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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2013 10:02 pm 
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Greetings-

Started taking Oxycodone orally about 6 months ago. Started out only on the weekends with 15 mg, and finally lastly progressed to 60 mg for a a few consecutive days doing 30 mg in the day and another 30 mg in the evening. I then ran out, and my few sources I had ran out. I was starting a new job and thought that maybe working and being busy all day then coming home tired and passing out would help the time pass to kick them for a little. Well, unfortunately I thought wrong. I had never had bad withdraw in the past 6 months when I had stopped or ran out of pills (other than some very annoying chills) which could range anywhere from 2-6 days. But this last Monday, only about 14 hours after taking 60 mg of Oxy I began WD already. By the time I was leaving working I already had sent out a few texts hoping to get more, and maybe just kick the following weekend pr wean myself down somehow. I was able to only get one single 30 mg pill. I did not get high in any way, just took the edge of the wd and allowed me to sleep and prepare mentally for week ahead of work. The next day in the already freezing training class at my new job was deja vu except slightly worse. I made it through the day and came home, took a hot bath and tried to sleep. By morning I had gone through most wd symptoms - chills, sweating, slight fever, cramping restless legs, vomiting, depression, crying etc. I had no other choice but to call out of work (didn't really like the new job all too much anyway :P) Through this whole time I had been glued to my laptop searching forums on "home remedies for opiate wd" and after weighing my choices of crazy remedies I don't have the ingredients for vs getting more drugs (which may not be an option), vs cold turkey - I decided to try Suboxone. Freezing to death in 2 jackets and under a blanket I luckily found a Dr. who could see me immediately that day by searching "suboxone doctors in CITY". During the visit he gave me 1mg of a 2mg Suboxone Sublingual strip and waited about an hour. I can honestly say I wasn't feeling too much better by then, so he had me take the rest and sent me home with a script for 14 8mg Suboxone strips and advised to cut them in 2 and take 3 4mg strips a day. About an hour after being home, (2 hours from 1mg and 1 hour from another 1 mg) 90% of my wd symptoms were gone and I felt SO GOOD especially in contrast to how I was feeling. I filled my script and took another 4mg later in the evening (which he said Icould do) when I felt my legs starting to ache again. Thursday I woke up nauseous and threw up throughout the day but felt good overall spreading the 4mg to about 6 hours in between. Friday I felt good, taking 3 spread out again. Today I woke up feeling week and threw up once. I am currently taking my 2nd 4mg.

My plan is to stop taking the suboxone asap... Unfortunately, I didn't learn of the suboxone wd risks till after I had taken it. I personally think 12 mg a day may be too much since this drug has such a strong half life. I am going to see my dr again this coming wednesday and see what kind of tapering down plans he has to offer. I would hate to just have to wd from this and almost be in the same boat as I was before, except possibly even broker? Do you think Im past the wd of oxycodone now, so should start weaning off the soboxone? I already feel sick in themornings when I wake up and better when I take the suboxone... ?


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 1:49 am 
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In my opinion I dont think suboxone should have been the route you took, only being addicted 6 months and only making 1 previous attemp to stop using but thats just my opinion. 12mg may even be raising your opiate tolerance honestly but I cant say for sure. Many of us on suboxone chose suboxone because we had tried numerous times to get clean and never could, no matter what and many of us were so bad with our addictions we were either on the verge of losing everything or already had. It is not to soon to start tapering off the subs but you have to do it right and stick to it. This is one of the main reasons I believe anyone considering going on a medication should learn everything there is to know about it before hand. If you read around the forum you can find out alot of info. Pain pill withdrawal (the physical symptoms) usually last around 4-7 days and since you were only dependent for about 6 months, I dont think you will have much of an issue with PAWS, some people on subs find it fairly easy to get off of with the right taper plan and others suffer withdrawals for 30-60 days, sometimes they struggle longer.. theres no way to tell how easy or hard it will be for you because it obviously depends on alot of things.. not everyones body is the same. PLEASE read around the forum and educate yourself as much as possible.. Any other questions, feel free to ask. Good luck with everything and I hope everything works out for you.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 12:02 am 
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The reason you are throwing up is because Suboxone is WAY too strong for the habit you are coming off of. If I were you I would stop taking it immediately. It will leave your body slowly over the next nine days or so. Yes, you may feel shitty, but if you continue you will have an opiate tolerance much higher than what you began with and will have to taper and detox. Seriously. Just stop now.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 11:31 am 
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Hey Zy! I agree with the others. If you continue Suboxone, especially at the kind of doses you're taking now, you'll wind up with an opiate tolerance and physical dependence much more severe than where you were at 30-60mg of oxycodone a day.
There is another consideration, however. That is, the degree of obsession or psychological dependence you already have in place. That is something that is harder to measure than the physical side of addiction. And it is something that tends to become worse over time, and with each attempt to quit, in my opinion. So, for some people with that severe obsession or multiple failed attempts to quit, even if they don't take all that high of dose of opiate, Sub might be the way to go.
Anyway, I agree that you're nausea/vomiting is likely due to your Sub dose being way too high for you. If I were you, I'd stop now. You've got enough Sub in your system already that you should not feel any true withdrawals for a good two to three days. If at all possible, I'd ride it out and see if and when it hits. It may not....you may have sort of "bridged" the oxy withdrawals with the Sub. And the Sub may clear your system gradually enough that you don't suffer at all. That's obviously the best case scenario.
Other than that, if you do somehow get slammed with withdrawals that you cannot handle, I implore you to take only a very tiny piece of Sub, like 1mg or less, wait an hour and I think you'll see that a little bit of Sub can go a long way!
Good luck. Please let us know what happens.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 7:29 pm 
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Thank you guys for your responses. I guess I should of added that I am generally a "pukey" person. Almost every time I take any type of opiate I throw up, regardless of the amount or how many consecutive days I have been using it. It may not of been fair to list it as a symptom, since it something I seem to experience on or off the substance. Even in my year of drinking Jager bombs,I found myself gagging and almost throwing up every morning after brushing my teeth. Luckilly, I am getting some blood work done per my Sub doctors request to make sure I dont have anything internally going on.

It also may help to add that starting at age 13 I began experimenting with any drug I could find. Pot, shrooms, acid, ecstacy, cocaine, meth, and herion. I recreationally used untill I was 20 years old... and then my fiance overdosed on prescription drugs he was given by his doctor (they gave him a lethal mix - oxycodone, xanax, and somas... the urgent care has since been shut down) My life was over... I spiraled deep into depression/suicidal attempts and addiction. I never allowed myself to grieve properly since I was trying to kill all feelings with daily herion IV use and then onto smoking, snorting and shooting meth. I think I was able to kick heroin at times by switching directly to meth. This abuse lasted for about 3 years following his death. I lost EVERYTHING and I mean everything I had to my name (tweeker associates stole my car, keys, and cleaned out my storage unit) I found myself homeless on the streets, sleeping by sides of building with tarp and sleeping blanket, cooking circle k taquitos by fire with fellow senior homeless. I slipped into deep psychosis and luckilly with time, healing, and help from Depakote, Haldol, and cogentin eventually regained sanity.

From the time I was 16 till around 4 years ago I have been in institutions off and on. I once wrote down all the places on a sheet a paper and it filled the entire front of the lined paper to about half way down the back, I believe it may have added up to 1.5 - 2 years of my 28 years on this planet. Anywhere from a 3 month boot camp behavioral program in middle of nowhere utah, to a state of the art 30 day beach front rehab facility in laguana beach, to a religious 18 month in house program, to 5 day mental intake state run programs, 7 day detox clinics, 45 day in az tent city... you name it, ive probably been there.

Luckilly, after my last program which was the 18 month religious program, I stayed clean for 4 years untill this last dance with oxycodone that started about 6 months ago. Like I stated, I did try out drinking and smoked a little pot here and there, but have burnt out on both. I know those other programs did not work because I was not ready for them to work, most programs I was forced to go to in one way or another, or they were just too soon after the death. There is no time limit on greiving, and for me it honestly took YEARS to even want to live again. Yesterday, in fact was the 8 year anniversary of his passing. I found it easy to finally say goodbybe to all those other drugs because I felt like I had tried them out to their fullest extent and could tell myself, been there done that. Since rehab I have made so much progress in my life, maintaining and building relationships with family friends, and a boyfriend of 3 years, getting and holding a great job for multiple years, progressing from living at home to an apartment to a great 3 bedroom rental house, etc etc etc all the things a "normal typical person" would do.

I obviously left all this out in my original post as well as not sharing with my new suboxone doctor : / I feel like my past history with drugs was a whole different ball game compared to this last stent with oxycodone. However, it may be helpful to know that I know addiction very well as well as treatment techniques etc. I knew it was dangerous to play with oxy from the start and knew no one could make me stop, only i had the power to do so. I think the oxys helped me stop drinking and i used them in place of jager for my recreational days. I dont have much mental addiction to them I just needed SOMETHING to help me get thru the physical WD. I have had to cold turkey IV herion wd in the past, locked up among the mentally insane as a danger to self, merely a month after his death, NO MEDICATION, wanting to die , and obviously made it through. I just wanted to see if there was an easier way out there, and that why I chose Suboxone. It was that or cold turkey, or 7 day detox in a place ive actually gone to 2 times before.

I have only been taking 4-8 mg a day. I honestly feel great (not high) but normal. I see my doctor again Wed morning and am going to see what he recommends to ween down and stop. I have 7 8mg left and really dont want to spend anymore money. I have a feeling my doctor will recommend me to stay on them as long as possible because thats more money in his pocket. I REALLY hope in the rush of filling out the paper work didnt sign myself up to agree to see him and pay him for x amount of months. I am bringing my boyfriend with me for support to make sure I can get out of it. Has anyone heard of the federal suboxone program forcing you to be enrolled for certain amount of time? I know when I initially spoke to him I stated I probably only want about a weeks worth to just get through the wd's and he said "oh sure, we could talk about it, or who knows? Maybe you will come back in a week and love it and want to stay on longer..." My boyfriend also looked him up online while I was at the appointment and found he has a past with his md license on the line for a personal relapse and a case with underage boys in a at risk youth center he worked for.... : /My luck! Out of the 30 I called that morning in desperation the one who picks up and can see me and medicate that day.

Well, I will let you guys know more after this Wednesday. I just thought sharing my past might help you better gauge me and not just see me as a vanilla housewife who accidentally got hooked on her pain meds. Everyone's case is unique... I just think the biggest factor in mine is not wanting to face WD cold turkey, whether it be from oxy or suboxone


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Dr. Jeffrey Junig, M.D., Ph.D.

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