself off of it..I could not WILL my brain not to suffer depression and w/d. It all happened and I learned from it. It is what it is and I've just got to take my time.
How are you doing..still at .5 or have you been able to drop further? Same here...if you need to talk, just pm me!


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 12:12 pm 
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ClearAqua wrote:
jenzo - I will read your depression thread and I'll let you knw what I think! I suffered from some pretty harrowing times this summer and still, it comes and goes but the good news is it is going with much more frequency! I feel more "normal" than I have since I started tapering.

romeo - I will always come back! Especially once I am off Sub for good, I would like to help others. I needed to take a break from thinking abou the taper all the time and that meant a break from the site :) Yes, I have found my pace and it is very slow from here on out. I will be where you are someday!

ladder - I hit some very rough places this summer. The depression/melancholy (whatever you want to call it) really hit me hard starting about mid-May and lasted until the first week of August or so. I don't know when it began to lift....I just noticed day to day that I was doing better, feeling more like my old self and the important part....finding joy and happiness in life again. My doctor had a name for what I went through...it's when you cease to find joy or happy in anything....but I don't remember the psychiatric term! I kept telling myself that it was my brain coming off years of high opiate usage.
I have learned my lesson about dealing with Sub and tapering. I could not WILL myself off of it..I could not WILL my brain not to suffer depression and w/d. It all happened and I learned from it. It is what it is and I've just got to take my time.
How are you doing..still at .5 or have you been able to drop further? Same here...if you need to talk, just pm me!


That is so true about not being able to will yourself through it. It goes at its own pace and you cannot plan and control how your taper will go. You can only maximize your chances by taking good care of yourself and accepting it when it is too much/too soon.

You know, I went through a long period of feeling so icky too. It was around 1 mg, but it took me forever to pull out of it. It was physical and very largely mental too. When it got severe, I actually went up a little, like you, and that helped. I really resigned myself to this process and decided to take my time and not punish myself physically and emotionally by going too fast. Since that nastiness lifted, it's been so much easier. I got to .5 and kept going to .375, .3125, .25, .1875, .125. Not only did I drop in small increments, but I even alternated between the two doses before committing to the smaller one. Have I felt it to a degree? Yes. Has it been bad? Not at all. I really want to stop Sub, so I trust myself to only take what I truly need. Now, I'm alternating between .125 and .0625 and can see the light at the end. I am not going to ever jump. I am going to step off gracefully. I'm not convinced that is not possible.

Who cares how long this takes as long as you are living your life to the fullest in the meanwhile? When I was feeling like dog poop, I didn't want to do anything. That is no way to live. Now, I'm really into my hobbies and my life in general and worry about this taper so little. The pressure is off and there's no deadline. I feel better the lower I get on Sub, actually. It's an incredibly strong med, though, and you are wise to understand that. Let's finish both our tapers with fuller lives, healthier bodies, and happier brains. That is what is important....not how long it takes!!!!

laddertipper

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PostPosted: Mon Nov 26, 2012 5:38 pm 
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Hello! Been reading around for a bit before posting and I still see Romeo and Laddertripper....made me so happy to see you two!

I didn't know whether to start a new thread or continue my old one and decided to continue the old one as it IS part of my journey.

Reading from the beginning, you can see that I started the "Rapid Sub-Taper of All Sub-Tapers". I ended up in the "Rapid Sub-Taper Depression of All Sub-Taper Depressions". Looking back, the story is:

From March 2011 thru Sep 2011, I dropped from a 3.5 year 24 mgs/Sub daily to 2 mgs daily. I went so rapidly at first that I triggered major anxiety which spiraled into major depression. I did all this thinking I was having kidney/bladder probs that might require surgery. It was a stone, which did not require anything at all LOL But, my ordeal had begun. I posted here until, exhausted from depression, I did not even post anymore.

With my doctor's assistance, we kept inching up the Sub to where we found I was comfortable again and the depression was dealt with and that was 8 mgs. I have been on 8 mgs this year. The depression/anxiety is gone....don't remember how long it took but realized one day that it had passed. I went into bad "can't get out of bed...what is the meaning of life" depression. I made it through and let me say that the whole "sub, endorphins" thing is nothing to play with. You must give your brain ample time when tapering to "pick up the ball", so to speak. So, here I stand, end of year 2012, on 8 mgs/day and stabilized. I am ready to begin the taper again but this time (boy, have I EVER learned) it will be very, very slow. I don't care if it takes 2-3 years to taper....I will never, ever put myself through the hell of a rapid taper ever again.

Ladder, I read some posts that said you had finally made the jump! I am sooooooo happy for you! Ecstatic! You did it! And Romeo....I am just proud to see you still here and giving your words of wisdom and encouragement to those who need it.

My plan is to finish out the year and on Jan 1, drop to 6 mgs and just stay there until I am sure I am acclimated. No time frame this time....no hurry. From there, I plan to take it down 1 mg at a time until I hit 3 mgs...then I will start dropping in .25 increments. Again, with no hurry and no time frame. What I did to myself is scary and it is totally uncalled for. I had to learn a little life lesson called "patience" :)

Happy to just be at a point where I can start the taper again.

Happy Holidays to all :D


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 27, 2012 12:34 pm 
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Hey ClearAqua,

I'm glad you made it back. I'm sorry you had to go through what you did, but sometimes we have to endure some pain before we figure out our path forward. You sound like you have a good handle on things now and that's GREAT!!

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