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PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2014 11:07 pm 
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Howdy everybody. Glad to be posting, as ive been reading on this forum for quite some time...

a lil background info
Im 27 yr old male from the midwest and my opiate journey began at 18 with Oxy and Methadone. at 21 i began IV heroin use and it was pretty much a wrap from there. Multiple detoxes and treatment centers since then. Im proud to say I have been clean from heroin and everything else (except what you will read below :( ) since July 22. Im heavily involved in AA and work a program WITH a sponsor. I have cold turkey w/d in jail twice and at non medical detox facilities as well. So I know what its all about, I understand the seriousness of opiate withdrawal. And I am the brand of addict who is real soft about it, i dont take it well. I would watch my friends come off opiates and be sleeping on day 2 or 3, while it takes me 30 days to get a full nights rest

current situation

Unfortunately I made the decision to start using zubsolv in the middle of january, intra-nasal use at 2mg per day. I was getting it from my buddy and he was recently switched to suboxone films. So for 2 weeks I have been IVing 1mg in the morning and 1mg at night to remain well. The sad part is, I dont even think i got high when i started and i certainly dont now. so i went through all this work to get clean and now im just addicted to something physically for no reason. Basically, I just am too far along and have gained too much of my life back to fall back into this hiding and sneaking and track marks and double life. And the IV has really set off my decision to quit, I just have a LOT of guilt and shame, and am ready to continue my life substance free. I have a good career that is just beginning and i got hired there at 6 months sober! i really dont want to throw that away and have to be physically removed from society for detox. I know its gonna suck (as evidenced above) but the goal is to remain functional...

the taper

Now, i get these off the street from my friend, so i cant just get 10 or 20 8mg strips to do a super slow taper...ive done a lot of research and this is the best i can come up with:
Current - 2mg (1mg morning, 1mg night)
4 days- 1.5mg (0.75 morning, 0.75 night)
5 days- 1mg (0.5 morning, 0.5 night)
4 days - 0.75mg (half morning, half night)
4 days - 0.5mg (.25 morning, .25 night)
5 days -0.25mg (night only)
after those 5 days at .25mg, i will try to skip a day, then 2, then 3, and if i feel good at any point during that I will jump.

I'm no longer in contact with drug dealers, so i cant just go get a little detox kit from the streets of klonopin clonadeen vicodin whatever else. But i do have a stable job and money so i can go to a drug store and get immodium, vitamin B, whatever else...I am open to suggestions about that. Will certainly include exercise, as well, it has always helped me while in periods of abstinence .

AM I CRAZY? do i have any chance...i think i can do it, the horror stories around the internet just scare me alot, especially since my history tells me i dont handle withdrawal very well...but ive done it, and if i want it bad enough I believe I CAN DO IT..I am hoping that the relatively short amount of time i have been using bupe (5months) and the low dose (2mg/day at the most) will equal a feasible detoxification process. any help will be appreciated so much, thank you for reading my post! Also, I would be happy to journal my experience in order to provide hope to others

God Bless. Thanks! :D


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PostPosted: Sun May 18, 2014 12:12 am 
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Hi Xmarks! Wow, our stories/history sound very similar. I have also been on a taper, and since yesterday have taken .5mg; .25 morning and night. However, my Sub doctor is extremely generous with the comfort meds, so I have those to hep me. Your taper plan sounds pretty standard. I got myself a calendar and a pill box and write down the exact day, time, and amount that I dose. I also cut up the Subs and put them in the pill box according to the day. Also, I have a couple extra .25mg strips as backup JUST IN CASE I absolutely can't take it, or can't be sick for something, etc. Keeping precise track and sticking to a solid plan has worked better than any other time I've tried to taper, because I can closely monitor my dosage. I have kicked some MONSTER habits of methadone AND heroin before, and cold turkey in a jail cell, so if we can do that then we can do a successful suboxone taper!!! I forgot if your post said if you started a vitamin regimen or not, but I would start now. Not that they lessen the withdrawals, but allow your body to heal faster and start producing those endorphins again.

Right now, I just feel okay. I am on day 2 of .5, so I'm assuming that the next day or 2 is when the half-life starts catching up, so we'll see how it goes. I wish you all the best, and keep posting! I find it helps to communicate with others who are on the same journey!


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 10:14 am 
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right on everybody....?
Appreciate the support MAMA....I havent started a vitamin regimen or anything. I do have Mens ULTRA vitamin and fish oil pills. Along with L'arginine (for preworkout originally but maybe i could use it during my taper).

Just wanted to come through with an update (maybe that will stir some activity on this thread that is greatly lacking activity) So my connect/buddy/friend/guy whatever actually got switched back to zubsolv, which i found out last night when i met up with him! So I have FOUR 8mg zubsolv. I use the zub intra-nasally, which will be a change from IVing the sub for a couple weeks. So now my taper can expand a little bit or have little back up 0.25's, like MAMA was discussing above , because i have some extra mg's. My issue with the pills and snorting them, is that if it wasn't already hard enough to cut subox into little tiny slivers, now i gotta make all these pills into powder on my desk and try to split em up, and guess if my "breaks" were even and equal.

lets get it jumpin on this thread peoples!!!! :!: :shock: 8)


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 11:41 am 
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Ha! Don't feel bad; I'm pretty much writing to myself on my own thread as well! It's simply titled "Tapering", so maybe I should change the title to something more exciting! I have never even hear of zub...???? Is it basically just an intra-nasal form of Suboxone? How are you feeling so far? And ya--it's a pain in the ass trying to cut this stuff up evenly. I successfully went 4 full days at .5mg. Yesterday was day 4 at that dose and it wasn't easy. But I do have clonodine so it helps A LOT! I am attempting to go .25 today, but cut a .25 in half (.125) just in case it becomes too much. I want to be somewhat stable before I drop again. The worst symptoms I have now is headache, stomach turning, anxiety, and the emotions are starting to come up as well. I keep telling myself that this is nothing compared to what I've gone through before, and all these shitty feelings means that this poison is coming out of my body.

Keep me posted! It helps to share! I think the reason my last attempt at tapering was unsuccessful because I wasn't communicating with anyone, and not really keeping solid track of my doses. I wish you the best!


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 12:00 pm 
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I just wanted to quickly suggest starting a B-6 and L-Tyrosine, if you can. From what I've read, the healthier you are when you taper/jump, the quicker you recover (obviously, right?) Take care! I also wanted to mention that I've been living a "double life" as well, as far as program, and life in general. I didn't get completely out of control this last run either; it was a very small habit of painkillers for about 6 months, and on Subs for about 5 months. The secrets and guilt are what eat at me the most. Hang in there, and just know you are not alone, and that you're doing the right thing!

Take care!


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 2:38 pm 
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zubsolv is the latest form of buprenorphine, and from what i can tell they basically made it because some people couldnt stomach the delicious taste of orange disgusting-ness that is suboxone. The mg levels are a little lower but it absorbs much more effectively so they have like a 5.7mg that competes directly with the 8mg suboxone. and i can tell you that INDEED IT IS the same potency. I actually like. But it is definitely not meant for intra-nasal, its a sub-lingual pill, but you cant IV it. So being the good ol fashioned drug addict that I am, i prefer to snort rather let it sit under my tongue.

Anyways, I just got my zub's last night. Im gonna need to take some time to figure out the dosing schedule, because typically I just do a little line that i would guess is about 0.5mg in the morning and then another 0.5 before bed. I am feeling pretty awful right now though (not the worst ever obviously, i mean im functioning sitting here at work, doing what i gotta do but i am thinking about that next dose ALOT) and its just because today is the first day of switching from IV suboxone for about 2 weeks. So I'm hanging in there.

My dose is so low with this zubsolv, my taper will basically be to consciously do smaller piles throughout a few weeks and just GO FOR IT and jump. But i think it would be alot better if i actually measured out some piles of powder (to the best of my ability and judgement)...so we'll see where i go. I will keep you updated.

heres a link about zubsolv FYI http://www.orexo.com/en/Products/Zubsol ... ependence/


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PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 6:16 pm 
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Hello Xmarks!
Your taper plan looks reasonable to me; I am also tapering and am on day 4 at around .5 to .75.
I've found the longer I can wait between doses, the better I can tolerate the drop. Listening to music, exercising, and baths also are helping, plus just keeping your mind busy and positive. I was taking 12mg for 8 years!!! Now almost to the finish line. This forum has been helpful to me....even if no one were reading my posts, I feel better after writing (but the feed back does help!)
Welcome to the club :D
rca


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