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 Post subject: 560 mg Oxy to Suboxone
PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:22 pm 
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My induction is tomorrow morning at 9am. I took my last oxy dose at 3pm today, 18 hrs before induction. Then (too late) I read Subox Doc's article on avoiding W/D's upon induction. Basically, he said that with a 600mg oxy habit, I would need to be clean for 3 days to avoid precipitated w/d's. Well, I already paif $540.00 to the doc, flushed $400 worth of my last oxys, and have set asside 5 days out of my life to get on the Subox. I am very scared. I have cold turkeyed this dose before. It took 5+ days of hell. But, that wasn't the worst of it. I managed to stay clean for 90 days, until the PAWS got the better of me. I just didn't have any energy and needed to work. The PAWS was the worst of it.

I am scared that the precipitated withdrawel will be rough. SuboxDoc did say that, while the W/D's will be extreme, they will be shorter lived than without the Subox. Had I known this info, I would have tried to reduce my dosage prior to setting up the appt. I can take the pain, the RLS, the ibby jibbies...but the anxiety is the real hell for me. I'm hoping my doc who's doing the induction can give me a script for clonidine. I've heard it helps.

My wife and I are in a hotel...my preffered place to kick. We live on a boat and I can't have my neighbors seeing me in this kind of condition. If anyone has any experience with being on my Oxy dosage and inducting, I would love to hear it. Part of me wants to blow the whole thing off, go spend a grand on more Oxys, and try to taper to a lower dose before induction. I will not do this. I owe it to my wife and myself to get this done.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2011 11:09 pm 
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Hi and welcome! I had tapered down to around 150mg of oxy before induction but only because that's all I had left. Rather than a time limit you need to be in mild to moderate withdrawl. For most people around 24 hours is enough. I have never read Dr. J's induction article and didn't know he suggested people on 600mg of oxy abstain for 3 days prior to induction. To me this seems like a long time. How long from your last oxy does it take for you to begin withdrawing?

Your Dr is going to use something called the cows scale to make sure you are ready for induction, if you are not in withdrawl they may have you wait longer and then induce you. My Dr didn't induce me in his office but most do, if your Dr gives you a script you could wait longer before taking the 1st sub. Drs also usually have you take a small amount and wait like 30 min to see how it affects you. Did your Dr tell you when to take your last oxy? If you are not in mild to moderate withdrawl at the time of your appointment I would discuss it with your Dr, there is no reason you should have to suffer thru precipatated withdrawl. I hope everything goes well for you, sub is truly a life saver so don't give up this opportunity. Congratulations on getting your life back!


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 12:52 am 
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I agree w/ Breezy_Ann,
Yes just please, for your own sake, be in active withdrawl (even if just the beginnings of active withdrawl) to avoid being immediately thrown into precipitated withdrawl from being inducted too soon. I hear it is a violent 5-8 hrs of the worst withdrawl imaginable. That is the most awful place to be, because once on suboxone, its not like you can go get a few oxys to help you thru. The naloxone in suboxone will block any other opiates effect. You would be stuck at that point. Hopefully your doctor will use the COWS to evaluate you before induction. So try not to embelish your symptoms it will only make it so much worse for you. Hopefully you can reschedule for 24 hrs or more after your last dose of oxy. I hope you will make it. You ARE doing the right thing for yourself and your family. I wish you much luck and strength to ger er done...YOU CAN DO IT! Blessings,
-sweet16


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:26 am 
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Hi craigo and welcome. First off, congrats on deciding to start sub treatment. As for what Dr. Junig is saying, just remember, he's making generalizations and guidelines. Your doctor will use the COWS (Clinical Opiate Withdrawal Scale*) and YOU as an individual to induce you accordingly.

And like was said, your doc may induce you in the office or have you do it yourself at home. Hopefully it will take place in the office (especially considering what you paid!).

Good luck with your appointment and let us know how it goes. Below is link to the COWS.




*http://www.naabt.org/documents/cows_induction_flow_sheet.pdf

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-As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 9:16 am 
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Craig.. How are you doing?

Hopefully well. Probably not well enough for posting...

I hope everything was successful! :D

Don't get paranoid! Screw everyone else (except those you love) they will not help. So called friends want to see others suffer so they feel better about themselves.

Stay strong, Stay on Sub!

:D

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 Post subject: Made It!!!
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 10:56 am 
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OK. I'm back...and feeling great. Took 4mgs right on schedule 18 hrs after last dose of Oxy. I didn't feel better ot worse right away. That was at 9am. At noon the muscle spasms stopped. By 3pm I looked at my wife and said I actually feel better.

Today is Sunday, 5 days after induction. I'm on 12 mgs/day and haven't felt this alive in years. All the good things are coming back so fast: Music, Sex, Cannon Balling off the back of the boat fully clothed.

This drug is amazing. My doc told me not even to think about how long I'll be on it..."we'll cross that bridge" thing.

Thanks to all who responded and read my post. I think I'll stick around here a bit.

Craig


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 10:59 am 
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Thanks for the update! I'm happy to hear your induction went well and you're pleased with your treatment. Do stick around - I think you'll find the people here very supportive. See you around the forum!

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-As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 11:58 am 
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I am so glad sub is working so well for you! Like Hat said, please do stick around. There is so much info and support here, I think you will find it very beneficial to your recovery as I have. Congrats on taking your life back!


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 1:07 pm 
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Congrats Craigo2! Theres nothing better than feeling better and being able to get on with your life.


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 Post subject: CONGRATS CRAIGO!!
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 1:45 pm 
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Craigo,

Im SO HAPPY for ya man! It sends chills down my spine, reading about your experience inducing onto Sub!

Isn't it an AMAZING feeling......BEING OUT OF WITHDRAWL, AND NOT OBSESSING OVER THAT SHIT ANYMORE?!!

I hafta tell ya, I burst into tears.....the first morning I woke up and WASN'T in withdrawl, due to Suboxone.

Its such a relief, to finally quiet that monster inside. You know, you get high on your DOC for so long. And then at the end you're using just to "be well". Its so comforting just to feel NORMAL again! This is the blessing of Suboxone/Subutex!!

I hope you continue to participate on the forum.

You'll find a wealth of useful information here. If you have a chance, check out Dr. Junig's blog and his videos.

This forum has been a big part of my recovery. Im sure you'll find the support here as valuable as I have.

Good Luck!


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 2:53 pm 
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I also wanted to add that I completely agree with your Dr. There is no reason to worry about how or when you will come off sub, there's a lot of people that have no interest in getting off it ever. Take your time, focus on your life and if there comes a day where you feel like you are ready to get off then you can you decide about your taper.

Sub is amazing because it allows you to work on your recovery without all that added stress about tapering or suffering thru withdrawls. You should be very proud of your self! You and your family have a life time of happiness ahead of you!


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 12:35 am 
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Thanks all for the kind words and support.

I'm calling Doc tomorrow to see about upping my dose from 12mg to 16mg. I've been feeling pretty good, but a bit of a rollar coaster thing is going on with my energy level. I've been taking 8mg at 6am and 4mg at 6pm. Around 2pm I start feeling shitty until my 6pm dose. Today, I added a 4mg dose at 2pm and moved evening dose to 9pm. The day went perfect. I hope I'm not building tolerance already. Does sub work like other opiates in the tolerance regard? Oh well, I'll talk to doc tomorrow. My days of self medicating are over. I'll go with whatever he says. May I ask what doses people are on???


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 8:06 am 
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I've been on sub for coming up on 3 years and I also take it for pain. I take 16+ mg per day. Just FYI. Remember - you want the dose that quite easily addresses ALL of your withdrawals AND cravings. Good luck.

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-As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everyone is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

-I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you understand.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 9:57 pm 
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Thanks, Hat. The main reason I relapsed last time was PAWS, in particular the ultra low energy side. I had a slew of work coming in (own a business), and was scared I couldn't get it all done at my energy level. I thought about it for weeks before I went down and got some Oxys. This is my main fear and whole reason I chose Sub. So far, it really helps the energy level. I have the 40-something aches and pains, but nothing I can't cope with. I told the doc today about my energy level being better on 16 mgs and he said go for it then. It's so nice not sneaking around and lying about what drugs I'm taking. I, for one, have no shame about taking Suboxone. Other drugs have landed me in prison for 3 years...twice! If this drug can keep me marching forward, and help me stay a positive force in the Universe...so be it. I'll take it as long as I have to.

It really is a wonderful drug. I can feel the pressures of life...but not too overwhelming. On Oxy, what pressure? I feel very clear, yet there is a feeling of ease and content...feelings I rarely experience sober. I have no desire to drink...something that usually happens when I'm not taking pain pills. I do smoke some pot at night. This is interesting, as well. Often when I'm not on any other drugs, smoking pot causes me some anxiety at first. On Sub, there is no anxiety. I have been on one drug or another for 28 years. I was freebasing coke at 16 years old, and did crank through my twenties. My thirties were the boozing years. At 40 I discovered pain meds. I may be "that guy" who will always be on something. I've been to every 12 step, therapy, rehab, etc...This is the first time I've seen a shrink and fought drugs with drugs. I'm a drug guy...why didn't I think of this sooner?

This forum is great. I read it all the time for encouragement. What a strong and beautiful group of people. Thank you all so much for your honest postings.

Craig


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